Dark 40 1911 thread.

Status
Not open for further replies.

kurtk01

Member
EE Expired
Rating - 100%
4   0   1
Location
Winnipeg, MB
This thread is for everything and anything to do with Rodger Kotanko's Dark 40 40 cal 1911.

I started this thread because there is no info or feedback for the owners and potential owners out there.

There Dark 40 is a 40 cal double stack 1911 designed by Rodger Kotanko of Dark international and Trading Company/RK Custom Guns.

The Pistol's frame, slide, and barrel are manufactured in China by Chinese Arsenals. It is NOT a Norinco. Norinco is the exporter of there own Pistols from Chinese Arsenals.

The Frame and slide may look like the Norinco NP-30 or NP-28 or Para Ordnance, but that's where the similarity ends this pistol was designed and built specifically for the 40 S&W Cartridge the frame has a 40 S&W breech face and a supported barrel. The grip is slimmer than for example a Para Ordnance therefore it will only accept it's own Mags, it will not accept Para Mags. The Ambi Thumb Safeties are wider and won't bite your hand.

The Chinese forged steel is far superior in strength (bomb Proof) then the steel North American Gun makers use. Another example, Para Ordnance uses cast steel.

It is sold stock $650 as is from the factory. Half the price of a Para. But most people use it as a platform to build upon which would end up costing for Example about the same price as a new Para Ordnance stock. Then Factor in the cost of building up a Para to an IPSC Standard Pistol, the math speaks for itself. Rodger Kotanko is also the Gunsmith that does all the work on them.

Features include stock: Full length guide rod, Modified and wider ambidextrous thumb safeties, Modified beaver tail, Extended slide release, Supported barrel, Front & rear serrations, 1911 Style rubber grips, Highly visible sights, Tempered steel magazines, 2 ten round magazines.

With stock parts a 3 pound trigger weight can be achieved, and with aftermarket parts e.g. Hammer, Sear, Trigger, a 2/2.5 pounds respectively.

Rodger is also know for his popular Magwell work. When he mounts a magwell he doesn't just attach it to the bottom of the grip, he Cuts part of the grip off and welds the magwell to the frame refinishes it and reblues it. one of the many advantages is that this gun will now fit in a IPSC Size Box and also never come loose Price for this......$150 installed parts and labor! wow!

There are many other features that can be added: Magwell, Match barrels (Bull), fiber optic front sites, Bomar/ LPA/ 10-8 rear sites or many others, checkered backstraps, Customized Trigger, Match Grade Internals, Chroming, Lightening of the Slide. Rebluing etc......

And the magazines that come with this gun are all tempered by Roger for maximum strength and durability.

$650 CDN for a New Stock Dark 40.

12625dark_3.jpg















This One is mine and Customized. It has a Clark Match Bull Barrel installed. Pardon the unprofessional Pictures.


http://ww w.darkinternational.com/

I finally had time to head to the range. I tested my customized Dark 40 and a Standard Dark 40. They were both extremely accurate. I put 200 rounds through both pistols without malfunction. The action was so smooth. The Mercury Guide Rod really did work. I was suprised, I had always thought they were just a gimick. It smoothes out the felt recoil, softens it. And i was very suprised to find that the regular pistol had very little recoil and that's without a bull barrel and a Murcury Guide Rod. Both pistols had the factory sights and they are excellent, and sight picture acquisition was very fast. I think i will get an adjustable rear STI competition sight put on mine. I own a CZ Tactical Soprt also in 40 S&W and until I shot the Dark 40 I thought it was the best pistol out there for me, now it`s hands down the Dark 40.

I'm very happy with my Dark 40's and feel that it was money well spent.

I live in Winnipeg, MB and am offering demo's to anyone interested in trying it out.
Please feel free to Private Message me and leave your phone number or e-mail where i can reach you, and we can set up a time, date, and range to meet.

(NOTE): Individuals interested must possess and show PAL Licence. Only factory Ammunition provided by you is accepted. (NO Reloads) If you are not able to purchase your own factory ammunition, under certain circumstances i can provide ammunition for a fee. Please indicate this in your e-mail.

Comments about Para Ordnance are comparisons only. Para Ordnance Makes time tested Quality Firearms.

Thanks.

Note that i am not an employee of Dark International. I am a customer on here during my free time because i want to promote Rodger Kotanko's skills as a Pistol/Gunsmith.
 
