necking up 300 h and h brass to 375?

scottteddy

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I know people neck down 375 h&h brass to 300 h&h , just wondering if the opposite is safe? a friend has some 300 hh new hornady brass and I wanted to buy it off him to size up, I actually lubed up a 30-06 brass and carefully ran it partially in my 375 die just to see if the neck would expand and it did with out splitting , may have grown long a bit. Any insite on this? I have sized up 30-06 to 338-06 and sized down 7mm to 257 weatherby plenty of times for my other guns and used with great success but this is a bigger "jump" up in size.

appreciate any input
 
No experience with that directly, but can say that the oval expander in Hornady "Custom Grade" die set takes 8x57 necks (.321-.323") up to 9.3x57 (.364-.366") with not a lot of fuss. Might want to consider doing in two stages - sounds like you have a 338 of some type - is a Plan B to run that expander ball so is out towards bottom of the die - set die higher in press, and run that 338 expander into and out of mouth of the 300 case - without sizing the outside surface. Then, re-size to .375 as a second step. I had no troubles going .323" up to .366" - I actually carried on with 41 Magnum expander to make nearly straight wall from 8x57 - I had no split necks with brand new PPU brass. If you get split necks, might have to consider to anneal the necks along the way??

No doubt adequate lube, especially inside the neck, is going to help.

I use an RCBS Rockchucker press these days - compound leverage - so likely lots of leverage in there. A long time ago, I was able to use a lighter RCBS JR press - single leverage - RCBS FL dies, and was able to force previously fired IVI 7.62 NATO fully into and then out of 243 Win FL dies - in one step - trimmed to length and loaded them - never did anneal them - likely have 20 or 30 of those left. I did use a snipe on the JR press handle, and bent the handle, so that loading was definitely all that little press could take. I do not recall quantity - likely more than 50; likely less than 100.

Some time ago I was looking at SAAMI cartridge drawings for the Winchester 1950's/1960's belted "magnums" - was as if all were formed from same base stock - 264 Win Mag, 338 Win Mag, 458 Win Mag - as I recall, the neck walls got progressively thinner in the specs, as the neck diameter increased. Never did look at the H&H - might be similar - you would want to look that up - I suspect that the 375 H&H might call out a thinner neck wall than a 300 H&H - to be expected, if both drawn from the same base stock?

EDIT - ANSI/SAAMI Z299.4 - 2015 - does not appear to list neck wall thickness of cartridge specifically. OD on neck for 375 H&H cartridge is .402"; OD on neck for 300 H&H is .338" - so, that is .064 difference on OD of necks with bullets seated. Bullets are .375" minus .308" =.067" difference, so 375 H&H must have slightly thinner neck wall than does the 300 H&H? I notice the 375 H&H has steeper shoulder angle - so that shoulder has to get moved forward to fully form to chamber, if starting from 300 H&H cases?
 
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A second thought - since the H&H are belted cases - should be possible to load up 10 or 12 grains of Unique or similar, fill the rest of the 300 H&H case with Cream of Wheat, cap with square of TP or soap or hot glue - then chamber in 375 H&H and fire straight up - will likely fire form that into 375 H&H, or at least almost all the way. Likely needs a full power reload with a bullet to get full, final forming, but likely so does the first sequence of trying to expand the neck diameter with dies - to move that shoulder forward. Myself and others have done this COW thing to fire form 300 Win Mag and 7mm Rem Mag cases into 458 Win Mag - gets at least good enough to get the expander ball in there for the first reloading.
 
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It works perfectly fine. I would go in stages though, maybe 8mm or 338 then 358 or 366 then 375. I've done it in one pass but the neck is usually longer on one side/crooked you know, needs to be trimmed to be squared up. I've got brass head stamped 30-06 but with necks from 6mm, 257, 6.5, 277, 280, 8mm, 338, 358, 366 and 375.
 
I read the COW treatment needs to be fired straight up in the air for more uniform brass. The guy was making 38-55 from 30-30 and discovered this trick.
 
I've never like wasting primers shooting cream of wheat into mid air. Sitting at the press costs nothing but time. Primers are pricey now if you can find them and so is powder, I like to use them to push bullets.
 
