What about CO2 rifles?

Elkbooger

Elkbooger

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What about CO2 rifles?

Hi Folks, another newb to air (bedsides a Diana 30 years ago).
Looking for advice on cottage plinking with my 14-year-old and perhaps small game in a pinch. (I live in Ottawa so I can’t fire a fart without getting arrested and the family cottage isn’t .22 appropriate).
I’ve read many articles in the forum, all are great and helping to narrow things down but no one has mentioned CO2 rifles. Are they any good?
My logic so far is
Springer = a new type of stance my kid doesn’t really need to learn – not to mention frustrating and not very portable. He’s plenty good with our Marlin model 60 and has fired several handguns.
PCP = more then I want to invest for what will probably amount to a few hundred rounds a year. (99% summer)
Pump = well I’m far too lazy for that!
Nitro piston = WTF? Same recoil as springer?
====CO2 seems to be the beez knees???

I’m also thinking .22 if below 500fps. I have an RPAL but if I go that route – which is tempting - he can’t go off on his own.
Oh and budget say $250 - $350.

Thoughts oh learned CGN’ers?
SillyMike, care to weigh in?

THX!
EB.
 
Elkbooger said:
What about CO2 rifles?

Hi Folks, another newb to air (bedsides a Diana 30 years ago).
Looking for advice on cottage plinking with my 14-year-old and perhaps small game in a pinch. (I live in Ottawa so I can’t fire a fart without getting arrested and the family cottage isn’t .22 appropriate).
I’ve read many articles in the forum, all are great and helping to narrow things down but no one has mentioned CO2 rifles. Are they any good?
My logic so far is
Springer = a new type of stance my kid doesn’t really need to learn – not to mention frustrating and not very portable. He’s plenty good with our Marlin model 60 and has fired several handguns.
PCP = more then I want to invest for what will probably amount to a few hundred rounds a year. (99% summer)
Pump = well I’m far too lazy for that!
Nitro piston = WTF? Same recoil as springer?
====CO2 seems to be the beez knees???

I’m also thinking .22 if below 500fps. I have an RPAL but if I go that route – which is tempting - he can’t go off on his own.
Oh and budget say $250 - $350.

Thoughts oh learned CGN’ers?
SillyMike, care to weigh in?

THX!
EB.
Click to expand...

I think the 12g CO2 canisters are more for pistols and what not. I am not sure how well the 88g canister have caught on over the years. I sold a CO2 rifle a couple of weeks ago (Gamo Extreme CO2) and only have my Hammerli (Umarex) Air Magnum 850 left (bolt action .22 pellet 8 shot repeater, with 88g CO2 power plant).

The biggest advantage is obviously noise level. No cocking effort needed. For accuracy, compared to a springer, there's no contest - in my view, Springers win hands down if you are target shooting for accuracy. People who have had these 88g CO2 air rifles over the years have used them for discreet pest control in many cases.

I don't recall too many 88 gram CO2 powered rifles that were under 500 fps - maybe they exist, but I don't recall any.

Only downside - in the wintertime the velocity takes a significant hit outdoors.

I also noticed (back then when I was big into air rifles) that any CO2 air rifle didn't have a long shelf life - most got discontinued within a couple of years.

Only problem with PAL rated air rifles, CO2 or not, is that they are under the legal parameters as any other firearm - so technically anywhere you can't discharge a .22, you can't (legally) discharge the PAL-level air rifle.

I know the scope of your post is CO2 air rifles under 500 fps, but there are some decent beginner springers out there that don't have significant cocking effort and take .22 pellets, and are reasonably priced - like the Crosman Phantom.
 
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thegazelle said:
I think the 12g CO2 canisters are more for pistols and what not. I am not sure how well the 88g canister have caught on over the years. I sold a CO2 rifle a couple of weeks ago (Gamo Extreme CO2) and only have my Hammerli (Umarex) Air Magnum 850 left (bolt action .22 pellet 8 shot repeater, with 88g CO2 power plant).

