9x35 Bubba Wildlcat

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romayama

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Hi folks,

I guess I am not the first one looking into this, but in search for plinking/small game rifle cartridge that is cheap to assemble from the most common range brass and most affordable projectiles (other than 223), I turned my eye again to the 223 casings, topped with the 9mm bullets.
223 casing trimmed to the shoulder, annealed, flared and fitted with the 9mm pistol bullet. Before fireforming, it looks like the snake that swallowed an egg. After fireforming it should be straight wall, the same diameters as 357 Mag. COL is the same as 30 Carbine (43mm). Here is "9x35 Bubba", in the middle, between the 357 Mag and 45-70, haha. 16-18 gr of H110, LilGun or H4227, 357 Mag dies.
As for the rifle, since the casing bases are same with 357mag, the 357MAX reamer will be used to cut a chamber in the existing 9mm PCC barrel, to work in a bolt action with 223 bolt face. Possibly even in semi-auto with the pistol/carbine-length gas system
Will post pictures of the rifle build later
Thanks for your attention and comments!

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Very interesting! Would be great out of a Howa mini action, Zastava M85 or CZ 527 maybe.

Another possibly cheap option would be necking up 7.62x39? Although. 223 brass is usually far more plentiful on the ground
 
After owning, tweeking and hunting with M1 carbines years back, I've always wished that Winchester had just gone with the 357 magnum case with a rebated rim and loaded with 140 gr truncated cone FMJ FP bullets for the military at the time. With the powders available in the era, the 357 Carbine would've been more effective in combat situations during, as well as game getting after WW2 & Korea.

The 357 Carbine cartridge would be sweet in a light bolt rifle or single shot I reckon. Fer me though, I run the 350 Legend in a Ruger American Ranch which be easy to load up or down for critter dumping/plinking use in numerous rifles, ammo options & components be out there for it.
 
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Thank you all for your kind comments and interest!
I have ordered the short-chambered 23inch long barrel for it and it is on its way to me. I am planning to fit it into the old Enfield No1sporter, just as a single shot test platform. Since it has optics rail, I am planning to do some accuracy tests and load development, using 147gr FMJs, wil be happy to publish the result
 
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SHELL SHUCKER said:
After owning, tweeking and hunting with M1 carbines years back, I've always wished that Winchester had just gone with the 357 magnum case with a rebated rim and loaded with 140 gr truncated cone FMJ FP bullets for the military at the time. With the powders available in the era, the 357 Carbine would've been more effective in combat situations during, as well as game getting after WW2 & Korea.

The 357 Carbine cartridge would be sweet in a light bolt rifle or single shot I reckon. Fer me though, I run the 350 Legend in a Ruger American Ranch which be easy to load up or down for critter dumping/plinking use in numerous rifles, ammo options & components be out there for it.
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oh now you have me thinking

357 Maximum with rimless case. I need to look into my books but perhaps the 9x35mm might be close

romayama said:
Thank you all for your kind comments and interest!
I have ordered the short-chambered 23inch long barrel for it and it is on its way to me. I am planning to fit it into the old Enfield No1sporter, just as a single shot test platform. Since it has optics rail, I am planning to do some accuracy tests and load development, using 147gr FMJs, wil be happy to publish the result
Click to expand...

interesting choice of platform, I do like the simplicity of the enfield, I own a number of them myself, and your biggest issue will be modifying the extractor if you are just doing a simple barrel swap. I would want to bore out the receiver but that is more work. I'm trying to remember but there is someone here that has an enfield that they had chambered to 9x19mm 9x35mm would be much easier to get to feed from a single stack magazine (like the Savage 340) if you ever get that far into the project.
 
woodchopper said:
oh now you have me thinking

357 Maximum with rimless case. I need to look into my books but perhaps the 9x35mm might be close



interesting choice of platform, I do like the simplicity of the enfield, I own a number of them myself, and your biggest issue will be modifying the extractor if you are just doing a simple barrel swap. I would want to bore out the receiver but that is more work. I'm trying to remember but there is someone here that has an enfield that they had chambered to 9x19mm 9x35mm would be much easier to get to feed from a single stack magazine (like the Savage 340) if you ever get that far into the project.
Click to expand...

