4 inch shotgun shells

Uhhh if 1 3/8oz of lead doing almost 2000fps isn't getting it done for you, something tells me that an extra couple hundred fps isn't the solution.
 
Robert Nicholson said:
Now that 4 inch is out of the way; Why not 2 inch?
I like the Minishot at one and a half but want a bit more.
Are they out there? All I can find locally are 2 and three quarter.
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2" cartridges already exist, and have since at least the '20's. They were a British specialty, and they built ultra-light side x sides for it, 6 lbs and under iirc. Not very common today, they are, I believe, still available.
 
bearslayer56 said:
This may be a stupid question but I'm just wondering why we don't have 4" shotguns shells. If you're facing a big bear that extra power would be helpful, or am I missing something here?
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Who would shoulder it? There's a reason a punt gun was fastened to a boat.
 
Robert Nicholson said:
Now that 4 inch is out of the way; Why not 2 inch?
I like the Minishot at one and a half but want a bit more.
Are they out there? All I can find locally are 2 and three quarter.
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I feel yer pain. I have my Grandfather's Double, and it is chambered for 2 1/2 inch shells. Kent did a run a while ago, and the opportunists were scalping them, even back while there were still some in stock at the non-rip-off sources. Paid $12 a box for the ones I got, have seen them asking as much as $45-$50 a box since, which, they can keep. IIRC, 2 inch was a standard size for 12G, way back, but it was in the time when the you could get for a wad, was a layer or two of heavy felt, and roll crimps were more common than star crimping.

On the plus side, one of the gents over on the Double Gun Journal, laid his money on the table and actually bought the pressure test gear in order to test the effects of shooting 2 3/4 shells in a 2 1/2 inch chamber. The results flew in the face of all the hand wringers, as the pressures were not all out of line! The recommendation was to stick to the Target loads, rather than heavy field loads, for some of the older guns, with questionable metallurgy, provided they were in reasonable shape, of course.

You can always cut down and roll crimp the longer loads, something I have considered for this gun.
 
Grape Shot:

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trevj said:
I feel yer pain. I have my Grandfather's Double, and it is chambered for 2 1/2 inch shells. Kent did a run a while ago, and the opportunists were scalping them, even back while there were still some in stock at the non-rip-off sources. Paid $12 a box for the ones I got, have seen them asking as much as $45-$50 a box since, which, they can keep. IIRC, 2 inch was a standard size for 12G, way back, but it was in the time when the you could get for a wad, was a layer or two of heavy felt, and roll crimps were more common than star crimping.

On the plus side, one of the gents over on the Double Gun Journal, laid his money on the table and actually bought the pressure test gear in order to test the effects of shooting 2 3/4 shells in a 2 1/2 inch chamber. The results flew in the face of all the hand wringers, as the pressures were not all out of line! The recommendation was to stick to the Target loads, rather than heavy field loads, for some of the older guns, with questionable metallurgy, provided they were in reasonable shape, of course.

You can always cut down and roll crimp the longer loads, something I have considered for this gun.
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Whether it is a target load or a field load has zero impact on pressure. All of them, unless specifically labeled as a "low pressure" round, are running in the 11,000 to 11,500 psi SAAMI max pressure. Low pressure rounds, like the Kent Elite you referred to, or Gamebore or RST or Win AA Low recoil Low Noise are typically in the 6,000 to 7,500 psi range. Shooting a 2 3/4" shell in a 2 1/2' chambered 12 ga will typically bump the pressure between 500 and 800 psi. Smaller gauges will be bumped noticeable more.

If you misunderstand shotgun barrel pressures so badly that you think heavy field loads create significantly more pressure than target loads, I would suggest you are in no position to be advising people that the "handwringers" were wrong about firing shells longer than the chambers
 
Reminds me of a Kid? asking about 3 1/2 in slugs , which I never had, he said he wanted them for home defence.
One of the other fellows standing there damn near choked on his coffee.

Myself I like 2 3/4" target load stuff/ cheap.
 
marshall said:
Reminds me of a Kid? asking about 3 1/2 in slugs , which I never had, he said he wanted them for home defence.
One of the other fellows standing there damn near choked on his coffee.

Myself I like 2 3/4" target load stuff/ cheap.
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If I was loading for "home defence" I would want the lightest loads I could find. Less recoil = more control should a followup shot be required and I doubt that I would be needing 100 yard energy for home defence.
 
Licensed to kill said:
If I was loading for "home defence" I would want the lightest loads I could find. Less recoil = more control should a followup shot be required and I doubt that I would be needing 100 yard energy for home defence.
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Agree. If nine balls of 00 buck don't put a bad guy down you've got bigger problems (or bad aim)
 
canvasback said:
Whether it is a target load or a field load has zero impact on pressure. All of them, unless specifically labeled as a "low pressure" round, are running in the 11,000 to 11,500 psi SAAMI max pressure. Low pressure rounds, like the Kent Elite you referred to, or Gamebore or RST or Win AA Low recoil Low Noise are typically in the 6,000 to 7,500 psi range. Shooting a 2 3/4" shell in a 2 1/2' chambered 12 ga will typically bump the pressure between 500 and 800 psi. Smaller gauges will be bumped noticeable more.

If you misunderstand shotgun barrel pressures so badly that you think heavy field loads create significantly more pressure than target loads, I would suggest you are in no position to be advising people that the "handwringers" were wrong about firing shells longer than the chambers
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Take it on faith that I don't really care about whether you blow a vein in your head, or just have a good laugh.

FWIW, the Gamebore ammo I got in 2 1/2 inch, was their Pure Gold line, 1oz 65mm shells. They state on the box that they are intended for guns proofed at 3ton or better pressure.

Personally, when I look through the load books and see the upper end of the load pressures, I figure that a decently well built gun from late in the 1800's, or early in the 1900's, in decent nick, likely should not be fed the higher listed loads at all, but is not likely to break a sweat handling the only slightly elevated pressures of the extra 1/4 inch of case, as duly noted by the author of that article.

So, rather than wringing ones hands and shrieking that it's for the children, MY suggestion, is that it might be worth a look at the article, and data, as provided for free, by a guy that put the money down to actually properly pressure test the different chambers with a selection of ammo. He set out to test what was "Known", and found that much of it was essentially hooey and hypothesis, rather than being based on actual test data.

And, while I understand that there is a fair few of the type around that thinks as long as the chamber will fit it, it should be good, I'd rather expect better on average around this place.

It's the Internet. Anyone that takes only my word, or only yours, without double or triple checking for corroborating evidence, isn't much use to the race anyways...
 
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