The biggest advantage is obviously noise level. No cocking effort needed. For accuracy, compared to a springer, there's no contest - in my view, Springers win hands down if you are target shooting for accuracy. People who have had these 88g CO2 air rifles over the years have used them for discreet pest control in many cases.

I don't recall too many 88 gram CO2 powered rifles that were under 500 fps - maybe they exist, but I don't recall any.

Only downside - in the wintertime the velocity takes a significant hit outdoors.

I also noticed (back then when I was big into air rifles) that any CO2 air rifle didn't have a long shelf life - most got discontinued within a couple of years.

Only problem with PAL rated air rifles, CO2 or not, is that they are under the legal parameters as any other firearm - so technically anywhere you can't discharge a .22, you can't (legally) discharge the PAL-level air rifle.

I know the scope of your post is CO2 air rifles under 500 fps, but there are some decent beginner springers out there that don't have significant cocking effort and take .22 pellets, and are reasonably priced - like the Crosman Phantom.
Click to expand...

Thanks for that, I didn't even see the 88 gram tanks. I found a few that use multiple 12g. That Gammo looked like fun. Guess I'll have another look at the springers.
And re Pal level, you can't even fire under 500 fps in Ottawa area...
 
C02 is fine for warm conditions but no good in the cold, I have a QB78D as well as a few carbines based on Crosman 22xx. I found good source for C02 carts https://icotrading.ca/collections/co2. The 88 gram s are too expensive.
My favourite these days is my 2250 but I have invested in upgrades such as a steel breech to mount a scope.
 
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My experience...

C02 air rifles like my Crosman Full Auto = TONS of fun, but $$$ for C02 cartridges & the cold affects them.

PCP air rifles like my Webley Raider = TONS of fun, but takes time to pump it up & you get about 30 shots.

Which leaves springer or piston air rifles. That's where I would go if I were you...

Cheers
Jay
 
I picked up the crossman phantom springer in .22. Under 200 when I bought it. Really, there is no need for a new stance. It's not that loud either. The phantom has good size to it as well, feels like a regular sized rifle. I have found it very accurate after a little bit of sight adjustment.
 
memaquay said:
I picked up the crossman phantom springer in .22. Under 200 when I bought it. Really, there is no need for a new stance. It's not that loud either. The phantom has good size to it as well, feels like a regular sized rifle. I have found it very accurate after a little bit of sight adjustment.
Click to expand...

The only thing I don't like about the Phantom (at least mine anyway) is that it is one of the few break barrels that won't break unless I smack the barrel hard. It was like this since day one - many of my other air rifles broke with much less force, and sometimes with no hitting at all and just a snapping motion. This one I always had to give it a whack with my palm to break it.
 
In my experience, .22 is underpowered at sub 500 velocities, compared to .177 you get a loopy trajectory and mediocre penetration at a distance.

In a full power airgun I'll take .22 hands down, but its disappointing otherwise.
 
The crosman 2260, although no longer made, is a decent PAL rated co2 rifle. Its similar functionally to a 2240 but it is non restricted over 500fps with a PAL. You can make it work off a paintball tank too if you are willing to tinker.
 
Thanks all!
In the end I went for a Ruger Air Hawk springer at 490 fps. (I believe it's a Diana clone)
Great price at D&L, hard to say no...
Apparently if I want to take it up to "1200 fps", it's just a spring replacement.
Pop cans beware!!!!!!
 
Enjoy the Ruger Air Hawk!
- No experience with that rifle, but plenty of good reviews.
Personally, I don't think I'd want to try to push the Air Hawk to 1200fps... unless you are just looking for bragging rights.

The only CO2 air rifle that I can think of that would have remotely fit the bill, would be a used Tau-200... But good luck finding one.
- Bulk refill
- Accurate

I used to play outside with a TAU7, and it didn't seem too affected by temp. as long as it was above freezing, and I've taken the PCP out to about -10c to no ill effect... colder than that, and I have a hard time handling the pellets :p

Legal disclaimer
- Check the small game hunting rules and regulation. I know in Qc they have to be PAL rated, and in Ontario (even though there are no minimum power limit) but "Hunting carelessly" is an offense... as in, you are caught only wounding animals.


