WK 180 piston issue.

[SA85M1]

Just doing some digging into the piston failure/breakages in this rifle as it's a prelavent known issue..What exactly is the cause of this,?
It's been said that the rifle is over gassed,and it contributes to the piston breaking..is the metallurgy in the piston also suspect,?...Is the piston itself too small ?
Are there realistic add ins such the adjustable gas insert useful in preventing failure ?
What say you ?

 

[Non-phixion]

Its a turd of a gun, enough said.

 

[thegazelle]

Loose gas block screws. Tighten them and loctite them with high heat loctite to mitigate risk.

If there is a word to describe my WK (gen 1.5), it's loose. Loose gas block screws, loose hand guard screws and that darn stupid threaded charging handle, that no matter what you do to tighten it with a piece of metal between those holes, it is guaranteed to come loose in the next few shots unless you loctite that handle every time...but then that thing may just shear off.

 

[SA85M1]

Okay,was planning on doing that and adding the brass bushing to the reciever..

 

[bigmouth]

Its a turd of a gun, enough said.

Lol. ^^This^^^ definitely this.

 

[Sniffer]

Loose gas block screws. Tighten them and loctite them with high heat loctite to mitigate risk.

If there is a word to describe my WK (gen 1.5), it's loose. Loose gas block screws, loose hand guard screws and that darn stupid threaded charging handle, that no matter what you do to tighten it with a piece of metal between those holes, it is guaranteed to come loose in the next few shots unless you loctite that handle every time...but then that thing may just shear off.

Mental note to self - do not buy WK180

 

[Ustauk]

True North Arms is looking at a piston fix. If buying new, the Crusader Templar, Sterling R18, and upcoming BCL Siberian have more robust piston designs.

 

[thegazelle]

Mental note to self - do not buy WK180

Now, I don't know whether the G2s are any better or not...I don't have one and not planning to get one.

To be quite frank, I ONLY bought the WK180 due to it being made in Canada. My presumption is / was that a domestically made product surely would be superior than one made overseas. Plus I would always pour my hard earned dollars to support Canadian industry even if the price points may be slightly higher (without reason). I was very surprised at the amount of quality issues with the WK...I haven't had the catastrophic issues of the piston rod breaking or the charging handle shearing off (yet). The handguard screws Kodiak Defence did send me some replacements quickly. I have found their customer service, and in particular their rep Owen H, to be quite responsive. I guess that is a good thing, knowing that the support is there if you need it (though they did not send me the improved HT threaded charging handle - they said if/when my breaks they can send me a replacement).

 

[SA85M1]

Hmm..I guess the silk purse out of a sow's ear isn't possible,but I have seen a few running ok after 2k rounds and some tweaking..unfortunately I like making stuff like this work...

 

[the radium king]

i think it can run no problem, but you have to be prepared to tweak it and not have a tantrum if it doesn't run out of the box (or if the charging handle makes marks on your pretty gun). i think due to the overgassing it tends to rattle itself apart. first to go is the gas block. once that's loose the piston gets out of alignment and breaks. so if you run your gun with no attention to care and feeding then you'll tell the internet that it's crap because the piston breaks and that your AR never did that. short term solution is to keep it tight. mid term solution is to get a buffer from tna. long term solution is to reduce gas.

 

[Grove]

i think it can run no problem, but you have to be prepared to tweak it and not have a tantrum if it doesn't run out of the box (or if the charging handle makes marks on your pretty gun). i think due to the overgassing it tends to rattle itself apart. first to go is the gas block. once that's loose the piston gets out of alignment and breaks. so if you run your gun with no attention to care and feeding then you'll tell the internet that it's crap because the piston breaks and that your AR never did that. short term solution is to keep it tight. mid term solution is to get a buffer from tna. long term solution is to reduce gas.

All those manufacturer defects and you try to shift blame on the customer for "no attention to care and feeding" when the gun is "crap" from the factory......

How much are you being paid to shill for this rifle platform?

