questions for hunters who have been to africa

MiG25

MiG25

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ok, since i would like to hunt africa *someday* (i can find the time and money to go, but in the interest of domestic harmony, there are other things that have to come first for the next 3-5 years), i would like some input from those who have been once or more than once.

basically, what did you do and what would you do the same or differently?

things like would you skip the laundry list of plains game available and maybe just go for a buffalo or leopard with a couple of other things that come by? or taxidermy? it seems that taxidermy can add substancially to the cost. since you are already there would you take a week (or more) do the tourist type things like etosha, kruger, or victoria falls?

also, simple things like taking the time to do some bird shooting or fishing.

or would you skip africa and spend the money on hunting _________
 
I made a few mistakes, not the least of which was the failure to obtain an in transit gun permit prior to leaving. We had a 10 day hunt followed by a 10 photo safari. The hunting is better! During the photo safari you are trapped in a vehicle and they don't let you out much. Done that - don't need to do it again.

Tanzania is probably the most expensive, but it is safer than Zimbabwe, which is cheaper. Others might have differing opinions, but what I was told was not to got there with anyone you cared about. Carefully research your PH - this guy will make or break your experience. There are lots of hidden costs, so make sure you have a good understanding of the costs prior to leaving.

If you intend to take one rifle only, if buffalo are in the mix, a .375 is minimum, but it is an intelligent minimum, perfectly adequate for the buff, and not overly damaging to lesser game. I wouldn't go bigger than a .416, you don't need a stopping rifle, that's the pro's job. You could get by with 300 gr X's in the .375, and you won't need solids for a buffalo. The .416 could have X's in either 350 or 400 gr. Long shots are the exception to the rule.

When they ask you what kind of mount you want, the proper response is a full body mount, failure to say this will result in the head being cut off your hide. I thought that was a shame that I lost the head of the wildebeest, the nyala must be one of god's prettiest animals. The cheapest taxidermy is European mounts, where the skull is cleaned and mounted on a back board, a full body mount is the most expensive. Pedestal mounts are interesting, they take head and front quarter of the animal and mount it on a self supporting pedestal if wall space is a problem.

There was opportunity for bird shooting, we got guinea fowl and Egyptian geese. There was no fishing opportunity, but I'm sure it would be possible in some areas. The hunts are sold on 7,10, 16, and 30 day licences. The longer the hunt the more game you are entitled to. I passed up a fair bit of stuff I could of shot because I wanted to concentrate on buffalo. If you want a leopard or lion you will need the 30 day package, and that it beyond my budget.

Google Zuka Safaris. They are a South African concern that operates throughout Southern and Eastern Africa. They operate the camps that my PH used, the staff was more than we could of hoped for, the vehicles were in excellent shape, and the food was outstanding.

I got my Taxidermy done by Animal Artistry in the States. I didn't know how much of a problem it is to bring the green trophies directly into Canada, so I did it this way. Dodgleg might have better information about this, same with BUM and Back40sniper.
 
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the only way elephant or lion is going to happen for me is if the super 7 is good to me. i can see being able to swing leopard or buffalo, with a couple of other animals thrown in. this would also limit the amount of taxidermy, i don't need to live in a natural history museum.

i am certainly a few years off and zimbabwe may go the way of rwanda by then and i am not too keen on spending money there anyways as long as things are the way they are now.

i might also have spent the money on fly in hunting in bc. time will tell.

the voice of experience is always a good one.
 
Having seen Cape Buffalo up close, I would not spend the money to hunt one. They look like pissed off, drugged out cows.

I wouldn't do a whole lot different, I would start taking cold FX two weeks before I went and take more cold medicine with me. We hunted plains game only, it went very well for us, we had a great time.

I wouldn't go to Zimbabwe for political reasons, and I would'nt spend the $10k+ for a week long buff hunt.
 
