PRS First Build In Kanuckastan
- Thread starter NikiQue
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As someone who shoots a lot of prs throughout Canada and the US, I wouldn’t go with the tract.
There are much better scopes for the money. Just because there’s “advancements in glass” doesn’t mean the rest of the scope is up to the job.
Also, be very weary of YouTube reviews, most of them have either asked for free product to do the review, or are some mid pack mafia trying to get recognized so they get free product.
I personally know 4 Americans who have used them, they all switched within 1 season.
Look at the EE, there’s lots of options there on the used market.
There are much better scopes for the money. Just because there’s “advancements in glass” doesn’t mean the rest of the scope is up to the job.
Also, be very weary of YouTube reviews, most of them have either asked for free product to do the review, or are some mid pack mafia trying to get recognized so they get free product.
I personally know 4 Americans who have used them, they all switched within 1 season.
Look at the EE, there’s lots of options there on the used market.
Thx for the heads up. I still haven't pulled the trigger on a Tract scope. I keep questioning myself on this and as it seems for good reason. Any recommendations? I have looked at NF, Vortex, Steiner, and a few others. I hate breaking the bank but know I have to spend money on a good scope to compete. Looking in EE now. Thx Man
Optics are always a hard one, for me anyways. I have tried many over the years, and still keep trying new ones.
My latest is the arken SH4J. Just running it through its paces, but I probably wouldn't buy one for any kind of long range competitions.
Have a March High Master 4.5-28x 52 that is real nice, but you are going to push a budget with it. I have other alpha glass that is better as well, but really push your budget then.
One that comes to mind that I was intrigued with also is the sightron. https://www.tesro.ca/optics-sights/riflescopes/sightron-sviii-ffp-5-40x56-ed-irlrm-zero-stop.html
I have not tried this one, but I have looked at it, and keeps coming up all the time. I did use an Stac years back and was blown away by the clarity for a $700 scope back 10 ish years ago.
My latest is the arken SH4J. Just running it through its paces, but I probably wouldn't buy one for any kind of long range competitions.
Have a March High Master 4.5-28x 52 that is real nice, but you are going to push a budget with it. I have other alpha glass that is better as well, but really push your budget then.
One that comes to mind that I was intrigued with also is the sightron. https://www.tesro.ca/optics-sights/riflescopes/sightron-sviii-ffp-5-40x56-ed-irlrm-zero-stop.html
I have not tried this one, but I have looked at it, and keeps coming up all the time. I did use an Stac years back and was blown away by the clarity for a $700 scope back 10 ish years ago.
It's frustrating, especially in the mid range priced scopes. So many options and so many different opinions. I was going to buy a Tract but after hearing about some of the Pro's using them for a year and then dropping it made me decide against it.
I have read about the Sightron, haven't tried one but it looks interesting as you mentioned.The March High Master is a good scope and have had the opportunity to try one on a friends rifle. Worth the coin.
I have used high end scopes in the past and am starting to think it might be the only way to go now.
Will probably breakdown and pay the extra for either one of these as I have used both and have been very impressed.
Nightforce Optics ATACR 7-35x56 MIL-R™ F1
Vortex Optics Razor HD Gen III 6-36x56 FFP Riflescope: 34mm Tube, EBR-7D (MRAD) Reticle
Most shops in Canada are sold out of both but have a chance at a New Vortex Gen III for 4k.
Can only find The NightForce Mil-R used for about the same.
Both reticles are similar and what I like to use.
Tough decision, I don't want to get squeezed for even more cash for the same scopes because of the Canadian Paso dumping and 2025 pricing for new stock. I guess go big or go home.
Thx Wallz
if you have a chance at a gen3 for 4k id jump on it.
i run gen3 razors on all my stuff, and i put mine through absolute hell for 2 seasons shooting prs, and not one single issue. most of my buddies use them with the same results, zero issues. the warrenty is a nice insurance. alot of people #### on vortex, but i cant see why.
when we were at nationals last year, there were ALOT of shooters complaining they couldnt make out targets, i had not one issue in tough lighting conditions. thats where alot of the guys running the tracts were struggling to see outlines of shot up targets.
Me, I like to think that I will replace the rifle long before I replace the scope, so try and spend as much as I can tolerate on the optic. I find it easier to upgrade rifles than to upgrade optics.
Plus, you can't shoot at what you can't see.
I gave the march a try because it is a smaller footprint for what you actually get, and ruled others out because of the "large" footprint.
Plan was to spin a new barrel on the current bench rifle the march is on and use it as a short handy hunting rifle.
The vortex gen III is highly recommended as well, I just don't have a use for the footprint and weight combination of them. Heck even the zies LRP line are worth a comparison at that point.
