Badger Ordnance Stabilizer Handguard
The Armalite AR10T in Canadian Service
- Thread starter Yeandle31
- Start date
Badger Ordnance Stabilizer Handguard
Weren't they made exclusively for Armalite? I have a old Armalite catalogue and they are in there.
I had one from Wolverine. Other than weighing a ton. That rectangular handguard was like 1/4" thick. Total gun with the prs buttstock on it pushed about 16lbs. It never had a single jam in all the time I had it. My friend still has it locked in his safe.
no, you could buy them on their website - badgers that is...they dont sell them anymore though.
maple_leaf_eh
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
The Armalite AR10(T) Semi-Automatic Sniper Weapon (SASW) in Canadian Service
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If you have more info/pics on rifles in Canadian service, post it down below!
Thanks,
Kevin
I feel sorry for the shooter. Those look like the standard C21 (?) NATO spec ball ammunition boxes made by IVI. Crappy inaccurate ammo, as proven repeatedly by the civilian rifle associations. But DND and IVI didn't seem to care that their product was simply machine gun ammo in little boxes of 20. The only advantage for the soldier I guess, is he has a faster follow up shot compared to the bolt action target shooters.
Agreed. I only used the information that I fact checked with other sources.
maple_leaf_eh
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
For what it's worth, General Dynamics advertises 5 types of 7.62 x 51 ammo - C19 tracer, C21 ball, C24 blank, C175 168gr sniper, and C181 175gr sniper. The C3 rifles were rebarreled in one of their shadier rebuild cycles to shoot the 175s. I had a conversation with an RCR sniper who said they fired hundreds of aimed shots trying to figure out why 168s didn't do well over about 500yds. I guess no one could read at the sniper school because Sierra designed the 168gr for a particular 300m full bore target competition. He didn't like me telling him that.
https://www.gd-otscanada.com/wp-content/uploads/400000894-7.62mm-Ammunition-Canada-2021.pdf
https://www.gd-otscanada.com/wp-content/uploads/400000894-7.62mm-Ammunition-Canada-2021.pdf
Originally the mags were modified M14 due to the "assault rifle ban" in the US. Those sucked. I actually had one of them. in 2006 they created an AR10B mag specifically for the rifle. No issues whatsoever with those. Just had to realize they weren't the original AR10 mags which we currently know as the SR25 mags. They were based off the M14 mag, but not a Frankenstein monster like the first gen.
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So a couple things about these AR10t rifles: Note that these are AR10B models although designated AR10t for tactical not target .
In about 2008 Wolverine supplies sold off a few of these rifles. They weren't actually over runs but the uppers were the test uppers that were used to get the contract. Exactly 200 rounds were through them. The few that were available, came with new AR10B lowers. Then there were the so called "bring backs" which were the uppers that came from the military after use. New uppers were provided to the military and the old ones were sold. That however came to a stop fairly quickly.
Lower:
The lower was an AR10B model marked 7.62mm. They came with Armalite DM triggers which... if you figured out the trigger, you could take them out and adjust them down to cheap National Match specs. It was fairly easy. Two stage triggers if I recall. It's been a while. Basic A2 pistol grip.
The stock was an A2 however the ones we bought from Wolverine back in 2008? came with an Accuracy speaks adjustable butt pad. Which was actually really good as an add on to the regular stock. If I recall correctly they had a purplish color on the end and you could adjust the much heavier rubber butt pad for LOP along with twisting it off centre left/right.
Upper:
The uppers came with Lothar Walther 24" 1:11.25 twist barrels. That also had a ceramic black coating. These barrels stepped down. You could tell if you had a real one by the ring mark in the finish from a suppressor. Also the barrel was threaded 11/16x24 for the Hauskin suppressors. The upper was a flat top with build in Picatinny rail and standard AR10 charging handle. I tended to add Badger tactical latches to mine, but those weren't standard.
The handguard as mentioned by others was a Badger Ordnance stabilizer. Heavy and awesome for shooting off a bag. Pic rail running the length of the top. There were some picatinny rail attachments for it to go on the sides and a sling stud for a Harris bipod. They were fairly long and covered the rifle length gas tube . The gas block had a mini picatinny rail on it for the backup sights.
The backup sights didn't come with the rifle, unless you bought the one off that Wolverine sold which was an extra to their original order. The sights were GG&G tritium flip up backup sights. I did have a set of them at one time. They were fairly cool. You needed the right height for that gas block. Using current flat top height wouldn't work correctly.
How did they shoot?
Very well. Sub .5 moa, 5 round groups at 100 yards. 168 and 175 smk. I've shot 4 of these rifles and had these results.
Found an old picture of the two I had. Been a long time now. Have to say I miss those rifles, they were very cool.
A buddy shot this with some reloads I did up using his AR10t. 5 rounds 100 metres. Shot off a bench with a Harris bipod and a Burris Fullfield II at 9X.
You can find the thread of his first shoot here:
https://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php/533010-Thursday-with-the-twins-at-the-Mission-range?highlight=mission+twins
Anyways, hope this helps anyone interested in the history of these rifles.
In about 2008 Wolverine supplies sold off a few of these rifles. They weren't actually over runs but the uppers were the test uppers that were used to get the contract. Exactly 200 rounds were through them. The few that were available, came with new AR10B lowers. Then there were the so called "bring backs" which were the uppers that came from the military after use. New uppers were provided to the military and the old ones were sold. That however came to a stop fairly quickly.
Lower:
The lower was an AR10B model marked 7.62mm. They came with Armalite DM triggers which... if you figured out the trigger, you could take them out and adjust them down to cheap National Match specs. It was fairly easy. Two stage triggers if I recall. It's been a while. Basic A2 pistol grip.