I would do a few things differently starting with adding as many days as feasible. I did the couple plains game hunts for experience, then buffalo route which is fairly normal. That may be normal, but I'd start with buffalo and incidental plains game instead. If you consider yourself an experienced hunter and hardened shooter you can do the same. By hardened I mean you would cheerfully walk a couple days to bet a few thousand bucks on one off-hand shot in front of a bunch doubting witnesses, because that pretty much sums up what you're doing. No pressure.;) Some people can't sink an 8 ball or a short putt under pressure, don't be one of them.
What I'm thinking is better is the program I've settled on now, to plan the hunt around a couple big ticket animals and let the antelope take care of themselves. What I'm going to do in July is hunt NT elephant, with buffalo on the side. Easy to do that way, but hard to do the other way. If leopard is what turns your crank, then deal with people that will get baits out on your buffalo hunts and will let you add leopard for the trophy fees if you get hit.That way you always have a line in the water, and its less stressful than watching your hunt days disappear while Chui ain't chewin'. If you want lion, use buffalo or elephant for bait. Play around for awhile and you're bound to trip over your kudu sooner or later. In the end I think it's cheaper if big 5 species are on your life list of things to do.
It's interesting how people will grow up reading the old time African stories about intrepid Great White Hunters going to hunt despite unsettled and possibly dangerous natives, poor transportation, disease and uncertainty, then balk at hunting Zimbabwe because of unsettled and potentially dangerous natives, poor transportation,logistics, disease and uncertainty. I'm not sure I'd want to bet a once in a lifetime hunt on the country, but Zim's very faults add a certain grim reality to the experience.
 
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Dogleg said:
I would do a few things differently starting with adding as many days as feasible. I did the couple plains game hunts for experience, then buffalo route which is fairly normal. That may be normal, but I'd start with buffalo and incidental plains game instead. If you consider yourself an experienced hunter and hardened shooter you can do the same. By hardened I mean you would cheerfully walk a couple days to bet a few thousand bucks on one off-hand shot in front of a bunch doubting witnesses, because that pretty much sums up what you're doing. No pressure.;) Some people can't sink an 8 ball or a short putt under pressure, don't be one of them.
What I'm thinking is better is the program I've settled on now, to plan the hunt around a couple big ticket animals and let the antelope take care of themselves. What I'm going to do in July is hunt NT elephant, with buffalo on the side. Easy to do that way, but hard to do the other way. If leopard is what turns your crank, then deal with people that will get baits out on your buffalo hunts and will let you add leopard for the trophy fees if you get hit.That way you always have a line in the water, and its less stressful than watching your hunt days disappear while Chui ain't chewin'. If you want lion, use buffalo or elephant for bait. Play around for awhile and you're bound to trip over your kudu sooner or later. In the end I think it's cheaper if big 5 species are on your life list of things to do.
It's interesting how people will grow up reading the old time African stories about intrepid Great White Hunters going to hunt despite unsettled and possibly dangerous natives, poor transportation, disease and uncertainty, then balk at hunting Zimbabwe because of unsettled and potentially dangerous natives, poor transportation,logistics, disease and uncertainty. I'm not sure I'd want to bet a once in a lifetime hunt on the country, but Zim's very faults add a certain grim reality to the experience.
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My beef with Zimbabwe is twofold.
First the selfish part, it took me three years to save for and plan my safari and I don't think anyone can accuately predict what Zim will look like next week, much less three years from now.
The second part is Old Bob will never see a dime of my money. I know the story of supporting the PH's and their crews working on the ground in Zim, but that country is so corrupt and screwed up that you just know Mugabe is taking a cut.
 
Great posts you guys. I truly appreciate the input, simply because I too have been planning a hunt. So far, I've printed out Boomer's and Dogleg's post as good references. Here's the deal: I nearly booked with Sandhurst Safaris, very expensive. Their booking agent here concerned me and for good reasons after I spoke with references on their brochure. They say a lot of great things about Sandhurst, but not so good about the booking agent, no need to mention names, but those of you in the know will...well know who I'm talking about. Now, I'm talking to Bowker Safaris and Lucca. Lucca seems like a great outfit, I've talked to the PH in person, great guy. But, I want to bring my wife and any BS and crap is just not gonna happen. She wants to come on a picture Safari and I feel blessed to have a wife so understanding of my hunting wants that I truly don't want problems and want her to enjoy the trip. I've already talked to a taxidermist, airfare is a go, but I can't help but feeling uneasy about the hunt and the shipping of my trophies. Am I talking to the right people? like Bowker and Lucca, they had a display at the Sportsman show in Calgary.

Edit: oh...what about tipping. I've heard from some that tipping is frowned upon because the native worker will leave the joint as soon as they see some cash, in other brochures, I see tipping as an option. What is an expected tip ?
 
