Hornady 30 cal 190 gr Sub-X bullets

[Doug]

Oldest son asked me to load some subsonic .308 Win for him. Rather than suggest that what he wants makes no sense, I am humouring him and did a fair bit of reading. Found out that all is not as it would appear - which I already kind of knew from playing with a .300 Blackout a number of years ago. He wants to shoot the same ammo from more than one rifle, more than one kind of action, and with unknown rates of twist. Please bear with me while I humour him.

ANYWAYS, it looks like "the" bullet in a jacketed version, is this one from Hornady:

https://www.hornady.com/bullets/rifle/30-cal-.308-190-gr-sub-x#!/

It also appears that they are sold out pretty much everywhere. So, I have two questions:

1. Is this bullet a good one for the stated purpose?

2. Where can I get my hands on some?

Thanks for any useful advice. If you want to tell me that it is stupid to try to load one ammo for various firearms, with unknown twist rates, thanks but I already know that.

Doug

 

[Andy]

I could call you a lot of things, but stupid is not one of them.

I did up some 174 gr jacketed subsonic loads in a Lee Enfield, and these are very much transferable to the 308 Win, since they have very similar case capacities and bore diameters, so results would be very similar as well. Of course most rifles in 308 have actions a fair bit stronger than the Lee Enfield, so that should add some confort for those who need large measures of it.

174 gr Jacketed Hornady RN, 303 British, 3.025" OAL

10.0 grs Red Dot, 950 fps
11.0 grs Red Dot, 1100 fps
12.0 grs Red Dot, 1250 fps
13.0 grs Red Dot, 1350 fps

Assuming he intends to shoot it at sea level, 1100 fps just nips under that. The 190 gr bullet would bleed off about 50 fps as well. I would not go below 10.0 grs of Red Dot in the 308 (although I have). Any bullet in the 180 gr range should be subsonic with 11.0 grs of Red Dot and 150-165's should be subsonic with 10.0 grs.

Look here for some background if you want more of an explanation:

https://www.canadiangunnutz.com/for...eld-Reloading-Harris-Universal-Load-Question?

 

[Doug]

I could call you a lot of things, but stupid is not one of them.

I did up some 174 gr jacketed subsonic loads in a Lee Enfield, and these are very much transferable to the 308 Win, since they have very similar case capacities and bore diameters, so results would be very similar as well. Of course most rifles in 308 have actions a fair bit stronger than the Lee Enfield, so that should add some confort for those who need large measures of it.

174 gr Jacketed Hornady RN, 303 British, 3.025" OAL

10.0 grs Red Dot, 950 fps
11.0 grs Red Dot, 1100 fps
12.0 grs Red Dot, 1250 fps
13.0 grs Red Dot, 1350 fps

Assuming he intends to shoot it at sea level, 1100 fps just nips under that. The 190 gr bullet would bleed off about 50 fps as well. I would not go below 10.0 grs of Red Dot in the 308 (although I have). Any bullet in the 180 gr range should be subsonic with 11.0 grs of Red Dot and 150-165's should be subsonic with 10.0 grs.

Look here for some background if you want more of an explanation:

https://www.canadiangunnutz.com/for...eld-Reloading-Harris-Universal-Load-Question?

Thanks Andy!

So I read you back, since I have some 170 grain Round Nose Flat base bullets (for a .30-30), I should be good to go with them in a .308 Win with 10.5 grains of Red Dot, and be sub-sonic. Right? Or did I not follow you?

Doug

 

[barsik]

for those who are using these reduced power loads do you put some kind of inert lightweight filler over the powder to assure dependable ignition?

 

[Doug]

for those who are using these reduced power loads do you put some kind of inert lightweight filler over the powder to assure dependable ignition?

I am looking for subsonic as opposed to reduced power loads. I believe folks refer to these two things as different. But in the subsonic loads, my reading suggests that one does not use a filler. Somebody who has loaded more of them can chime in for sure.

A reduced power load, like one might see in a reloading manual, is generally to reduce recoil. But it probably would not produce a subsonic load.

Doug

 

[Andy]

I understand that it is difficult at present to find specific powders and bullets.

Hodgdon shows one (1) load for the 308 with Titegroup which offers an alternative:

8.0 grs with a 168 gr bullet for 1080 fps at 25K CUP - well below the max for that cartridge.

That's just subsonic at the muzzle with a 168 gr bullet. With a 180 gr bullet it would be slower and with a 150 gr bullet faster, in which case you'd want to start with 7.0 grs, keeping it above 1000 fps so the risk of a bore obstruction is minimized.

Always with a chronograph. I don't suggest using you ears to determine if it's subsonic.

 

[Ganderite]

A round nose bullet is best, because it is shorter and will be easier to stabilize at the lower RPM.

You could start with 10 gr of 2400 and work down from there.

 

[Doug]

A round nose bullet is best, because it is shorter and will be easier to stabilize at the lower RPM.

You could start with 10 gr of 2400 and work down from there.

Thanks for this! Would you use a 180 grain RN with the 10 gr of 2400?

Doug

 

[Ganderite]

Thanks for this! Would you use a 180 grain RN with the 10 gr of 2400?

Doug

I made ammo for a canned 308m using 200 gr bullets and about 8 gr of 2400, to be subsonic. That is by memory, not from my log book.

In a situation like yours, I would load 3 rounds in 1 gr increments from 7 to 12 gr, and start with the 10. (The 7 might stick in the barrel, so start in the middle and then chrony, or shoot for accuracy with the ear muffs off. Sub sonic sounds quite different.

 

[G_Alan]

I've used trailboss and Titegroup with cast round nose .30 for cheap plinking rounds. Sorry I've thrown out the info after transferring load data to a new log book.