Which Long Range Caliber for 1600 Yards?

wallz

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Our range in PG is working on extending from the current 1370 ish meters to 1600ish meters. I know that it may be a year or so before things actually happen, so I have a bit of time, but want to do some leg work and figuring before hand.

I have a current 6 dasher, that I know is just not going to be capable to ringing steel out there consistently, so want to start dreaming of another build to reach 1600 consistently. I know it all can reach, but the key work consistent!

I have a current defiance action that sits as my hunting rifle in 6.5 PRC, that I could spin on a new barrel and use. The set up has a non threaded 22" carbon barrel that I really don't want to shoot out to ring steel with, plus would rather have a break on the end. The few rounds I would need to shoot before hunting season to reset the barrel and scope is a minor detail for me, so not really a factor.

It is a short action, magnum bolt head so it might limit me. I would probably go with a single feed sled in the action, so not concerned with the mag length. I have some new Lapua brass sitting that I could use if I went 6.5 PRC.

Should I stick with the 6.5 PRC and push the 153.5 Berger bullet with it out there, or drop the idea of using the short action and going to a long action, which would mean a new stock as well??? Or is there another alternative in the short action magnum bolt head I would be better served with????

I was recently reading about the 30XC, 338, 338 improved, but don't know if I really want to subject myself to that level of recoil. I also use a 450 BM for hunting and know the recoil pulse, but don't really want constant 50 round strings of recoil to deal with in that range. I know the 6 dasher is kinda spoiling me right now.

The 7 PRC has also been on my radar.

No I'm not gunning to be a sniper, just intrigued with long distance plinking!
 
Pretty hard to beat the bc on the heavier 7s in a lighter rifle. I would go 7saum and run the 180 eldm or berger around 2900. 6.5 prc would do it as well or just to be different you could go 7-6.5 prc.
 
two rounds that will keep a gun smith busy
30XC and a 30-378
the 30XC is an absolute barrel burner, directly rivaling the legendary .30-378 Weatherby Magnum in throat erosion. Had the 30-378

45 pound shot to the shoulder or worse takes alll the fun out of shootin....its nasty and when the flinch starts ammo is wasted.

Engineering tricks to keep it at the rifle are required.
barrel, BRAKE, and chassis weight are the help....and cash
plus
SHELF rounds or reloads.. or both.
Some cals mentioned here are wilds or dropped support which is pure reloads.

some research required
 
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Our range in PG is working on extending from the current 1370 ish meters to 1600ish meters. I know that it may be a year or so before things actually happen, so I have a bit of time, but want to do some leg work and figuring before hand.

I have a current 6 dasher, that I know is just not going to be capable to ringing steel out there consistently, so want to start dreaming of another build to reach 1600 consistently. I know it all can reach, but the key work consistent!

I have a current defiance action that sits as my hunting rifle in 6.5 PRC, that I could spin on a new barrel and use. The set up has a non threaded 22" carbon barrel that I really don't want to shoot out to ring steel with, plus would rather have a break on the end. The few rounds I would need to shoot before hunting season to reset the barrel and scope is a minor detail for me, so not really a factor.

It is a short action, magnum bolt head so it might limit me. I would probably go with a single feed sled in the action, so not concerned with the mag length. I have some new Lapua brass sitting that I could use if I went 6.5 PRC.

Should I stick with the 6.5 PRC and push the 153.5 Berger bullet with it out there, or drop the idea of using the short action and going to a long action, which would mean a new stock as well??? Or is there another alternative in the short action magnum bolt head I would be better served with????

I was recently reading about the 30XC, 338, 338 improved, but don't know if I really want to subject myself to that level of recoil. I also use a 450 BM for hunting and know the recoil pulse, but don't really want constant 50 round strings of recoil to deal with in that range. I know the 6 dasher is kinda spoiling me right now.

The 7 PRC has also been on my radar.

No I'm not gunning to be a sniper, just intrigued with long distance plinking!
Either stick to a 6.5prc or jump up to a norma bolt face action and go 300norma 338norma or lapua.
Imho sticking to something that has factory ammo available is handy, went the wildcat route a few times, and life got busier so reloading time got more limited.

The 7mm magnums are nice, but its not a huge improvement over a 6.5prc. Yes bc etc is better, but is it worth a new barrel, dies, components etc? Atleast when you step up to 300norma/ 338 you gain quite a bit more.

Recoil is manageable in prone, my 338norma was 12lbs scoped and had 0 issue shooting in prone. From a bench different story.
 
What’s your guys thoughts on building a 338 Lapua on a remington 700 style action? That would probably be swaying my cartridge choice. Build cost would be way higher going to a full sized magnum action.
 
What’s your guys thoughts on building a 338 Lapua on a remington 700 style action? That would probably be swaying my cartridge choice. Build cost would be way higher going to a full sized magnum action.
338LM isnt really as good as it used to he when compared to modern offerings.

300 PRC slinging a 245gr Berger will outperform a 338LM slinging a 300gr Berger. In terms of BC.
 
What’s your guys thoughts on building a 338 Lapua on a remington 700 style action? That would probably be swaying my cartridge choice. Build cost would be way higher going to a full sized magnum action.
don't build on a normal 700 for lapua sized cases. Will have lug setback and early pressure issues. Plenty of action makers have dedicated lines for lapua sized cases. (BAT, borden, lonepeak, impact (.750 bolt and or bigger threads))

As others have mentioned a 300prc is another option, but also long action.

