Anyone loading 50-140 Sharps?

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Iron Sighted

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Curious to know if anyone else here is loading for this cartridge and in particular using smokeless powder to do so. I just bought a Ruger #1 that has been rebored/rechambered for this cartridge and am getting set up to load for it.

I have seen some limited load data online utilizing smokeless powder, mostly curious to hear if anyone here has loaded for this carrtidge and what they have used. I have found some .512" cast lead bullets ranging from 450gr-650gr that I think will work, hopefully I won't see any leading issues. I can potentially see case fill being an issue with smokeless so I'm also wondering if anyone has used case fillers in smokeless powder loads to keep the powder column in place inside the cartridge?

Any and all info appreciated.
 
Thanks, that is mostly what I have been able to find myself as well so far. It's definitely going to be a powder burner and likely not a rifle I'll be shooting a lot of rounds through during a range session, ha!

I have a pound of IMR 4831 that I'd imagine could be used in place of the H4831, I'll just start on the low end and work up I think. Also the very last bit of a pound of Varget as well, I'd be lucky to have enough for even 2 rounds : )
 
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At one time I owned a huge 50/140 Navy Arms Roller barrel was over 1" across the flats!
I think it was made by Pedersoli.
Great long range cartridge, but I only ever shot it with black never Smokeless.
The big thing I remember is it was supposed to be 3 1/2" but in fact it was 3 1/4" case .
Cat
 
Biggest one I ever shot was a 50-110 and that thing kicked the crap out of me. Couldn't take it anymore after a few rounds. And that was running BP loads. I can't imagine what a 50-140 will be like.
 
Yeah, the barrel profile on this Ruger No.1 H is ridiculous, it looks like a cannon. I expect I'm going to be grateful for the extra weight of it and likely wish it were even heavier still, lol.
 
You might find some useful information in Cartridges Of The World book, a Gun Digest publication. At one time SR 4759, being a very light bulky powder was favoured for nitro for black substitutions but today you’ll likely need to haunt the gun shows to find some. Slow burners like H4831 allow lower pressures in larger cases but they burn very dirty at these low pressures leaving lots of unburned powder in the barrel and action. There have also been a number of reports of sudden unexplained pressure spikes resulting in severe damage using this method of using very slow rifle powders to fill these old voluminous cases.
 
Ashcroft said:
You might find some useful information in Cartridges Of The World book, a Gun Digest publication. At one time SR 4759, being a very light bulky powder was favoured for nitro for black substitutions but today you’ll likely need to haunt the gun shows to find some. Slow burners like H4831 allow lower pressures in larger cases but they burn very dirty at these low pressures leaving lots of unburned powder in the barrel and action. There have also been a number of reports of sudden unexplained pressure spikes resulting in severe damage using this method of using very slow rifle powders to fill these old voluminous cases.
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I'd guess the pressure spikes are related to the amount of empty case volume somehow? This is partially why I was wondering about using a filler of some sort, I have heard of dacron being used amongst other things. I figure dirty burning smokeless powder still has to be better than black powder as far as cleaning goes though?

I'll have to check out Cartridges of the World, have heard of it previously but never looked through a copy, perhaps I have the excuse I need now to go buy one : )
 
Iron Sighted said:
I'd guess the pressure spikes are related to the amount of empty case volume somehow? This is partially why I was wondering about using a filler of some sort, I have heard of dacron being used amongst other things. I figure dirty burning smokeless powder still has to be better than black powder as far as cleaning goes though?
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IMO it is a shame not to shoot those old calibers in the powder they were designed for. The massive echoing BOOOOOM and the big cloud of smoke is totally entertaining. BP also produces a lower impulse shove than faster burning modern powders. There is just something special about operating a big old rifle the way it was intended to be run.

Cleaning BP is not that difficult. A bit of hot soapy water is all it takes. Then some BP lube to keep things clean and corrosion free.
 
I Dont Care About You said:
IMO it is a shame not to shoot those old calibers in the powder they were designed for. The massive echoing BOOOOOM and the big cloud of smoke is totally entertaining. BP also produces a lower impulse shove than faster burning modern powders. There is just something special about operating a big old rifle the way it was intended to be run.