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Gitterdun,
Tipping is normal. Squabbling amongst the black help over who should have got more than the other is normal, the person entrusted with a camp tip stealing it for himself is normal. Asking your PH what to do is normal, not liking his suggestions is normal too.
If you left about $1000 on a plains game hunt and about $1500 on a DG safari you would be somewhere in the ball park.It might be a little light on the DG hunt, some of those camps have 30 people working in them. Some give more, some a lot less. About 2/3 of that would be for the PH. Give your tips to the person directly, that way you know they got it. Most safari outfits prefer that method anyway, they want the help to know where the money came from, and some don't want to be accused of skimming for themselves. Frankly the whole tipping thing leaves me uncomfortable, not so much because I'm cheap as because the whole thing is foreign to me. Just do what makes you comfortable.
 
Martinbns,
I'd say that all of those countries are corrupt, it just a matter of degree. I wouldn't plan 3 years in advance for Zim, 3 months is about it. Even then it isn't a good move for some, maybe even most people. Depending on how the election goes, my hunt may not take place either. My deposit is being held in the States til the last minute.
 
Jeff Cooper went to Rhodesia before the rot set in, and opined that it added to the experience to hunt in a war zone as had been the experience of those who opened the American West or for that matter East Africa. Cooper left his wife at home!

If I were to do a solo hunt I might pick Zim, but I have a serious hate on for Mugabe and would hate to add to his coffers. That would be the cause of a serious moral delima for me. Another way of looking at it though is that one should not blame and subsequently financially punish those who live in the country for the actions of the dictator. Perhaps by the time I can afford to return, the situation will of been resolved. I would not hesitate to hunt Botswana, and the Okavango Delta would be remarkable to see.
 
Dogleg said:
Gitterdun,
Tipping is normal. Squabbling amongst the black help over who should have got more than the other is normal, the person entrusted with a camp tip stealing it for himself is normal. Asking your PH what to do is normal, not liking his suggestions is normal too.
If you left about $1000 on a plains game hunt and about $1500 on a DG safari you would be somewhere in the ball park.It might be a little light on the DG hunt, some of those camps have 30 people working in them. Some give more, some a lot less. About 2/3 of that would be for the PH. Give your tips to the person directly, that way you know they got it. Most safari outfits prefer that method anyway, they want the help to know where the money came from, and some don't want to be accused of skimming for themselves. Frankly the whole tipping thing leaves me uncomfortable, not so much because I'm cheap as because the whole thing is foreign to me. Just do what makes you comfortable.
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I felt the same way about the tipping thing, I kept asking my PH what to tip and he wouldn't give me any advise at all. He kept saying if you feel the guys earned it tip what you think is fair. I ended up tipping about $800 total along with 4 knives I brought with me.
 
Dogleg said:
Martinbns,
I'd say that all of those countries are corrupt, it just a matter of degree. I wouldn't plan 3 years in advance for Zim, 3 months is about it. Even then it isn't a good move for some, maybe even most people. Depending on how the election goes, my hunt may not take place either. My deposit is being held in the States til the last minute.
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I get that, it's just not in my DNA being a banker and all to not know if it's going to happen until 3 months before. I sent my deposit 18 months before and booked my flights 8 months before mine.

I was just so involved in the planning process, for me it was almost as enjoyable as the hunt itself. Once I commiitted to it and got my wife to commit as well I just had to know it would happen for me. I was also taking Martinbns jr with me and didn't relish the thought of explaining to my wife I lost her son in a country with travel warnings already in place.

I might do Namibia or Botswana next, botswana is very expensive for plains game.
 
i am no expert, but i think things in zimbabwe will get a lot worse before they get better, and i certainly don't want to be there when things go bad. also, i don't want my money extending mugabe's rule. that said, in the time frame that i am looking at, mugabe should be gone, and who knows how things will play out at the time.

theoretically, i agree with dogleg about going for a big ticket animal and let the others take care of themselves, there are a lot of people who go and take 1 or 2 animals a day and i question how good of an experience it really is. i am not going to pay (more than a licence fee) to hunt a whitetail deer and i don't want to pay to hunt the african equivalent.

the more i consider things, the more i like the idea of leopard/kudu/gemsbok in namibia; direct flights are available from frankfurt, i hear they have good beer, lack of tropical diseases, good roads (no air charter), no need for a new rifle. all things that increase enjoyment and add to the affordability.
 