You might also want to start looking at a barrel heat deflector as well if you shoot longer strings. Took me months of fiddling with all sorts of things, and even my eye prescription before I even thought about the barrel heat messing with optics. I had my son 3D print some adapters for the rail, and over the tuner that I have a rudimentary black stretch band that is 2.5" wide over the barrel. Had the parts printed to hold it with a slight upward U-shape that helps deflect the heat around the vision area and works wonderfully.
Plus, you can't shoot at what you can't see.
I gave the march a try because it is a smaller footprint for what you actually get, and ruled others out because of the "large" footprint.
Plan was to spin a new barrel on the current bench rifle the march is on and use it as a short handy hunting rifle.
The vortex gen III is highly recommended as well, I just don't have a use for the footprint and weight combination of them. Heck even the zies LRP line are worth a comparison at that point.
You might also want to start looking at a barrel heat deflector as well if you shoot longer strings. Took me months of fiddling with all sorts of things, and even my eye prescription before I even thought about the barrel heat messing with optics. I had my son 3D print some adapters for the rail, and over the tuner that I have a rudimentary black stretch band that is 2.5" wide over the barrel. Had the parts printed to hold it with a slight upward U-shape that helps deflect the heat around the vision area and works wonderfully.
Thanks for your vote of confidence on the Vortex. Sharing your experiences are greatly appreciated and you along with others have helped me make the right decision. I just pulled the trigger on the Vortex and feel relieved I went in this direction. The pocket book will suffer but in the long run it's worth the investment.
Wallz you also had a hand in my decision making process and in the above quote you make key points that I all ready new, just needed a push an a nudge to get back on track. Thx
The Barrel Heat Detector is a great idea and I need to explore this further. I can see its benefits for scope life even if you're not doing longer strings. Zero experience with 3D printing, has your son every thought of selling them? You made another point about your eye prescription, it's another thing I have to take into account as I wear glasses for long distance. Hasn't caused much of an issue in the past with the Vortex. I see your in PG, I have Tom doing some work for me right now, seems like a nice guy.
You can't go wrong with the Razor Gen 3, that's what I run on my comp guns and they are a fantastic optic! You won't be disappointed. I'm also actually just starting to evaluate the DNT The One and am curious to see how it stacks up to more expensive optics. I've been meaning to for a while but the holidays get a bit hectic...
Nice! The nice thing too is expensive optics hold their value, so resale is good.
One thing I recommend, send it back to vortex and get the locking elevation delete done, locking turrets are annoying for prs. Also ask them to do the turret upgrade, they basically clean the factory grease and use a different weight to make the clicks more tactile.
Both are completely free, and turnaround time is really quick.
The DNT was never really a serious contender in my eyes. It was suggested by a couple rifle builders that it would be a good PRS scope but Like the Tract it has its limitations. It was important for me to choose a good scope that I didn't have to replace the following year because of its down falls. The lower and mid priced scopes are coming out fast and furious and non are game changers. Just more of the same to keep the consumer spending.
I will be curious to hear if you come to the same conclusions on the DNT.
I didn't realize I could get these mods done for free and know one has ever suggested them to me before. I will look into this right away as my first rifle build won't be done for a couple weeks yet. Will give Vortex a call when they are open.
Just like a kid in a candy store, and here I thought starting over was going to be a pain in the ###.
Researching
Just found this tidbit of information. It's a spacer that goes underneath the elevation turret stopping the turret from locking.
https://www.mkmachining.com/product/razor-gen-iii-turret-spacer-copy/
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Yeah, I mean, comparing MSRPs it's about 15% the cost of the Razor G3. My intention is more to see how fitting it is as a PRS scope for people on a budget. I don't expect it to compete with a Razor G2 or G3 but those are just out of lots of people's price bracket and that's fair.
As to the locking elevation turret on the G3, I've been using them for 3 years now and never found the locking feature to be a hassle, they stay unlocked when set that way but that's me.
With corrective lenses, first priority has to go to clear view of target and reticle through the scope. Having in your head the directions to click for up, down, left, right should mean not needing to see the dials until time to go back to zero.
I agree completely, for PRS production class and even long range shooting the DNT, Tract and others would be excellent options. I also think the lesser price tag for scopes and rifles help the sport grow which is something we really need.
Again I will be curious to hear more reviews around scopes like this and I am hoping to see them in action at some point.
The locking turret will probably not be a problem on the Gen III but was interested to see others experiences and options out there.
Always learning.
It is a big change between your initial list and the updated one in terms of barrel, action, bipod and scope. I am guessing you have a set amount of budget for the build, if you spend more on barrel/action etc, you may have to take the budget from other parts of the rifle, correct?
And you shoot factory ammo, right?