Cleaning BP is not that difficult. A bit of hot soapy water is all it takes. Then some BP lube to keep things clean and corrosion free.
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I get what you're saying, and am still having some debate about it because I have heard that with these big old cartridges it can actually be easier to find accuracy with the B.P. The rifle is just a rebored Ruger No.1 H that was formerly a 458WM so not really a classic B.P. styled piece, but it'd work just fine that way as well. The cast projectiles I've found so far look like they'd probably be better suited to the lower velocities of the B.P. as well so I haven't totally discounted the idea, I'm just not real keen to have to buy powder measures and a drop tube, wads, grease cookies, etc. and also deal with the extra clean up at this point.....but I'm a never say never kind of guy so who knows?
 
Iron Sighted said:
I get what you're saying, and am still having some debate about it because I have heard that with these big old cartridges it can actually be easier to find accuracy with the B.P. The rifle is just a rebored Ruger No.1 H that was formerly a 458WM so not really a classic B.P. styled piece, but it'd work just fine that way as well. The cast projectiles I've found so far look like they'd probably be better suited to the lower velocities of the B.P. as well so I haven't totally discounted the idea, I'm just not real keen to have to buy powder measures and a drop tube, wads, grease cookies, etc. and also deal with the extra clean up at this point.....but I'm a never say never kind of guy so who knows?
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Honestly all that stuff is pretty easy to deal with and most of it is pretty inexpensive.

We've all shot modern rifles at long range. There is something captivating and magical about the BP experience and hurling ludicrously huge chunks of lead 1000+ yds downrange.
 
I Dont Care About You said:
Honestly all that stuff is pretty easy to deal with and most of it is pretty inexpensive.

We've all shot modern rifles at long range. There is something captivating and magical about the BP experience and hurling ludicrously huge chunks of lead 1000+ yds downrange.
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That is well beyond where I ever imagined shooting any of my rifles, I'm more like a 400 yards and in kind of guy, but I do like the potential of having the capability to shoot that far. Mostly I bought it because I love the looks of the No 1 H and have wanted a rifle in a big bore chambering for awhile.
 
If you can find some Accurate, XMP 5744 smokeless powder, it is practically identical in burn rate and performance, to SR 4759.
 
Alex McKr said:
If you can find some Accurate, XMP 5744 smokeless powder, it is practically identical in burn rate and performance, to SR 4759.
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Similar burn rate to 4759 is only part of the requirement. SR 4759 is a very light bulky powder that can fill that huge case without driving pressures out of sight, a similar charge of XMP 5744 by weight should provide similar velocities to SR 4759 but is it more dense than 4759? If so you will still have a case fill problem with excess air space and the potential for problems caused by this condition.
 
Iron Sighted said:
That is well beyond where I ever imagined shooting any of my rifles, I'm more like a 400 yards and in kind of guy, but I do like the potential of having the capability to shoot that far. Mostly I bought it because I love the looks of the No 1 H and have wanted a rifle in a big bore chambering for awhile.
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Ya just gotta dream a little bigger and not be limited by "conventional" wisdom. Pretty much any cartridge can reach out way further than most people think.

I took a hot rodded 243Win out to 2000 yds, because the ballistics computer said it would stay supersonic out to that distance and I wanted to see if I could do it. I wasn't overly successful at that but it was an interesting challenge. I watched a guy whack a 55gal drum at 900 yds with a 45-70 Sharps, offhand. That was a hell of s shot that the majority of people would consider to be impossible and thus never even try it.

The 50-140 was meant for long range. It would be a heck of a journey to take such a beast out to ridiculously long distances. And trust me, the satisfaction in finally connecting a way out there distant target with an old cartridge like that will be immense. :) I'd love to see it.
 
I have 2 rifles chambered in 45-120. A #1 and a Remington Rolling Block. Both are rechambered 45-70's. When loaded up the #1 gives me a nosebleed pretty much every session. The RB is much nicer, of course with less velocity. All of my #1 rifles appear to recoil much more than other rifles in similar chambering. Must be a design thing.
Have fun with your project.
 
358 said:
I have 2 rifles chambered in 45-120. A #1 and a Remington Rolling Block. Both are rechambered 45-70's. When loaded up the #1 gives me a nosebleed pretty much every session. The RB is much nicer, of course with less velocity. All of my #1 rifles appear to recoil much more than other rifles in similar chambering. Must be a design thing.
Have fun with your project.
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Black powder or smokeless powder loads? You have me a little concerned hearing that story. I like a bit of recoil but don't want to feel like I'm getting punched in the head.....guess there is but one way to determine what it's going to be like, still have to wait for a few components to arrive first however.
 
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