Is bullet casting killing new buyer interest in the L-E?

steelgray

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When I was a kid, I suppose that the Lee-Enfield rifle was the most common centerfire gun owned by my neighbors and friends. In those days, you could pick-up 303 factory ammo at any hardware store, or Canadian Tire, at a reasonable cost. I’m sure that there are just as many Lee Enfields now as then, but times have changed.

Now many/ most of these guns are owned by older people – who have had such guns for years. With this change, demand for factory ammo has plummeted – as the guns are being used less for hunting and recreational shooting. The old guys who own the majority of Lee-Enfields are generally cheap and not very discerning – and tend to have lots of free time on their hands. As such, they keep their guns shooting using cast bullets – and eventually that becomes its own hobby.

Is that a good thing? In a net sense, probably not. Chances are that the shift away from the Lee-Enfield away from being everyone’s gun to a platform for bullet casting hobbyists has seriously reduced demand for factory ammo and even .311 jacketed bullets.

I personally bought my first Lee Enfield when I was a 30-year-old young professional. Specifically, I bought a No.5 and a box or two of factory ammo - probably from my neighborhood Canadian Tire. Then, after an enjoyable time shooting the gun, I was left with a bunch of brass – and that became a starting point for me getting into reloading for the gun. The pathway for getting into that was straight forward because you could buy projectiles and other reloading components anywhere, at a fair price – to keep your gun shooting.

Now, every once in awhile, I overhear a conversation – at a gun show, etc. – between some old codger and a potential new young new buyer of a new Lee-Enfield. As soon as the old codger gets into his tales of how he casts his own bullets and uses o-rings around his old, fragile brass – to avoid head separation, etc. the potential young buyer gets what a hassle owning such a gun is – and moves on. Obviously, as this trend continues, there's going to be even less demand for factory ammo and .311 reloading bullets components for the L-E. That becomes a vicious circle.

I regret that the numerous L-Es out there are going to be increasingly owned by a declining number of old bullet casting enthusiasts – people who aren’t going to be around forever. Maybe Lee-Enfield ownership will end-up like the deal with pipe smokers.
 
They're old guns. Old things tend to appeal to old people. Why would a young person that doesn't care about the historical significance buy an Enfield (Especially at the prices some of them are going for) when they can buy a more modern, reliable, accurate rifle in a more common chambering? I don't think bullet casting has much to do with why a dinosaur loses popularity over time. Same thing happens with everything. Not a lot of people around that give a crap about a Ford Model T anymore, as the people that did are gone. The new generations are too far removed.
 
The younger ones want something new and shiny. We have become a have now and throw away society. I have close to 20 303’s currently and have never used the O rings. I don’t see the benefits in doing it. Some of my cases are over 40 reloads of cast. O rings just make more work. I can see doing it with full power loads and keeping that brass for only one rifle.
I have met some of these older people that over complicate stuff and have to show how much they know. I tried buying two LE mags from a seller at a gun show and he started going on about selling me the correct mag so it would fit my rifle. He had a -#1 and #4 mag. Wallet was in my hand getting the money out. I told him they will fit one of my rifles. But I I want to make sure I am selling you the right one. I have multiple #1’s, #4’s and #5’s they will fit one of my rifles. I told him I would buy them. Still rambling on about proper mag. I ended up walking away. Why over complicate stuff for other people.
I sell a lot of cast 303 bullets locally none use the O rings and I know some of them are over 20 reloads a case. Loading for Lee Enfields isn’t complicated with lead loads. The pressure isn’t there to damage the case like full power loads.
 
They're old guns. Old things tend to appeal to old people. Why would a young person that doesn't care about the historical significance buy an Enfield (Especially at the prices some of them are going for) when they can buy a more modern, reliable, accurate rifle in a more common chambering? I don't think bullet casting has much to do with why a dinosaur loses popularity over time. Same thing happens with everything. Not a lot of people around that give a crap about a Ford Model T anymore, as the people that did are gone. The new generations are too far removed.

It's funny, when I first got into guns a bit under a decade ago you could get a Savage Axis for sub-$300, and a sporter enfield was only $200. Now an Axis is $500, while a sporter enfield is still like $200. They've gone from being the cheap option, to having stiff competition from budget bolt guns, to being the cheap option again in like 6 or 7 years...

Personally I think a major factor in the decline in use of enfields is the ability (or lack of) to scope the rifle. Yes, they can be scoped in a number of ways, but it's usually more hassle than scoping a modern rifle, and people like scopes.

Add in the cost of ammo and the relative lack of accuracy (compared to modern budget bolt guns), it's no surprise to me that fewer and fewer people are picking the enfield to hunt with.
 
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The Lee Enfield back then is what the SKS was only a few years ago.
Super cheap reliable gun and plenty of ammo available at ridiculously cheap prices.

But don't worry the turd will help you, in a few years you will own nothing and be happy..
 