=-=-= A little off topic =-=-=

For the folks in Ontario.
- Can a 14yo "legally" be left alone with a airgun?
- What's your minimum age for a hunting license?
 
Air guns - I assume we mean non-PAL air rifles and air pistols...the government website says the guidelines are managed on a provincial or municipal level - may need to check with local authorities in terms of a 14yo left alone with one. The Ontario govt. website below is not specific on it.

https://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/en/firearms/specific-types-firearms#ag

For me I have always supervised my child with any non-PAL air rifle in the bush, etc.

In Ontario a child has to be 16-years-old to hunt, or 15-years-old with written parental permission.

https://www.ontario.ca/page/hunting...an Ontario-recognized equivalent accrediation)

Ontario also has a junior hunting license program for 12-14 year olds:

https://www.ontario.ca/document/ont...-summary/hunter-apprenticeship-safety-program
 
Buy a sub 500 fps springer.
A kid will want to shoot all day and co2 will cost you a fortune. A tin of pellets is peanuts.
Single shots are safer for a new shooter.
A low velocity means less chance of expensive collateral damage from an ill placed shot.
The sub 500 fps springer is also easy for a smaller or weaker shooter to ####.
A springer’s velocity is more consistent than a co2 unit as there is no pressure drop off. This is especially noticed in cold weather.
If the shooter becomes proficient and wants to upgrade, your initial investment was low so no big deal.
Likewise if they get bored of shooting and don’t use it much.
 
The only drawback with co2 is they arent good in the cold like below 10c. I would stay away from the 88s too expensive.
QB78s need a lot of cleanup and some tuning to make them nice so if your not into that then avoid them. There should be some good ones out there, take a look at the umarex fusion2 at airgun source they have below 500 version.
 
Elkbooger said:
What about CO2 rifles?

Hi Folks, another newb to air (bedsides a Diana 30 years ago).
Looking for advice on cottage plinking with my 14-year-old and perhaps small game in a pinch. (I live in Ottawa so I can’t fire a fart without getting arrested and the family cottage isn’t .22 appropriate).
I’ve read many articles in the forum, all are great and helping to narrow things down but no one has mentioned CO2 rifles. Are they any good?
My logic so far is
Springer = a new type of stance my kid doesn’t really need to learn – not to mention frustrating and not very portable. He’s plenty good with our Marlin model 60 and has fired several handguns.
PCP = more then I want to invest for what will probably amount to a few hundred rounds a year. (99% summer)
Pump = well I’m far too lazy for that!
Nitro piston = WTF? Same recoil as springer?
====CO2 seems to be the beez knees???

I’m also thinking .22 if below 500fps. I have an RPAL but if I go that route – which is tempting - he can’t go off on his own.
Oh and budget say $250 - $350.

Thoughts oh learned CGN’ers?
SillyMike, care to weigh in?

THX!
EB.
Click to expand...

kids or adult will lose interest in no time with a crappy gun and no blame to them
get Diana 34 or Diana 240
or HW30 or HW50
CO2 it is yesterday, if you want PCP get HW100 or Hammerly AR20
 
I can go shooting my little collection springers at our indoor range evening - as many shots as I care to - limited only by the power of my arm.

Even after maybe a couple of hundred shots, the velocity is the same as the first one was, and part from the pellets, it has cost me a big fat zero.

Meanwhile the Co2 stuff has been and gone, leaving a little pile of 12g cartridges behind. Me, I'm leaving nothing at all when I've done shooting.
 
I've got the Ruger Blackhawk -490NR and a Crosman Vantage Nitro-piston PAL, both in .177. I'm watching for .22 barrels for them. The Blackhawk is the Synth version of the Airhawk and is accurate for short range but won't kill a rat at 10ft (used to live near Hfx docks). They both are accurate short range but I believe the .177 loses accuracy over 25 yds or so, even with 9g pellets. They're rifled bore but still under $150 (bought on sale) so I didn't expect a lot and didn't get it :rolleyes: The Blackhawk does have the power to get a pigeon though, so some use when the food lines get long :eek:
 
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