Just fell down the black powder rabbit hole

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CL2000

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The other day I was on ####### and saw a project gun that was a martini chambered in 45-90 sharps. And while my woodworking skills probably aren't up to snuff to make new stocks and my metal working skills are non-existent it became obvious that that gun wasn't for me. However, when looking up the 45-90 sharps round I kinda fell down the rabbit hole of black powder rifles, and I have questions.

My only experience with black powder it with a cheap (I guess you would call) inline muzzleloader which I use Pyrodex for. Would you be able to use Pyrodex in a black powder rifle cartridge?
Does Pyrodex have the same rule as black powder of no air gaps?

What do you think would be a good black powder rifle/cartridge for a beginner to shoot and reload?
 
CL2000 said:
The other day I was on ####### and saw a project gun that was a martini chambered in 45-90 sharps. And while my woodworking skills probably aren't up to snuff to make new stocks and my metal working skills are non-existent it became obvious that that gun wasn't for me. However, when looking up the 45-90 sharps round I kinda fell down the rabbit hole of black powder rifles, and I have questions.

My only experience with black powder it with a cheap (I guess you would call) inline muzzleloader which I use Pyrodex for. Would you be able to use Pyrodex in a black powder rifle cartridge?
Does Pyrodex have the same rule as black powder of no air gaps?

What do you think would be a good black powder rifle/cartridge for a beginner to shoot and reload?
Click to expand...

1. No experience with Pyrodex , I use Triple7. A Triple 7 formula is 85% of black powder charge by volume e.g. 70g black powder would be 59.5g of Triple7 - same rules with no airgap
2. The most common BPCR cartridge IMHO is the 45-70 not too bad when it comes to recoil (you can always download) and very simple to load straight wall cartridge.
3. Any of the late 1800's era single shot rifles would be good lots of decent Italian reproductions out there like 1874 Remington Rolling Block, 1885 Winchester Highwall, 1874 Sharps and 1884 Springfield Trapdoor.

Regards, Retreever
 
As for a Black powder cartridge 45/70 is the best to start with as components are easy to find( brass,bullet moulds etc) and it is a top notch hunting rounds.Single shot and lever guns are chambered for the 45/70 so there is a wide assortment of rifles to choose from
 
CL2000: I will echo everything Re3iever and chasseur say. About all that I will add is that, I have shot plenty of bp cartridges using Pyrodex. Loads the same as black powder. Same rules apply, regarding compressing the powder charge. I prefer Pyrodex RS, but Ctg works well, too.
The .45-70 and black powder were made for each other. Excellent caliber choice. As already noted, very versatile and plenty of rifles/ bullet choices available.

Al
 
well... when you are down in that rabbit hole you will most likely bump into that caterpillar that is smoking something with the dormouse. They will both tell you that the 45/70 will get old fast. Fine to say that components and rifles are plenty, because people dump them . I did that gig for many years sharps, Hepburn ,highwall,trapdoor, rolling block all in 45/70. If you are getting into the BPCR game to shoot silhouettes or long range targets you will be good with the 45/70 but remember more powder, more lead = more recoil.
Look up sagebrush long shots on YouTube you will see they do hit stuff long range with lesser calibers.

The old guys still in the game shoot smaller calibers than 45/70
you can knock down steel and animals with 32/40 ,38/55,40/65 . But hey if you are a newbie 45/70 would be the easy one to start on.
 
some guy on the for sale page has a Remington Rolling Block pkg deal in 12.7x44r is basic 50/70 cal in other terms. ...fun pumpkin roller I have had many over the years.

Brass dies wads bullets bullet mould just add powder and play

I saw that Martini on GP and the only thing good about that is the barrel you could prob spin that off and use it on a better action ,set it back and re chamber to 45/70
...1/20 twist is for the lighter boolits not the big heavyweights for long range target work.
 
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Re3iever said:
1. No experience with Pyrodex , I use Triple7. A Triple 7 formula is 85% of black powder charge by volume e.g. 70g black powder would be 59.5g of Triple7 - same rules with no airgap
2. The most common BPCR cartridge IMHO is the 45-70 not too bad when it comes to recoil (you can always download) and very simple to load straight wall cartridge.
3. Any of the late 1800's era single shot rifles would be good lots of decent Italian reproductions out there like 1874 Remington Rolling Block, 1885 Winchester Highwall, 1874 Sharps and 1884 Springfield Trapdoor.

Regards, Retreever
Click to expand...

Had to look up triple 7, seems like nice stuff, but I probably better stick with what I know I can find.

While I love the 45-70, I'm not having much luck finding any interesting examples in my price range. I'm seeing break offs and some cheap leavers, but no rolling blocks, falling blocks, trap doors, etc.
 
cdnrokon said:
well... when you are down in that rabbit hole you will most likely bump into that caterpillar that is smoking something with the dormouse. They will both tell you that the 45/70 will get old fast. Fine to say that components and rifles are plenty, because people dump them . I did that gig for many years sharps, Hepburn ,highwall,trapdoor, rolling block all in 45/70. If you are getting into the BPCR game to shoot silhouettes or long range targets you will be good with the 45/70 but remember more powder, more lead = more recoil.
Look up sagebrush long shots on YouTube you will see they do hit stuff long range with lesser calibers.

The old guys still in the game shoot smaller calibers than 45/70
you can knock down steel and animals with 32/40 ,38/55,40/65 . But hey if you are a newbie 45/70 would be the easy one to start on.
Click to expand...

I always wind up getting interested in the odd stuff. .577, 577-450, 50-70
 
cdnrokon said:
some guy on the for sale page has a Remington Rolling Block pkg deal in 12.7x44r is basic 50/70 cal in other terms. ...fun pumpkin roller I have had many over the years.

Brass dies wads bullets bullet mould just add powder and play

I saw that Martini on GP and the only thing good about that is the barrel you could prob spin that off and use it on a better action ,set it back and re chamber to 45/70
...1/20 twist is for the lighter boolits not the big heavyweights for long range target work.
Click to expand...

I'm not on the equipment exchange or whatever it's called on this site yet, when I get home and have a chance to sit down I'll try to get on.

Anyways, that gun in general is too much trouble for me, someone could probably make something nice with it though.
 
CL2000 said:
Had to look up triple 7, seems like nice stuff, but I probably better stick with what I know I can find.

While I love the 45-70, I'm not having much luck finding any interesting examples in my price range. I'm seeing break offs and some cheap leavers, but no rolling blocks, falling blocks, trap doors, etc.
Click to expand...

A good starter rifle is the H&R 1871 Buffalo Classic , it's a break action but very accurate used will sell for between $600 and $800.00 . That was the rifle I started with.

Retreever
 
Re3iever said:
A good starter rifle is the H&R 1871 Buffalo Classic , it's a break action but very accurate used will sell for between $600 and $800.00 . That was the rifle I started with.

Retreever
Click to expand...
The Buffalo Classic is a good starter 45-70. I still have mine which I will probably keep for awhile. I ended up finding an original Trapdoor Springfield made in 1885. I learned on the BC how to make black powder shoot well. The Trapdoor was easy to find a load for as I already had the basics down. I use Goex and old Eynsford in all my black powder rifles. Black powder has a bit of a learning curve due to what works excellent in my rifle may not work as well in yours.
 
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