Gun or ammo issue?

bertn

bertn

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Shot a round of trap today and had two rounds not go off after each other. This was halfway into the round of trap so the first half went without issues.
I then switched over to use the other barrel and finished the round without further malfunctions.

See pics of the rounds.
Challenger 12ga. Shot about half a flat of this ammo out of my shotgun and have not had any issue before.

Gun is a Marocchi over under, no idea what model it is as it’s not marked on the gun
Bought it used a couple years ago, but have not used it until I started shooting clays a bit this year. it does not look used a lot and locks up very tight.

What is the collective mind here thinking, is it an Ammo or gun issue?

Thanks,
Bert
 

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Solid chance its the ammo. Especially with such a good strike on the primer. Best way to check is to use a different brand. There is also the chance that it was just a bad batch, it happens.

I used the Challenger brand for my TR410 (#7.5 Shot, 3" Shells), and the fired shells get completely stuck in the cylinder due to the brass part expanding too much.
 
Those primer strikes appear to be good!....:)

I'm thinking a bad primer in the round.

Do you have pics of fired hulls with the spent primer showing. If the indent in the fired hull and the faulty live round is the same depth, I would say it should be the primer and not the shotgun.........:unsure:
 
Thunderhog said:
Those primer strikes appear to be good!....:)

I'm thinking a bad primer in the round.

Do you have pics of fired hulls with the spent primer showing. If the indent in the fired hull and the faulty live round is the same depth, I would say it should be the primer and not the shotgun.........:unsure:
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Good call, unfortunately I did not look at fired ones and just threw them in the bucket..

For now I’m thinking of opening up the gun and clean and lubricate the internals to maybe “speed up” the firing pin.
 
The strike looks good, I would say bad primer, I have not shot any challenger lately but did burn through about 30 flats a few years back, never had 1 that didn't go bang
 
mikethepanda said:
Solid chance its the ammo. Especially with such a good strike on the primer. Best way to check is to use a different brand. There is also the chance that it was just a bad batch, it happens.

I used the Challenger brand for my TR410 (#7.5 Shot, 3" Shells), and the fired shells get completely stuck in the cylinder due to the brass part expanding too much.
Click to expand...
It is not possible for the brass to expand too much, the brass expansion is restricted by the chamber.

Did the extractor slip past the rim? I had this happen with some challenger and an 870 with a chamber that was not smoothed out properly, needed a hone. This happened less with high brass but happened with high end and low end low brass target ammo more than even low brass field loads.
 
Those firing pin strikes look real good Bert !! Like the others have said...I'm betting on the bad primers as well.

I've had a few of the factory Challengers with dud primers over the yrs.
They had some bad bad batches of CX2000 primers a while back too. We were using them solely when everything else dried up for the pandemic. My squadmate loaded 2 cases of 12 ga - 1oz ammo with Ched 209's. He had as many as 6 or 7 duds a few times on the SC course. We even tried some of his ammo in our guns...same same !
A couple of months ago he cut open the last 15 boxes of those CH 209 primed hulls. save the powder, wads and lead and reloaded it in some AA hulls (different wad) No more issues..LOL

**I also had a couple of dud primers in Fed Top Guns a few yrs ago too. Had two bad shells in one box, of the 5 cases I bought. So it does happen the odd time !
 
Not enough evidence of a culprit, shoot that barrel some more till you have a better indication.
 
Fox said:
It is not possible for the brass to expand too much, the brass expansion is restricted by the chamber.

Did the extractor slip past the rim? I had this happen with some challenger and an 870 with a chamber that was not smoothed out properly, needed a hone. This happened less with high brass but happened with high end and low end low brass target ammo more than even low brass field loads.
Click to expand...
Brass expansion is just a thing I've read in other places when it comes to .410 Gauge, that and .410 revolver shotguns can be picky with shells.

Pushing the ejector rod against a solid surface will get the empty shells out. One solution was to polish and lube the cylinder insides. Other possible fix is to try out 2 1/2 Shells and/or low brass (of a different brand).
 
Put them in the other barrel and see if they go bang.

Actually, try them again in the SAME barrel. If they STILL don't go bang, THEN try the other barrel.
 
bertn said:
Shot a round of trap today and had two rounds not go off after each other. This was halfway into the round of trap so the first half went without issues.
I then switched over to use the other barrel and finished the round without further malfunctions.

See pics of the rounds.
Challenger 12ga. Shot about half a flat of this ammo out of my shotgun and have not had any issue before.

Gun is a Marocchi over under, no idea what model it is as it’s not marked on the gun
Bought it used a couple years ago, but have not used it until I started shooting clays a bit this year. it does not look used a lot and locks up very tight.

What is the collective mind here thinking, is it an Ammo or gun issue?

Thanks,
Bert
Click to expand...
OP, are you using a recoil pad, such as a PAST?

I also think it's the batch of Challenger primers, but I've seen it happen when there isn't enough resistance, and light strikes happen.

This is a common issue with semi-auto pistols and even some revolvers. It happens when the shooter has a weak grip or limp wrist.

In your case, if your recoil pad is "to effective" it may be causing borderline strikes.
 
bearhunter said:
OP, are you using a recoil pad, such as a PAST?

I also think it's the batch of Challenger primers, but I've seen it happen when there isn't enough resistance, and light strikes happen.

This is a common issue with semi-auto pistols and even some revolvers. It happens when the shooter has a weak grip or limp wrist.

In your case, if your recoil pad is "to effective" it may be causing borderline strikes.
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Thanks all for your input.

My gun is an over under, not a semi.
I have a slip on recoil pad on it to extend the LOP as I’m quite tall but would be very surprised if that would cause it.
 
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Just pulled the stock and the internals look very clean, no trace of crud or dried up lube or anything.

Firing pins feel like they move freely with just spring tension, no other restrictions.

Hamer springs look and feel good as well.

I’m just going to assume it’s a challenger ammo issue.
This flat was bought a few years ago (pre covid bs lockdowns) and kept in a dry basement.



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bertn said:
Thanks all for your input.

My gun is an over under, not a semi.
I have a slip on recoil pad on it to extend the LOP as I’m quite tall but would be very surprised if that would cause it.
Click to expand...
That makes it worse actually.

Semis have a single internal hammer and a single firing pin, which has more kinetic energy behind it when impacting the firing pin.

Your shotgun has a selector for which firing pin to hit.

Check the hammer spring, as it may not have enough force for the barrel with the misfires.

I had this happen on a Ruger Red Label about 25 years ago. Like your Marocci, it would misfire on the odd cartridge. I called Ruger in the US about the problem, and they sent me a new hammer spring.

I never had another issue.
 
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