loading ammo without working up a load

I'm just going to buy some ammo on the way, that was the plan anyway hence leaving it so close and not having ammo

yesterday I had spend the morning cleaning my relaoding room and bench off, it was just so clan and tidy I was in the mood to load some ammo

I have loaded for this rifle many of times before, its the first rifle I ever bough, I mainly shoot cast bullets through it so I have tones of loads for cast bullets using weights from 100gr to 220gr with powders like titegroup, w321, 2400, 5744, H4895 and H777

I have some loads for 180gr sierra jacketed as well but don't have any left but I found a box of 100 .312" 150gr hornady while cleaning up. I've loaded to Hodgdon's max load with my 180gr bullets (38gr of H4895) but settled at 36gr for my load (incase the ammo get use in one of my other MANY LE/LM's)

Hodgdon lists 36gr to 40gr of H4895 for the 150gr bullet, so since I used 38gr with the 180gr I assume the 38gr is find for the 150 its also a medium load

i was just wondering if there was a way to figure out nodes or if there was some general rules that will make accurate ammo. I assume a min load may be be ideal and a max load may not be ideal, I thought maybe it was a given that around 3/4 between min and max was a good spot or something.



FEAR NOT guys, when I make a load for the 150gr, ill start at the start load and load up some batches to test them as I go
 
I have loaded ammo many times without working up a load. I have Ken Waters Pet Loads Manual & have found if I follow one of his recipes that he claims was very accurate, that load will give at least decent accuracy in my rifle. Yes, I can maybe tweak the load later for optimum accuracy, but his original pet load will certainly yield hunting accuracy for the ranges most game is shot (within 300 yds.).
 
OP - Its been my experience that bullet weight is generally the principal determinant for load performance. Your Parker Hale will prefer either the 150's or the 180's, and you can find that out "right out of the gate" using a mid range load. Everything else is just fine tuning. As your PH does not have a free floating barrel, the nodes you describe can be rather indistinct - no sense going overboard.
Oh - one remaining thing, LE's (and many other sporting rifles) tend to prefer flat based bullets over boat-tails. You're off to a good start with the 150 gr Hornady pills - they are my go-to for most of my 303's, and are very effective over the hunting range you mention.
 
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Every serial number of gun will behave differently with ammo. You cannot choose a load at random, and expect performance (you might get lucky, or you might be way off).

If time is short, you can roll the dice on a load. As others have said, choose a powder charge well-back from the maximum, and go.

Or, as you said in post#10, buy some ammo - going with a long range hunter ammo, or a match ammo with a hunting-compatible bullet, you'll probably be alright, for hunting.
 
sulisa said:
Every serial number of gun will behave differently with ammo. You cannot choose a load at random, and expect performance (you might get lucky, or you might be way off).

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If we're waxing philosophical here, the same holds just as much truth for factory ammo as it does for reloads. Factory ammo isn't made for "your" rifle, it's made to fit in everyones rifle/chamber, and it's as much a gamble as whatever random powder charge/bullet combo you've pulled out of a hat. The only difference being, you can fine tune your own loads.
 
saskgunowner101 said:
If we're waxing philosophical here, the same holds just as much truth for factory ammo as it does for reloads. Factory ammo isn't made for "your" rifle, it's made to fit in everyones rifle/chamber, and it's as much a gamble as whatever random powder charge/bullet combo you've pulled out of a hat. The only difference being, you can fine tune your own loads.
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Perhaps you are overlooking the part that commercial ammo is likely pressure tested with actual pressure testing devices, and then they are using a non-standard powder to meet their specs - is very much beyond what us home hand loaders can do. Is no special feat to make brass to fit into any SAAMI spec chamber - is what your Full Length sizing die will do. I personally do not know a single hand loader who has ever had his loadings pressure tested - I would not even know where to go in Canada to have that done - at best is information from loading manuals, computer simulations or perhaps based on measured muzzle velocity - using chronographs that have never been calibrated by the user.
 
Evanguy said:
I'm just going to buy some ammo on the way, that was the plan anyway hence leaving it so close and not having ammo
go
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Definitely the way to go. At 200m nobody is going to know the difference after a shot in the chest cavity. I would not want to be messing with loads going into a hunting situation and there is no shortcut.

For all the noise about it, off the shelf stuff shoots well enough to kill reliably to about 300m if the rifle and shooter are up to it. Past that some stuff gets pretty variable. YMMV.

Happy hunting!
 
Potashminer said:
Perhaps you are overlooking the part that commercial ammo is likely pressure tested with actual pressure testing devices, and then they are using a non-standard powder to meet their specs - is very much beyond what us home hand loaders can do. Is no special feat to make brass to fit into any SAAMI spec chamber - is what your Full Length sizing die will do. I personally do not know a single hand loader who has ever had his loadings pressure tested - I would not even know where to go in Canada to have that done - at best is information from loading manuals, computer simulations or perhaps based on measured muzzle velocity - using chronographs that have never been calibrated by the user.
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I don't really think pressure was/is a consideration, as you say, none of us can test it at home. Obviously smoked cases, hang fires, mis fires, erratic velocities, round primers backing out can tell us we're probably low or too low. Blown/cratered primers, ejector marks, sticky extraction, 2x4 to open the bolt on the other end tell us we need to re-evaluate something. But when I say pulling a load out of a hat, I'm more meaning picking a load from a known manual (not internet wonder loads!) and going with that. Not the min, not the max. This is what I'm referring to.
 