martinbns said:
Shh Shh, be very very quiet, Lesley doens't know yet.
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Oh, she knows, don't kid yourself.;) The wives always know.
I'm not suggesting that anyone else go hunting in Zimbabwe, I'm just saying that I'm doing it. The point of my post was that is someone wanted to hunt dangerous game and felt they had the abilities to just do it, and not bother with the warm-up. As you know, its hard to just go once, and I feel that you will trip over enough plains game while hunting buffalo and such to fill a crate. If a person's dream was buffalo, leopard, or elephant hunting it would be a shame to not go for it, just in case it did turn out to be a one and only trip. I also think that when you are already paying dangerous game rates you may as well make the most of them by going for more than one species. Leopard, lion and elephant combine well with buffalo hunting. At least, that's the way I think now.
I'm not a long term planner as far as hunting goes. My first safari plan was to find out about a cancelation, paying for it the next day and asking my wife if she wanted to come along. 6 weeks later we were on a plane and had a great time. That sort of thing drives my wife nuts, but it fits my nature and even my occupation well.
Mike
 
Lesley is chuckling beside me as I read this thread. Our deal is she gets her dream holiday which is a multi-city European trip before I get to go to Africa again.
In all likelyhood, I could go hunt Buff and Leopard for less than that trip will cost, but that's why they call successful marriages a partnership.

I am working on her to come along the next time, probably no sooner than 2010 for me.
 
Listen to what Mike is saying, if you really want to hunt buff. then go hunt buff. Most of the people that always seem to say you should do a PG hunt first as a warm up and then go for DG, usually seem to be booking agents and are looking to get 2 trips worth of commision out of a hunter.

But if I was taking my kid with me on a hunt I would really have to think about a DG hunt. I am not sure I could do that either.

My dream trip was booked for 21 day in Tanzania in 2009. Now that the tanz. gov. has changed all of the prices and concession fees, that has been cancelled. I don't mind spending some money for this trip but the rate increase was just too much to handle.

Problem solved just changed countries and we (wife and I) are now hunting Namibia in 2009. This is our first trip and I really wanted to chase buff. So we are doing a 10 day plains game hunt and then changing areas and doing a 13 day Buffalo/Hippo/Croc hunt.

I was using the same logic as somebody else mentions earlier, what if we don't make it back there for a second trip. So we are trying to make it as close to a perfect trip as we can.

Keep us posted on what you decide to do?

Graylake
 
Well, not sure if I can add anything more than my two cents but here goes.

I started off last year thinking that it would be my only trip to africa so make it count. I hunted plains game and went a few days longer than most go...12 hunting days, which I consider just about perfect. Not so long that (perish the thought) it gets boring or mundane, but long enough that you get to be a bit choosy about what you shoot and pass up bad shots or inferior animals. Plus with that many days we were able to hunt a few different places. I hunted three different places and Charlie hunted two (we abandoned them one afternoon in search of a pig for Doug...and I came out of the deal with a whopper Gemsbok and a beauty Springbok).

Of course, before we were even finished with the first trip, Charlie and I were makign noises about going back for buffalo. We had a close encounter while driving around one area, and that was enough for me. The plan is in motion for me to head back in 2009. I'll likely go with one of the PHs from my first hunt who's gone out on his own in the last year.

I have price lists from his outfit, but that's as far as I'll delve into that topic on the main board, since though I'm not doing business, I don't want anyone getting cranky at me.

The one thing that I found with my group was that it was too big. There were two guys hunting for many animals and one guy hunting for just a few. Then there were two observers along. I found that having that many people there limited the amount of "walk and stalk" that we were able to do. I would not be as feasable to traipse around the veldt with a group of seven. Plus it would have been mush less interesting for the people just there to watch and take photos. Consequently we spent a lot of time riding around in the truck together. On my next trip I plan to go just with my brother, who wants to observe. That should allow us more latitude to cut tracks in the truck and dismount to stalk. Not that I didn't enjoy the camaraderie of the group, on the contrary, I enjoyed it immensely and would love to go with a big crew again. If you're thinking about taking a bunch of people with you, talk to your PH and make sure that there will be enough PHs in camp to facilitate the style of hunting you want, be it sitting on waterholes, walk and stalk or the euphemistic "diesel stalking". None of them are better than others, but you should give some thought to your preferred hunting method and talk to your PH about it.

As for tips, we didn't tip as much as maybe we should have. We had two PHs, one who owned th eoperation and another that worked for him. We didn't give the owner a tip as he had collected a great deal of our personal exchequer for various antelopes and gazelles. The other PH was absolutely mad about my iPod so I took a collection and we bought him on when we got back to Canada along with a car kit for him. When it was all said and done it was maybe about $400, roughly the amount he was paid for a month's work. Should probably have been more, but a group of retired three people, one Rig Pig and one Queen's Cowboy pinches their pennies pretty tight. Still, if I can send some hunters Les' way I figure that it will all even out in the end.
 
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