 

[the radium king]

How much are you being paid to shill for this rifle platform?

holy cow how did you figure it out? yes, there is an evil cabal of canadian 180 manufacturers and their marketing board has hired me to shill for the 180 platform and make excuses for their money-grubbing ways.

but as long as we're putting our razor-sharp intellects to work, perhaps some facts; the canadian firearms industry was able to put out what, five or more 180 variants in the two years since the AR ban so that folks could keep competing, hunting, shooting, and posing with them in full camo in their reddit posts (even though the magwell angle doesn't look cool like the guns in the movies).

the first canadian 180 - wk180 - was to market how soon after the ban? months? zero time for development, manufactured at probably two to three orders of magnitude less than the AR with reduced margins as a result. and with a high likelihood that all their investment in tooling, etc., could be wiped-out at a moments notice at the whim of the government.

but of course all the internet operators expect milspec AR levels of quality for less $$$. ARs were cheap because the government paid for the R&D. B&T, HK, etc., are expensive because they are recovering the R&D costs via sales.

yes the rifle is junky - it is by design - the ar180 was the export, third-world version of the ar15. personally i am impressed with what the canadian firearms market was able to accomplish in such a short time and the risk they took and are taking to accomplish it. as a result i am willing to invest the time to make the gun run properly, and willing to share what i know. if tightening a few set screws on a regular basis will keep a $1300 gun running then perhaps you don't have to buy a $2600 gun. and mebbe that means more folks with $1300 guns which means stronger canadian industry, bigger lobby, etc.

but i do remember when i was a kid and would have temper tantrums when my crap toys broke.

 

[SA85M1]

Jeebus folks,calm down and please keep the comments constructive,..otherwise fu@k off and post somewhere else..
Another question...anybody have a decently high round count,..up to 5K.?...more ?...

 

[Grove]

holy cow how did you figure it out? yes, there is an evil cabal of canadian 180 manufacturers and their marketing board has hired me to shill for the 180 platform and make excuses for their money-grubbing ways.

but as long as we're putting our razor-sharp intellects to work, perhaps some facts; the canadian firearms industry was able to put out what, five or more 180 variants in the two years since the AR ban so that folks could keep competing, hunting, shooting, and posing with them in full camo in their reddit posts (even though the magwell angle doesn't look cool like the guns in the movies).

the first canadian 180 - wk180 - was to market how soon after the ban? months? zero time for development, manufactured at probably two to three orders of magnitude less than the AR with reduced margins as a result. and with a high likelihood that all their investment in tooling, etc., could be wiped-out at a moments notice at the whim of the government.

but of course all the internet operators expect milspec AR levels of quality for less $$$. ARs were cheap because the government paid for the R&D. B&T, HK, etc., are expensive because they are recovering the R&D costs via sales.

yes the rifle is junky - it is by design - the ar180 was the export, third-world version of the ar15. personally i am impressed with what the canadian firearms market was able to accomplish in such a short time and the risk they took and are taking to accomplish it. as a result i am willing to invest the time to make the gun run properly, and willing to share what i know. if tightening a few set screws on a regular basis will keep a $1300 gun running then perhaps you don't have to buy a $2600 gun. and mebbe that means more folks with $1300 guns which means stronger canadian industry, bigger lobby, etc.

but i do remember when i was a kid and would have temper tantrums when my crap toys broke.

Quit making excuses for sub par products, if the manufacturer cannot do the proper R&D then they should not be shipping products out period.

Five or more variants in 2 years means nothing if they wont function properly.

"but of course all the internet operators expect milspec AR levels of quality for less $$$"

People expect a gun regardless of the cost to WORK PROPERLY and NOT FALL APART from regular use.

Jeebus folks,calm down and please keep the comments constructive,..otherwise fu@k off and post somewhere else..
Another question...anybody have a decently high round count,..up to 5K.?...more ?...

You asked for honesty and got it.....

 

[James1189]

Jeebus folks,calm down and please keep the comments constructive,..otherwise fu@k off and post somewhere else..
Another question...anybody have a decently high round count,..up to 5K.?...more ?...

I bought my Kodiak wk180 last may. I put over 3000 rounds though it over the summer and fall. I've had nothing but problems with it from the beginning. after the first 200 shots the piston rod snapped, the gas block would wiggle loose after 50 shots and the castle nut/buffer tube coming loose after minimal shooting.
I went through 3 piston rods total.

thankfully Kodiaks warranty/support is super awesome they would send me them 2 at a time for free within days. I still have a couple of them on hand. after every range day I would Loctite everything, the gas block, castle nut, buffertube. Every single time everything would come loose again.

it would jam/double feed randomly on using the Cross mags at least once every other mag. the only mag that would consistently feed correctly was the Magpul 5rnd that came with it.