The stock was an A2 however the ones we bought from Wolverine back in 2008? came with an Accuracy speaks adjustable butt pad. Which was actually really good as an add on to the regular stock. If I recall correctly they had a purplish color on the end and you could adjust the much heavier rubber butt pad for LOP along with twisting it off centre left/right.
Upper:
The uppers came with Lothar Walther 24" 1:11.25 twist barrels. That also had a ceramic black coating. These barrels stepped down. You could tell if you had a real one by the ring mark in the finish from a suppressor. Also the barrel was threaded 11/16x24 for the Hauskin suppressors. The upper was a flat top with build in Picatinny rail and standard AR10 charging handle. I tended to add Badger tactical latches to mine, but those weren't standard.
The handguard as mentioned by others was a Badger Ordnance stabilizer. Heavy and awesome for shooting off a bag. Pic rail running the length of the top. There were some picatinny rail attachments for it to go on the sides and a sling stud for a Harris bipod. They were fairly long and covered the rifle length gas tube . The gas block had a mini picatinny rail on it for the backup sights.
The backup sights didn't come with the rifle, unless you bought the one off that Wolverine sold which was an extra to their original order. The sights were GG&G tritium flip up backup sights. I did have a set of them at one time. They were fairly cool. You needed the right height for that gas block. Using current flat top height wouldn't work correctly.
How did they shoot?
Very well. Sub .5 moa, 5 round groups at 100 yards. 168 and 175 smk. I've shot 4 of these rifles and had these results.
Found an old picture of the two I had. Been a long time now. Have to say I miss those rifles, they were very cool.
A buddy shot this with some reloads I did up using his AR10t. 5 rounds 100 metres. Shot off a bench with a Harris bipod and a Burris Fullfield II at 9X.
You can find the thread of his first shoot here:
https://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php/533010-Thursday-with-the-twins-at-the-Mission-range?highlight=mission+twins
Anyways, hope this helps anyone interested in the history of these rifles.
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JDForBrkFst
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- Roughly North Central AB
I went through my tour photos and compiled a few of the C7CT. My CT had the bore damaged by the guy on the previous rotation so it's accuracy wasn't any better than my C7. I won't out his unit, but you may be able to figure it if you know my unit. As a result I opted to use the C3 for the most part. We had trained with our C3's in Canada and were issued the same rifle overseas so we already had dope on it. I also had a lot more faith in the x51 reach. It was difficult to balance out my kit layout as a result of my options. My favourite was to pack the C3 on my back and carry my C7. When I was only moving at night during periods where I was doing a lot of OP's I would take just the C3 and a Hi Power. I'd still carry extra rifle mags to feed my buddies should the need arise. My personal opinion is that DM rifles should be larger than 5.56. The CT would have been great had it not been damaged. An AR10 would have been best.
My CT was issued with a can, it spent more time on my C7 as a result of the issues with the CT.
You can see the box of Norma ammunition. This was superior in accuracy potential to the IVI ammunition issued in the years to follow.
We were never issued match ammunition for the C7CT's.
My C3 is in a scabbard in my ruck, you can't see it very well because my arm is in front of it. We often rucked into a village and occupied abandoned compounds for up to a week. I would take off with 1 to 3 other guys to set up OP's for 24-48 hours at a time, using the small outpost as a place to go back to resupply and rest up before our next go.
On cut off during a cordon and search. I bought a HSG rifle scabbard and sewed a pad into it to protect the optic. I tried to hide the rifle as best I could as the Taliban didn't distinguish between snipers and DM's.
My CT was issued with a can, it spent more time on my C7 as a result of the issues with the CT.
You can see the box of Norma ammunition. This was superior in accuracy potential to the IVI ammunition issued in the years to follow.
We were never issued match ammunition for the C7CT's.
My C3 is in a scabbard in my ruck, you can't see it very well because my arm is in front of it. We often rucked into a village and occupied abandoned compounds for up to a week. I would take off with 1 to 3 other guys to set up OP's for 24-48 hours at a time, using the small outpost as a place to go back to resupply and rest up before our next go.
On cut off during a cordon and search. I bought a HSG rifle scabbard and sewed a pad into it to protect the optic. I tried to hide the rifle as best I could as the Taliban didn't distinguish between snipers and DM's.
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Nice pictures, definitely ones I haven't seen before.
I agree on your point about DM rifles needing more reach than 5.56mm. Granted, it was nice that the CTs were accurized and better shooting than C7s (provided they aren't damaged) but I think the CF made the right call in purchased the 7.62mm C20.
Thanks!
Gunnerlove
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Vancouver Island
Trying to explain anything to people who know everything is frustrating at the best of times. The 168 Norma that was issued till a decade ago was very accurate but sooooooo slow, which didn't help with stability. The 175 SMK IVI was decent if you ignored the flyers (who thought tar sealed, crimped match ammo would be a good idea?).
If we get out of this OIC crap and can shoot these awesome rifles again:
168 SMK , 43.4 grains Varget, 2.8 OAL, Federal, Winchester or Lapua brass. CCI BR2 primers. (Should give you .5 moa)
175 SMK, 43.4 grains Varget, 2.8 OA, same brass etc and primers. (Should give you sub .5 moa with ease. IE closer to .3 moa. )
If you have the Armalite DM trigger in yours. You have to push down on the tab inside for it to pop out. Check youtube because it's retained that way. Then move the spot to the lowest notch. It's set at the middle one from factory. This will give you a poor man's NM trigger.
JDforBrkfst. Awesome photos. Thank you for your service and sharing those photos.
Awesome! Thanks for the info! Fingers crossed we're able to get these things out of our safes and back out to the range where they belong