I would stick with the 6.5prc. If it was a creedmoor and you could step up to a magnum 7mm or 300 short action cartridge, it would make more sense. But gains will be minimal unless you go long action.
 
I have a current defiance action that sits as my hunting rifle in 6.5 PRC, that I could spin on a new barrel and use. The set up has a non threaded 22" carbon barrel that I really don't want to shoot out to ring steel with, plus would rather have a break on the end.
1. If you look at the calibers based on velocity and BC, the two graphs intersect at 6.5mm. That is the 6.5 has the highest velocity AND the highest BC. Outside of that, velocity or BC drop.

For ultra long range shooting, you don't need a brake. The flight time will be more than long enough to let you push the rifle back into place and spot the miss.

Bigger cartridges come with heavier bullets and a lot more recoil. If you want to have fun shooting all day, a 6mm or 6.5mm are the way to go. If you want the gun to beat the sh!t out of you with both recoil and blast overpressure then choose something silly like a 338 LM.


I was recently reading about the 30XC, 338, 338 improved, but don't know if I really want to subject myself to that level of recoil.
I spent some time with a 338 LM and in the end decided I didn't like it. The amount of powder being burnt and the forces involved on the rifle just freaked me out. The blast overpressure is just not fun to deal with over an shooting session.

I really like the 300 Norma. Its still a brutal cartridge but much less stressful to shoot for me.


The 7 PRC has also been on my radar.
Mine too. I was looking at the 300 PRC but think the 7 PRC is a better choice.


I think bigger is better myself. 338 and 375 bullets are fighting wind with mass..
Mass doesn't make any difference. You could shoot a brick downrange ... it has the mass but not the BC. It is BC and velocity that you should consider. Those are the two factors that keep a bullet supersonic downrange.

I shot a hot rodded 243 to 2000 yds. The biggest limitation with the little 95gr bullet didn't throw up much dust when it impacted, making corrections difficult.
 
How about reverse engineering this

Pick a Bullet Coefficient and Muzzle Velocity needed for the target size and distance to achieve reasonable results with needed accuracy
Make the list of bullet/brass combos plus suitable barrel length/twist that fit the numbers,
List them according to recoil energy, pick a comfort level to help pick a oa weight

the list will be short
 
We did some tests with 7prc vs 6.5CM out to 1345m this weekend with wind gusting to 20mph. Up to 1200m we had hits with the 6.5 but inconsistent with the changing wind. The 7PRC was on another level with solid hits at the 1345m. These were hunting rifles with carbon barrels and carbon stocks. Even so the 7mm was very nice to shoot. The 6.5 with 140 ELDM and 7PRC using 180 ELDM.

cOso4x8.jpg


edi
 
I can't recall quite what the backstops in PG are like but how visible splash will be is also a consideration. I'd err on the side of something heavier than a 6.5 projectile.

If you want to stick with your current action I'd get a long (28-30") 7SAUM barrel spun up and single load rounds with 180-190gr bullets. The 7SAUM's biggest limitation is when trying to run your ammo at mag length with 180+ bullets.

If building from scratch I'd build a .300NM. I went through this whole build process years ago (and ended up building a .300NM) and realized that the best performance inside 2000 yds for the least cost and recoil was a braked .300NM. You can push 220 or 245gr bullets fast enough to be flatter and have less wind defection inside 2000 yds than you can with a .338 but just the cost of bullets is way less. Mine has a 29.5" Krieger and pushes Berger 220gr LRHTs around 3150 and is an absolute laser beam. It's also about 20lbs and has a great brake on it (Insite Heathen) and is an absolute pussy cat to shoot, I can watch my trace at 800-900 yds. Consistently sub 1/2moa at 100 and around 11mils of elevation to get to 1600yds if memory serves. Have shot it out to 1850 yds with great success. I have a thread on it here somewhere.

found it, just need to re do the pics: https://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/threads/my-dedicated-elr-rifle.2128186/
 
Lots of great feed back and things to consider for sure.

I've taken my previous 6.5 CM to the 1350 m max we have now and had some fun, but found it fairly inconsistent as well. Sure they were getting there, just getting tossed in the winds.

Our range has a decent slope up, and a bit of a hole down from 500-900 m, so even at 1000m the bullet is at least 100m or more above the ground over the 500m to get to the 1000m, if that makes sense.

The 1400M is even higher, so the bullet is way up in the wind envelope to get out there, forget about the standard elliptical arch of the bullet.
 

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Your personal choice is going to be about your balance between easy hits (bigger cartridge), and learning more about the wind with a smaller cartridge.

I’d personally go the more challenging route. Learning wind is a skill you can take with you from rifle to rifle.
 
Lots of great feed back and things to consider for sure.

I've taken my previous 6.5 CM to the 1350 m max we have now and had some fun, but found it fairly inconsistent as well. Sure they were getting there, just getting tossed in the winds.

Our range has a decent slope up, and a bit of a hole down from 500-900 m, so even at 1000m the bullet is at least 100m or more above the ground over the 500m to get to the 1000m, if that makes sense.

The 1400M is even higher, so the bullet is way up in the wind envelope to get out there, forget about the standard elliptical arch of the bullet.

All personal preference. I enjoy shooting my 6.5 prc at long range, but enjoy shooting my .338 lapua AI even more.
 
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