You are correct Sir, availability and simplicity makes LE a good platform. I was the one who built the 9x19 LE, but frankly, shooting it is boring. It feels much better when you double the powder charge, but then the risk exists to load them into a pistol. Hence this Bubba wildcat, as a safety measure and hopefully fun to shoot.
The factory extractor works just fine on the 9mm rim, and the ejection and feeding I will worry about if ballistic test proves to be a success. Thanks for the tip on the mags!
I have No4 instead prepared for a new press-in barrel, using the bored-out stub
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Don't let that discourage you from pursuing the build. I was just making an observation........BTW.....nothing new under the sun is a quote from King Solomon
 
romayama said:
You are correct Sir, availability and simplicity makes LE a good platform. I was the one who built the 9x19 LE, but frankly, shooting it is boring. It feels much better when you double the powder charge, but then the risk exists to load them into a pistol. Hence this Bubba wildcat, as a safety measure and hopefully fun to shoot.
The factory extractor works just fine on the 9mm rim, and the ejection and feeding I will worry about if ballistic test proves to be a success. Thanks for the tip on the mags!
I have No4 instead prepared for a new press-in barrel, using the bored-out stub
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Click to expand...

Interesting build.

I look forward to seeing how that preforms.

I have a .431" blank that will end up on a No4 receiver 44Rem Mag

but that will have to wait for the 357Herrett build on a Savage 340

I have to get the lathe moved and set up......
 
Here is the progress on the experimental rifle.
9mm barrel is chambered to 34 mm deep using 357 max reamer, press-fitted and headspaced into the bored-out 303 stub. Cartridge casing ends up being 36mm even, so it is 9x36. Bolt head is being modified for controlled feed. Extractor needs modification, for the claw being too forward from the bolt face. Mag is from Norinco 223 bolt action, has not been properly fitted yet. Hoping to hit the range next weekend, fingers crossed.
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romayama said:
Here is the progress on the experimental rifle.
9mm barrel is chambered to 34 mm deep using 357 max reamer, press-fitted and headspaced into the bored-out 303 stub. Cartridge casing ends up being 36mm even, so it is 9x36. Bolt head is being modified for controlled feed. Extractor needs modification, for the claw being too forward from the bolt face. Mag is from Norinco 223 bolt action, has not been properly fitted yet. Hoping to hit the range next weekend, fingers crossed.

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Click to expand...

I am intrigued with that bolt head modification
 
Wishing All a Happy New Year!

Had a chance to make maiden shots today out of the test rig.
I don't have a chronograph so only was judging by the visual reports at 100-200 yds.
Random loads tested today:
- 147gr Berry's plated bullet, 17 gr of H110
- 147gr Berry's plated bullet, compressed load of Pyrodex
- 147gr Berry's plated bullet, 18 gr of compressed garbage mixed middle-burn-rate rifle powders from the dispenser spills.

- H110 load has a stout felt recoil, comparable or higher than 7.62×39 or 357 mag, but lower than 308. Velocity by observation of bullet splash was fast for this type of projectile, guesstimated at 2000+fps, no sign of flattened primer at all
- Black powder substitute is pleasantly mild, lower velocity than H110.
- 18gr of compressed garbage mix had the lowest recoil, ideal for plinking, or for young shooters. Also very quiet, definitely subsonic. I suspect a spray of unburned powder as well
In all cases fireforming worked as expected - necks got straightened. Overall I consider this experiment a success, just need to finish mag and ejection.

P.S. There is a joke about reloader's wife:
"- Honey, while cleaning your bench, I noticed you had a bunch of partially finished jugs, so I poured everything in one, to save you space - see how I care about you and your hobby!".
Here is how idea of garbage powder mix came to mind, haha. A marriage saver. Speaking seriously, this is not safe, but as long as there is no pistol powder in the mix and cartridge is a straight-wall, you know...

Short vids of test firing the H110 loads
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