I took my friend shooting 2 weekends ago, brought the Kodiak180 with me. 80 rounds in the Eclip that holds the bolt catch for the last round hold open rattles itself off, jams the gun, then the pieces fall out of the magwell when i dropped the mag.
That was the final straw for me honestly.

I sold the gun the next day to Cabelas for next to nothing cuz I was so pissed off. so that was my experience with the kodiak180.

imo the Gen1 is very much a prototype and honestly I personally wouldn't trust the Gen2 fully yet, I have heard they made a lot of improvements though but, I'm sure it uses a lot of the same parts as the Gen1.

I bought a completely different 180, a much more beefy one. I bought the Crusader Arm Sentinel 5.56, I've put over 200 round through it so far and hasn't even jammed or had a single hiccup yet. I cant really say much about it because I haven't shot it that much yet that but, it feels like a much better made 180. It also has a 3/8" steel piston rod instead of the 1/4" the Kodiak Defense has, so its much stronger.

 

[the radium king]

well, there is the discussion (without having to call a person a shill) - what to expect at what price point. and what is maintenance vs what is design flaw?

i think the old days of $750 ARs is gone. that was done by the govt and not the canadian manufacturers. $1,500 is the new entry-level price point in canada. supply and demand. and the 180 clones are the entry-level option. the canadian vendors flooded the market post-ban with entry-level 180 clones; the trade-off to rushing the product out was consumer beta-testing and some poor finishing. they decided more guns in the hands of more people was better than taking years to develop the gun to a high standard and leave the canadian market unserved in the interim; if you disagree then do not buy. simple.

otherwise, there's a guy posting in this sub-forum about the handguard screw on his $2500 hk rattling loose. my remington light strikes if i don't clean it regularly after shooting subsonic ammo. russians gotta clean their mighty ak's every day otherwise they rust into a lump. my point? tighten up your 180 occasionally and it will run fine. i don't think the fact that it requires more maintenance than an AR makes it crap or sub-par.

back on topic - increase your inspection frequency (not necessarily cleaning as it's not a dirty gun) add 'tightening stuff' to the process, keep it lubricated (in my experience the gun also suffers from light strikes due to the bcg not traveling fully forward; the springs can be helped by reducing friction). that has worked for me.

 

[Super Mario]

Loose gas block screws. Tighten them and loctite them with high heat loctite to mitigate risk.

If there is a word to describe my WK (gen 1.5), it's loose. Loose gas block screws, loose hand guard screws and that darn stupid threaded charging handle, that no matter what you do to tighten it with a piece of metal between those holes, it is guaranteed to come loose in the next few shots unless you loctite that handle every time...but then that thing may just shear off.

“Loose” is a good one, so are “rip off” or “piece of s$&t”.

 

[SA85M1]

Soo...they seem to have several design flaws...and parts rattle loose even after being loctited...it smells like poor manufacturing...even today where computer controlled machinery does the work...meh...I do want to like it...

 

[thegazelle]

Yeah, for those who remember Windows Millennium Edition (Windows ME)...it as rushed out the door and was supposed to be what ultimately was Windows XP. Cheesy example, but methinks the WK180 is the Windows ME of black sporting rifles - ME was very buggy and a resource hog notably due to being rushed out the door, with the WS-MCR more or less being Windows XP... Definitely further development, testing and QA would have benefitted the WK product. Even if a person like me has not (yet) had the catastrophic failures - the whole thing rattling and there is some play in some parts/not mated quite well...it doesn't exude confidence. That said if I will say one positive aspect, is that it is fairly accurate, so performance-wise I am satisfied.

 

[James1189]

Soo...they seem to have several design flaws...and parts rattle loose even after being loctited...it smells like poor manufacturing...even today where computer controlled machinery does the work...meh...I do want to like it...

i think the tolerances are just to big. the Gen1 Kodiak is such a primitive design when you look at it. I used my Gen1 a lot, and I actually really liked it when I first got it.

I dealt with its problems, and if it wasn't for KD's excellent customer service the experience would have been much worse. if you know how the gun works, aren't afraid to do maintenance on it, and also you are willing to deal with all the issues that it has. it is "useable" if you have some of parts on hand.

it is also somewhat accurate, I could hit a 6" steel plate every shot at 100m never tested it on paper but wasn't bad for plinking, even out to 400m.