180gr Hornady XTP for deer hunting via saboted muzzleloader

[wasa]

I recently came into two boxes of Hornady #44050 44 Cal 180gr XTP pistol projectiles. I am a reloader, but I don't own a 44 or reload for 44 caliber. I do own two 50 caliber inline muzzleloaders that I use for deer hunting in SW Ontario.

My current deer hunting load is 2x50gr equivalent IMR WhiteHots with a sabotted 45 caliber Hornady XTP 250 gr pistol projectile. I also reload for 45 Colt in my Henry Big Boy. Was thinking that I could use 44 caliber green sabots and use these projectiles and save the 45 cal 250gr projectiles for my 45 Colt rifle.

A quick internet search has me believing that I need to use 240-250 gr minimum and up to 300 gr for deer hunting with a sabotted pistol projectile. Hornady indicates on their website that these 44 cal projectiles are fine for medium game up to 300 lbs so I assume that when fired from a handgun (44 Magnum?) they are "fine" for deer at pistol velocities.

So, am I foolish for even pondering 180gr pistol projectiles out of an inline muzzleloader for deer? Or am I missing the "punch" or knockdown power of a 250-300gr projectile at muzzleloader velocities (assuming 1800-2000 ft/s)? Or would you expect the 44 projectile would just make a 0.429" hole in the deer and pass right through? Obviously lots of rifles use 180gr projectiles for hunting deer/moose/bear but at a much greater velocity.

Thanks

 

[Jimbobob08]

Lighter bullet would increase velocity, expansion. Reduce penetration, by how much, I don’t know. I wouldn’t expect issues with broadside shots, just short death runs and blood trails a blind man could follow. Heavy raking shots, especially if bone is contacted and the bullet might not make it to vitals I’m thinking.

 

[powdergun]

I have hunted with a Savage ML and have taken quite a few deer with the XTP's . I have used 300 gr and 250 gr bullets. From my observations the heavier 300 gr bullets worked better. Although I have not lost any animals that were hit the ones shot with the 250 g required some tracking and the ones hit with 300 gr bullets never went more than a few steps. YMMV but I will only use the 300 gr bullets now.

Note: I do have the advantage of being able to use smokeless powder in my rifle. ( IMR SR4759 with a 300 gr XTP in a Black MMP sabot)

 

[nowarningshot]

Shoot those out of a Rossi 92 44mag. Pretty impressive performance and big dusk fireballs. Deer last year, proved my name wrong. Gave him a warningshot. Course deer here might be confused with jackrabbit in other parts of the country. Stick to 50 maybe 75 yds max, dead is dead.

 

[wasa]

I have hunted with a Savage ML and have taken quite a few deer with the XTP's . I have used 300 gr and 250 gr bullets. From my observations the heavier 300 gr bullets worked better. Although I have not lost any animals that were hit the ones shot with the 250 g required some tracking and the ones hit with 300 gr bullets never went more than a few steps. YMMV but I will only use the 300 gr bullets now.

Note: I do have the advantage of being able to use smokeless powder in my rifle. ( IMR SR4759 with a 300 gr XTP in a Black MMP sabot)

Good point. Distance, orientation of deer play a big factor.

I've successfully harvested deer with my crossbow, smoothbore shotgun, rifled barreled shotgun, and rifle, but so far no deer with muzzleloader. Rifled slugs of 1oz (437gr), sabot 12g with 300gr (Hornady SST), 150gr 0.308" from rifle, 3-blade broadhead all do their job. My buddy keeps saying that deer are easy to kill with a broadside shot through the heart/lungs, and that I would be more than fine with 125gr or above projectile at sufficient velocity to expand (thinking 357 mag rifle/pistol - read online Michigan deer hunters taking deer with 357 pistol).

 

[wasa]

Shoot those out of a Rossi 92 44mag. Pretty impressive performance and big dusk fireballs. Deer last year, proved my name wrong. Gave him a warningshot. Course deer here might be confused with jackrabbit in other parts of the country. Stick to 50 maybe 75 yds max, dead is dead.