I'd take the opposite position; bullet casting keeps old iron like the LE alive. I haven't seen anyone hunting with a 303 in 40 years, and it's been about that long for a '94 in 30-30 as well. On the other hand both and plenty of others can be a riot with low cost cast loads.
 
I've owned perhaps 50 enfields, bought and sold many and now have about a dozen of the better or more rare ones as my remaining projects.

I've never shot cast bullets or used the rubber band / o-ring to save brass. I full length size and shoot brass to destruction, currently I have a few hundred 92 dated IVI that are on 3rd and 4th reloads, about 100 PPU brass on 2nd or 3rd reloads and then I recently loaded up a pile of random range brass (+300 rounds) that I will shoot and either discard or reload after a culling.

Projectiles I will buy whatever PSP 180grn flat base bullets I can get, just got a few hundred PPU projectiles a few months back that went into the random range brass.

I don't see a problem, I have at least 800rds loaded and should be good for a few years of shooting.
 
My first hunting rifle was my grandfathers SMLE that he had bought at some army - navy. Back in the day, a large percentage of hunting was done with old sporterized enfields. On the farm many couldnt afford a new rifle. I see the generation coming of age these days having way more cash to spend that I did at their age. Those old Enfield's will always have some interest but no like the old days. As long as outfits like Privi keeps making reasonably priced ammo and brass things will work. Starline seems to add more caliber's in their brass selection so hopefully they become a option
 
The SKS craze a few years ago, killed a lot of interest in the LE especially when, at the same time, cheap surplus 303 ammo became non-existent.
 
Scotty454

Not a lot of people around that give a crap about a Ford Model T anymore, as the people that did are gone. The new generations are too far removed.

Easy there, I just happen to love both Model T's and Enfield's.

I hope I'm still breathing, cuz I also have a 1930 Model A Ford and a sheet load of Enfield's. :cool:

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As other said. The new shooters want new fancy toys.

This is stuff I have not put into circulation. I still have boxes of loaded stuff then another container of stuff fired from mine.

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I've had Enfields that would only stabilize oversized cast bullets. I don't think us "mature" reloaders are hogging all the Enfields as much as the new kids don't want an old milsurp that doesn't really do well with a scope.
 
My god, do you realize what you have done! You have declared the Lee-Enfield and the Winchester '94 as "not suitable for hunting in Canada". Justin and Wendy monitor this forum! They will be adding the '94 and Lee Enfield to the prohibited list of firearms, in the new amendment of C21. Worst of all, they will be including the all variants of the Lee-Enfield - which they are going to define as anything made after 1886 with a barrel and a trigger.

I'd take the opposite position; bullet casting keeps old iron like the LE alive. I haven't seen anyone hunting with a 303 in 40 years, and it's been about that long for a '94 in 30-30 as well. On the other hand both and plenty of others can be a riot with low cost cast loads.
 
My goto is a Ruger single in .303 British, but i have two Lee Enfields I could press into service in a heartbeat.
They will always be around to some extent, the same as the Sniders and Martinis - of which i also shoot with cast
Cat
 
When the process of casting was first explained to me by an old shooter, I thought, "My goodness! I'll stay away from that idea!". Then, Lady Lucky stopped by with a magazine article by Dean Grennell, in which he talked about LEE tumble lube bullets. He asked the question, "What do you think happens to a cast bullet when it passes through the barrel?" He said it wasn't always necessary to resize cast bullets, especially the LEE tumble lube ones, as long as they will chamber. The rest is history for me. I have been casting ever since I found that article.

While others will certainly disagree, I try to keep things as simple as reasonably possible. I do cast for my Lee Enfields, and likely haven't come anywhere near to perfection with matching bore to bullet diameter. I use almost exclusively LEE moulds, sizers, and melting pots.
 
There are Lee Enfield rifles for sale the ee all the time. Anyone who is interested can buy on any time they want. It's not like anyone is hoarding the. New shooters tend to buy savage axis and similar as a starter rifle now, unlike previous generations who started out with the LE.
 
The guys getting into hunting want a lighter rifle to carry around than a LE, I started hunting with a scoped sporterized no.4 and it was 10lbs without ammo/mag. My first 3-4 years of hunting it was my go to rifle, I still use it for spring bear as I missed it in my hand the last couple years but I have a soft spot for LE’s.

I have been saving my brass for years and will be casting and hand loading for it this year, I’ve got enough sp ammo for it to hunt with for year and casting will be plinking rounds for it. Love the old warhorse and I want to shoot it more, have a bunch off jacketed bullets as well that I’ve been squirrelling away when I see them. I just don’t see the interest in them from a lot of the people that are new to shooting and hunting, it’s either not modern enough or the lack of ammo or price of ammo is a deterrent.

I’m not old but I definitely have an appreciation for them and many more of the milsurps from that era, a few friends that are younger than me have them but rarely shoot them due to the reasons I’ve started. They generally look for newer lighter easier to scope rifles with a more user friendly mag, or they want the newest cool guy cartridge or magnum offering.
 
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