OP, if you have a rifle that is in VG-EXC condition, originally chambered for the cartridges it's chambered for, by your ongoing descriptions and you have once fired cases to reload, this is what I would do in your situation.

I would load the bullet weights you've mentioned to a "mid way load" in any good reloading manual and be quite content that it's safe.

It may not give stellar target accuracy but it will usually be good enough for hunting purposes out to a couple hundred yards.

I'm not just giving you advice off the top of my head and making it up as it goes.

I've done this before, on more than one occaision, back in the day when time and resources were hard to come by.

On one occaision I went on a non guided riverboat hunt on the Muskwa River with a 338-06 barrel I had just put onto a Mod 70 Winchester. I had used the reamer before, on another barrel and had some left over cases from that job.

The reamer was cut to minimum specs and the chambers it cut were tight. This is a good thing when pressures might be an issue.

This barrel is a Hart match grade and luckily shot well right from the first few rounds.

I had 50 once fired cases to work with. I loaded them up with Hornady 225 grain Spire Points to appx 60 grains of VN160 over CCI 250 primers for a velocity of appx 2600fps.

When I got to the launching site, The rifle hadn't been shot yet and only bore sighted.

When we got to the camp area, where the outfitter would drop us off there was a great spot to sight in the rifle over a wide flood plain of gravel/logs/stumps.

Luckily the rifle wanted to shoot well from the first shot, which thankfully was on the 8x11 target at appx 50yds. It was easy to dial in the crosshairs of the Shepherd scope and move the target to 100, then 200 to set point of impact for the 200yd range.

We took an Elk and a Moose that trip, with that rifle/ammo. My hunting partner had some issues with his rifle, which he never maintained properly.

IMHO, the method above will work fine for your purposes as long as you know your rifle is in good working order.
 
Thanks for that bearhunter, the rifle is in awesome shape, ive loaded about 2k rounds for it over the years. and id have no worries at all with even oiled surplus ammo (not that id actually do that, but even hodgdons max load for the 180gr everything was fine, functioned as it should and primers look great)

im just going to buy factory winchester ammo on the way up north.

My buddy just sent me a surprise for my trip i got on sunday, its a vortex dimondback DBK-01-BDC so now ill be sighting it in opposed to rezeroing it.

Factory winchester is ~2400fps ~2400ftlb 180gr those are more solid number then even max loads from hodgdons

Im busy with work before i leave for 2 weeks so im out of time for loading, the day i posted this i was just really in the mood and had free time
 
One of the considerations of a good hunting rifle is the availability of ammo, "just in case". Like the airline loses the bag with the ammo...

303, 308, 270, 30-06 are good in any Can Tire or local gun shop. 308 Norma mag... not so good.

I usually pack a back-up rifle, too, with iron sights "just in case".
 
Great advice Ganderite. Once I could afford to do that it was standard procedure.

Most folks have one rifle/shotgun/22rf and are happy.

I don't know how many guys I've repaired rifles for, while on a hunt. In most cases it's just due to neglect of maintenance. Often it's just getting by as cheap as possible and the hunt is a once in a lifetime affair.
 
So, after looking at ammo availability online in a few stores that are on my way after I leave this island on Sunday on my way north, I realized I should maybe load some ammo to make sure I have some with me.

I do still plan to stop at a few stores and find some 303 British ammo, it cant be that hard but I did want to make sure I had some

Hodgdon's loads for H4895 with a Hornady 150gr bullet is 36gr to 40gr

I picked a load of 37gr of H4895 and used the same 3.000" COL and 150gr Hornady bullets

its 1 gr above min load. I cant see the rifle having any issues (I've used more of the same powder with 180gr bullets without issue)

I hope the velocity is around 2500fps, either way though I don't really care to much as long as they are consistent

what I ended up doing to make them as consistent as possible is

picked 30 once fired brass from this rifle
annealed the shoulders
full length sized them
trimmed them on my Foster trimmer to 2.210"
deburred and chamfered the cases
weighted each powder load to make sure they were the same after throwing them from my Lock n Load powder measure
loaded the bullets all to the same ogive length (OAL varied +- 0.010") on my Lock n Load classic press
then set them with a light crimp as the cannelure lined up perfectly

mag tested every bullet and function tested every bullet
 
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303 British can be unobtanium in many of the usual places.

I was at the Langley Cabela's a few weeks ago and all they had were some PPU, 174grn FMJ.

I haven't looked for it anywhere else but I did notice the dearth of available cartridges in many chamberings and the very high prices on reloading components, such as bullets.

If you are full length sizing all of your 303Brit cases, every time you reload, that may explain your consistent 4 inch groups

I find with most 303Brit chambered rifles or any "rimmed" cartridge, full length sizing is detrimental, especially if rim thicknesses aren't consistent or the headspace is close to maximum.

IMHO, you should have only partially resized the shoulder and went from there. This usually bumps the shoulder back a few thou and allows the rest of the case to be centered in the chamber for more consistent alignment with the axis of the bore, rather than at a very slight, but accuracy denigrating angle.
 
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OP - I'm sure the ammo you made will be fine for its intended purposes. If you do manage to pick up some factory fodder, you can do a comparison during or after the hunt.
 
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