Last edited:
I've kept an eye on this pistol for some time and found out very little about it.
Seeing you have one, how is the grip as compared to a Para double stack?
The magazines you have pictured, are the base pads original?
how much are magazines?
does it have a ramped barrel?
How much for the fibre optic front sight, and mag well modification ?
If it's $650.00 he really should have updated his site, I would have bought one but now my "fun" money has been spent on another pistol.
 
I wonder how a $650 Dark 40 compares to a Para in a double stacked .40?
For about half the price of a Para I would take a Dark 40. I have talked with a couple guys at the range and they wished they had bought the Dark 40 instead of there Para's. For difference in price and knowing it comes from Roger I would have a serious look at it. You can't go wrong with dealing with Roger.
 
Sure it is :rolleyes:

Funny you react this way. My friend who is now retired but used to be one of the main machinests at Para Ordnance and is a master machinest and one hell of a gunsmith also commented on how much harder the steel the the Norcinco's are. I had him replace the sights for me on one I had and he could not break the front site off with pliers, he had to mill it off.
 
The reason for the $300 dollar premium is the cost to develope this gun. He sent the design for this gun to Chinese arsenals and they made him a batch.

They are not mass produce like the 1911's from the Exporter Norinco that you can buy for $369 from Marstar so they cost more to manufacture and bring in to Canada.

The frame of this gun looks like the NP-30 but is different, the beaver tail was designed differently. The frame in my opinion is the same as a para but of heavier and harder chinese forged steel. And the Slide and Barrel is designed specifically by rodger for the 40 S&W Cartridge. There is also serations on the foward end of the slide as well. The whole gun has been built with more detail.

eventually i will include a range report in this thread with grouping pictures as well.
 
Last edited:
Funny you react this way. My friend who is now retired but used to be one of the main machinests at Para Ordnance and is a master machinest and one hell of a gunsmith also commented on how much harder the steel the the Norcinco's are. I had him replace the sights for me on one I had and he could not break the front site off with pliers, he had to mill it off.
Para Ordnance guns are investment cast, so any forged steel gun will be harder. And one has to remember that hard is not necessarily good. Steel that is too hard is typically brittle and prone to cracking. Of course, too soft is also bad because it wears quickly. The best ordnance steel strikes a balance between the two.
 
Hello everyone!

I've added new photo's and updated the info Regarding the Dark 40.

It's a work in progress.

And I'm officially the new Rep of the dark 40, for Dark International.

Let me know what you think.

Thanks guys.
 
So, now that this is an ad. ( and I'm ok with that)
How much and how long would the wait be for;
-Dark40 gun with 6 mags
+molded in mag well as you describe
+checkered flat backstrap
+adjustable rear sight
+fiber optic front sight
+ tuned 3 pound trigger
+remove the extended slide stop and install a regular one
+pin the grip safety
+thin checkered wood grips
PM me if you don't wish to post it , I'm curious
Thanks
 
Sorry for the wait guys. There range report will be posted sometime next week. I've been busy and not enough time to head to the range.

Cam.
 
Para Ordnance guns are investment cast, so any forged steel gun will be harder. And one has to remember that hard is not necessarily good. Steel that is too hard is typically brittle and prone to cracking. Of course, too soft is also bad because it wears quickly. The best ordnance steel strikes a balance between the two.

"Norinco" (Chinese State Arsenals) guns (the steel ones) are made using 5100 series steel, so that there can be no misunderstanding, it is a superior raw material for making firearms. This raw material is then forged which is also a superior method for producing firearms, because it creates a very tough exterior while preserving the ductile qualities of the steel. Claven2 posted this information many moons ago, nothing has changed. If the Western makers could afford the labour and necessary tooling (carbide cutters - most of which are produced in China) to make guns this way they would. Can we move on now?
 
Last edited:
IMO it don't matter how the gun is or is not made and of what material.
cast or forged will not make a difference to 99% of the buyers out there, very few people have the time and resources to shoot the volume of rounds that would make the difference. Double charge either and you still have a screwed pistol.
And as for a range report, not much of your pistol is original. It's also pretty common knowledge how good of a pistol smith RK is. Although bring it on, we'll tune in.
On a side note, did you ever get that quote I requested?
Thanks
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top Bottom