While we have some "big" deer here is SW Ontario, the ones I've shot over the years are fairly small (want to fill my freezer). Always get a doe tag in one of the WMU around me, but sometimes archery only... other times shotgun, still other times muzzleloader only (WMU 92). I'm sighted in and set-up for this fall, but just pondering what to do with 2 boxes of 180gr 44s. Could always try to sell them or even better, trade for 45s.

Thx for the comment!

 

[powdergun]

While I understand that the recoil of ubermagnums are an issue IMHO if you can legally bring more horsepower out there then I think you should do so. With muzzle loaders use the heavier bullets. Personally I would not trust a .357 mag on deer and if you could use a .308 or bigger accurately and legally do that. You really want something that can penetrate a shoulder blade and pass through the chest. Putting bullet through the heart or both lungs is the desired outcome but reality in field conditions you can miss the heart or only take out one lung pretty easily so the extra shock force can help anchor the animal should that happen.

Reality with a proper shot at the correct range you can take out a deer with a 22 but we owe these animals better by doing everything we can for quick humane kills.

 

[Kenny_G2]

I've shot 230 xtp out of my 50 cal ML and found they kill alright but don't penetrate all the way through so there is limited blood trail. Shot a medium size buck broadside double lung that went 100 yards into a standing cornfield. Only found one drop of blood. Only found him by following tracks. Heavier is better IMHO.

 

[cosmic]

Hmmm.. Using the lighter pill with 2 white hots will reduce combustion pressure somewhat. This may affect the stability of the burn. I'd be inclined to try this load at the range to see what happens. Plan B would be to go to 3 white hots to get the pressure up (and velocity), assuming your gun is magnum rated.
If the gun shoots reliably, Id have no qualms about using it on deer.

 

[wasa]

Hmmm.. Using the lighter pill with 2 white hots will reduce combustion pressure somewhat. This may affect the stability of the burn. I'd be inclined to try this load at the range to see what happens. Plan B would be to go to 3 white hots to get the pressure up (and velocity), assuming your gun is magnum rated.
If the gun shoots reliably, Id have no qualms about using it on deer.

Thanks. Both my CVAs are "150gr Magnum" rated. I know the Hornady XTP expand at pistol velocities. Pushing the projectiles past 2000 ft/s may not be a good thing.

 

[wasa]

Flogging a dead horse, I recently came across a sale on muzzleloader bullets & sabots from Thompson/Center. They are selling pretty much the same thing I asked about last year (50 cal sabots with 44 cal XTP bullets).

I bought a bunch - even if I just use them for practice or putting holes in paper, it was a good deal.

Might need to borrow a chronograph to do some testing. Hornady says the bullets are good for game up to 300 lb so should be no bullet issues for SW Ontario deer during ML season.

 

[medvedqc]

Flogging a dead horse, I recently came across a sale on muzzleloader bullets & sabots from Thompson/Center. They are selling pretty much the same thing I asked about last year (50 cal sabots with 44 cal XTP bullets).

I bought a bunch - even if I just use them for practice or putting holes in paper, it was a good deal.

Might need to borrow a chronograph to do some testing. Hornady says the bullets are good for game up to 300 lb so should be no bullet issues for SW Ontario deer during ML season.

maybe a good idea to do a test in some media to see how the bullet penetrate and how it remains ...

 

[hunter148]

My two cents and I have put down more than my share of deer with a muzzleloader. I will preface this by saying I have shot everything from round balls to my current 195 grain bullet at them.
XTP (Extreme Terminal Perfomance) bullets work exactly as designed and I have shot four or five deer with them. Front on, to broadside, every time the bullet was in the chest and mushroomed out to nickel size. Never a pass thru.
Went thru half a dozen different kinds and found my Encore liked light bullets, 200 grn TC bullets worked well. After many years I have settled on a pure lead .357, polymer tipped, double sabot 195grn bullet on top of 100 grn T7, lit with a small rifle primer. I have dumped deer from 6ft to 125 yds with complete pass thru and messy blood trails, broken shoulders, every time. Light bullets will kill them dead but they often do the death run 30-80 yds usually, if that. I like them as they hit like a freight train and shoot flat to 150yds
Shoot them to find out if they work in your gun but I would not expect two holes or a bang, flop the heavier bullets give.