If your budget isn't relatively flexible without scope, I would recommend:
1.fix the action first, it will stay with you almost for life
2.after the action is decided, you would be able to pick the barrel, either chambered by gunsmith or buying prefit and install yourself
3.consider TriggerTech Diamond over Bix'n Andy Tac Sport Pro-X would save you cost of a muzzle brake
4.pick your reticle and the features you want before choose scope, reticle is very personal and it works for others doesn't mean it works for you. Make sure you understand everything on the reticle before you make any decision.
I wouldn't consider a middle tier scope in the $2000-2500 range unless you like the reticle or specific feature from that scope model, or you will keep it forever, not upgrade it later.
If you have a hard budget for scope to be under $2500, the Apex Rival or Meopta Optika6 5-30 are the two from my list
I normally recommend to others if you want something under $1800, the new DNT 7-35 is the one with unbeatable price and performance, it will be enough for you to up skills untill you are ready to jump to $4500+ price range scope and you still have some resale value, the only thing it lacks at it's price range is the coating comparing to $2500+ scopes especially at low light condition, but I guess you would least likely shoot in those conditions unless you use it for hunting as well.
The next price range would be $3000-4500, it's a wide range with many options depends on your preference. Zeiss LRP S3 6-36 is at $3### range, Vortex Gen 3 Razor 6-36 or Element Theos 6-36 both will end up over $4000 unless you can get discount.
When you are prepared to upgrade or add a new build in the future for an alpha glass $5000+, I would check the Zeiss LRP S5 5-25, ZCO 5-27, Nightforce Atacr 7-35.
When you don't care about your credit card balance, Schmdit Bender CMII High Performance 6-36 and Tangent Theta 5-25/7-35 as they would be around the $7000-8000 range.
I would be interested in comparing the Kahles's new K328i and K540i from behind first, as their predecessors the K624, K525 models having obvious chromatic aberration effect especially at a sunny day, if you don't mind or can't tell, they are pretty good scope too.
And you shoot factory ammo, right?
If your budget isn't relatively flexible without scope, I would recommend:
1.fix the action first, it will stay with you almost for life
2.after the action is decided, you would be able to pick the barrel, either chambered by gunsmith or buying prefit and install yourself
3.consider TriggerTech Diamond over Bix'n Andy Tac Sport Pro-X would save you cost of a muzzle brake
4.pick your reticle and the features you want before choose scope, reticle is very personal and it works for others doesn't mean it works for you. Make sure you understand everything on the reticle before you make any decision.
I wouldn't consider a middle tier scope in the $2000-2500 range unless you like the reticle or specific feature from that scope model, or you will keep it forever, not upgrade it later.
If you have a hard budget for scope to be under $2500, the Apex Rival or Meopta Optika6 5-30 are the two from my list
I normally recommend to others if you want something under $1800, the new DNT 7-35 is the one with unbeatable price and performance, it will be enough for you to up skills untill you are ready to jump to $4500+ price range scope and you still have some resale value, the only thing it lacks at it's price range is the coating comparing to $2500+ scopes especially at low light condition, but I guess you would least likely shoot in those conditions unless you use it for hunting as well.
The next price range would be $3000-4500, it's a wide range with many options depends on your preference. Zeiss LRP S3 6-36 is at $3### range, Vortex Gen 3 Razor 6-36 or Element Theos 6-36 both will end up over $4000 unless you can get discount.
When you are prepared to upgrade or add a new build in the future for an alpha glass $5000+, I would check the Zeiss LRP S5 5-25, ZCO 5-27, Nightforce Atacr 7-35.
When you don't care about your credit card balance, Schmdit Bender CMII High Performance 6-36 and Tangent Theta 5-25/7-35 as they would be around the $7000-8000 range.
I would be interested in comparing the Kahles's new K328i and K540i from behind first, as their predecessors the K624, K525 models having obvious chromatic aberration effect especially at a sunny day, if you don't mind or can't tell, they are pretty good scope too.
The 3D printing is neat for sure, but so darn specific. I think we printed like 5 or 6 different styles before we came onto something that would work. Too rifle specific to make it easy to mass produce and not worth the hassle, but yes I thought about it. Started off with coat hanger wire to hold the elastic band, but the 3D printed one just looks better and more functional.
I usually wear contacts when I shoot, so set my scopes up that way, so they are all the same when I get behind them.
Yea I've bought a few items from Tom. He is well known in the 22lr world, and sells some great products. Unfortunately he is ship only and even us locals can't just come in to pick up. I get the hesitation, but still a pain as we wait to 3 days for our orders instead of just picking them up.
For the deflectors some guys dual side tape on velcro and use mini blind vanes. I just don't want anything sticky on my barrel, so went another route.
