.577 snider loads
- Thread starter fiddler
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antiqueguy
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- windsor ontario
Never shoot smokeless in a .577 snider. Most are converted rifles muskets(iron barrels) for one and it’s just a huge cartridge with a low tolerance for pressure.
Shoot it as is with black powder or substitutes like pyrodex
Shoot it as is with black powder or substitutes like pyrodex
There's absolutely no reason to even contemplate it—loading for the Snider with black powder is so easy that the work to attempt to develop a safe smokeless load would make no sense.
Regarding barrels, even the Mk III Snider "steel" barrels were made the old way, with a continuous forge welded seam the length of the barrel. They switched to steel (also called homogeneous iron at the time) for its wear resistance and not to make the gun capable of handling more pressure. I've owned Sniders whose breechblocks were mushroomed so badly that they were barely usable and I've always suspected someone had subjected them to smokeless experiments. Wrought iron is malleable.
milsurpo
Regarding barrels, even the Mk III Snider "steel" barrels were made the old way, with a continuous forge welded seam the length of the barrel. They switched to steel (also called homogeneous iron at the time) for its wear resistance and not to make the gun capable of handling more pressure. I've owned Sniders whose breechblocks were mushroomed so badly that they were barely usable and I've always suspected someone had subjected them to smokeless experiments. Wrought iron is malleable.
milsurpo
antiqueguy
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- windsor ontario
Dominion loaded smokeless but I have a feeling it was one of the “bulk” smokeless powders that were available at the time. The bulk smokeless powders can be said to be about equivalent to 777 that is actually a smokeless volume equivalent powder much like the bulk smokeless powders of the early 1900’s.
Black powder or pyrodex are my choice though.
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I've considered smokeless Snider loads for a long time. The problem i ran into is there's no reliable data on max pressure for the 577 Snider available to even begin aproximating a load. Dominion did make smokeless loads, but it was a reduced power loading and using a powder formulation out of production with no good modern substitute from my understanding.
Were i to make a smokeless loading, i'd look at the 28 gauge load data for Hodgdon's LilGun and load down drastically, but without a max pressure for the 577 i couldn't even guess the ballpark to aim for pressure wise. Which is a shame, i've wanted to make a smokeless buckshot loading for my Snider for emergencies so i could bag small game without needing to clean it if i'm forced to overnight in the bush.
Were i to make a smokeless loading, i'd look at the 28 gauge load data for Hodgdon's LilGun and load down drastically, but without a max pressure for the 577 i couldn't even guess the ballpark to aim for pressure wise. Which is a shame, i've wanted to make a smokeless buckshot loading for my Snider for emergencies so i could bag small game without needing to clean it if i'm forced to overnight in the bush.
antiqueguy
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- windsor ontario
Not hard to boil a canteen cup of water and flush out a barrel. Or carry a mosin oil bottle with windshield washer fluid and a pull through.
It’s not a good idea in general for smokeless if any pressure with black powder gets under the breech block of a snider it turns into a auto eject I’d hate to see what would happen with smokeless.
Dominions ammo idk velocity but they used a bulk smokeless basically a volume for volume equivalent for black powder. their reasoning for the 1 5/8 inch case was to save brass and lose extra capacity even with standard charges of black theirs still a lot of room in that case.
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Barrel on mine's badly pitted, loves to trap fouling. Always takes an hour fifteen to an hour and a half to scrub the barrel clean with bronze brush and patches soaked in ballistol. Unpitted black powder sxs shotgun, i can clean both barrels in half an hour.
antiqueguy
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- windsor ontario
Sounds like lube is needed more than anything. Are you using real black powder or sub?
antiqueguy
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- windsor ontario
Something a little softer might be what’s needed 50/50 lard/tallow and beeswax.
antiqueguy
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- windsor ontario
Trailboss is dangerous. While it’s a bulky powder it have a very fast burn rate in testing done on British militaria forums it caused large pressure spikes in .577-450.
Best store bought lube is SPG. I put some in the grooves with my fingers. Since I started making you own lube I have settled on Beeswax and Olive oil mix of 50-50. Summer time I use more Beeswax so probably 60-40. I use it in my cap and ball revolvers also. I find it works well. I have always loaded with black powder.
The posted Question: Does anyone know a resource for smokeless data for a .577 snider?
Lots of word salad going on here but not one person could name or suggest a published resource, book, link, manual, or website with ANY Load Data.
The only published material I could find was Cartridges of the World where it has a very old listing of both BP and smokeless ( Fg, FL, and 4198) and bullet weights of 350, 450, 470, and 480.
Twelve responding comments with Zero answers ??? Just a whole bunch of personal comments of items that were not asked.
Does anyone know anything about data this load?
Lots of word salad going on here but not one person could name or suggest a published resource, book, link, manual, or website with ANY Load Data.
The only published material I could find was Cartridges of the World where it has a very old listing of both BP and smokeless ( Fg, FL, and 4198) and bullet weights of 350, 450, 470, and 480.
Twelve responding comments with Zero answers ??? Just a whole bunch of personal comments of items that were not asked.
Does anyone know anything about data this load?
Most of those personal comment are from Snider owners who have more than a few years experience shooting them, and the overwhelming answer is " no data and don't do it"
Even a MK111 gun has a very weak lock up, and to try and get the pressures down with smokeless powder is tough .
Unique and Green Dot and other fast pistol type powders have been used , but at the end of the day, black powder is much easier , more accurate , and safer to use.
The Snider Shooters forum has some smokeless loads on it from members, you should maybe try that forum if you are dead set on using smokeless powder in your Snider.
Cat
If you want to go against everyone’s experiences here go ahead it’s your gun and your life. Non of us use smokeless powder in our Sniders. I’ve sen two guns ruined by using so called safe smokeless loads.