I have no trouble resizing 30-06 to 9.3X62. Have been doing so for way more than thirty years, and would expect to be able to do the same with 300 H&H to 375 H&H.

Most important thing is to use full power loads for the first firing, NOT reduced loads. This gives you fully-formed brass.

Ted
 
I have no trouble resizing 30-06 to 9.3X62. Have been doing so for way more than thirty years, and would expect to be able to do the same with 300 H&H to 375 H&H.

Most important thing is to use full power loads for the first firing, NOT reduced loads. This gives you fully-formed brass.

Ted

we did that a while ago Ted: 375hh to 340 wea mag and 300hh and 300 wea to 340 and 375 so yes doable for sure.

plus all the work for hornady and remington brass to make them better 9.3x62 ...
 
I've never like wasting primers shooting cream of wheat into mid air. Sitting at the press costs nothing but time. Primers are pricey now if you can find them and so is powder, I like to use them to push bullets.

Yes, is possible to move the case shoulder forward at a press. Have to take the neck to much larger diameter - perhaps .44 caliber or larger - so sort of straight wall - smooth out the old shoulder completely. Then use final sizing die and work neck back down to desired size, which also brings the new shoulder and new shoulder angle down with it. From what I have read and done, is a technique used to transfer the "headspace" within the chamber from the belt or rim, to the case shoulder. End up with basically "zero" possibility of case head stretch. Works well with new 303 British in a "longer" or bigger than normal chamber. Using the rifle's chamber as the "gauge" for when you just so have it back far enough. Still needs a more or less full power first firing to do the final, full forming to the chamber, though. And then likely only ever doing "partial" full length sizing on subsequent loadings, so shoulder does not get pushed back too far - unless head spacing on belt or rim is okay.

COW case forming, for sure, uses a primer, and small amount (10 to 15 grains?) of Unique or similar shotgun powder - not, at all, using regular rifle powder for COW case forming. The last Fed 210 and Fed 215 primers I bought at Cabelas were 0.10 each to me, so using COW method going to use two to make a "new" case - one for the COW load, and one for the first full power load. Is sometimes a LOT cheaper than buying cases, if you can even find any to buy - I did buy some 7mm Weatherby Magnum cases - Weatherby brand - last fall - $235 for 80, so $2.94 each. A much better deal to spend 0.20 or 0.30 each on primers, powder and COW, if you have or can get something to make your own??
 
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I always anneal my brass first before any big steps up or down. Maybe even after resize that big a step, or at least after the first firing.
 
Yes, is possible to move the case shoulder forward at a press. Have to take the neck to much larger diameter - perhaps .44 caliber or larger - so sort of straight wall - smooth out the old shoulder completely. Then use final sizing die and work neck back down to desired size, which also brings the new shoulder and new shoulder angle down with it. From what I have read and done, is a technique used to transfer the "headspace" within the chamber from the belt or rim, to the case shoulder. End up with basically "zero" possibility of case head stretch. Works well with new 303 British in a "longer" or bigger than normal chamber. Using the rifle's chamber as the "gauge" for when you just so have it back far enough. Still needs a more or less full power first firing to do the final, full forming to the chamber, though. And then likely only ever doing "partial" full length sizing on subsequent loadings, so shoulder does not get pushed back too far - unless head spacing on belt or rim is okay.

COW case forming, for sure, uses a primer, and small amount (10 to 15 grains?) of Unique or similar shotgun powder - not, at all, using regular rifle powder for COW case forming. The last Fed 210 and Fed 215 primers I bought at Cabelas were 0.10 each to me, so using COW method going to use two to make a "new" case - one for the COW load, and one for the first full power load. Is sometimes a LOT cheaper than buying cases, if you can even find any to buy - I did buy some 7mm Weatherby Magnum cases - Weatherby brand - last fall - $235 for 80, so $2.94 each. A much better deal to spend 0.20 or 0.30 each on primers, powder and COW, if you have or can get something to make your own??

The 7mm Rem mag brass makes lovely .308 Norma Magnum brass simply run through a FL die lubed properly.
 
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