2008 Ontario IPSC Provincials Web site launched

omen said:
It would be nice to have a match without silly gimmick stages, which test things other than shooting ability (like those short term memory test stages, low light stages which test eyes' ability to adjust to darkness, etc)... :)
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Originally Posted by stormbringer
so you have no night vision and no short term memory?
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No,... I think he means that swingers, drop-turners, plates, & poppers are cool.
Weird starting positions (one foot in a bucket & both hands on a rubber chicken), carnival stages (lots of moving metal parts), or starting without a loaded gun in your holster are not cool.


...at least that's what I read into it. :D
 
Oh.........well that is different.

I guess everyone has a perspective. As to starting without a gun in the holster. I do like SOME to have that. However IIRC the Nationals in 2006 there was only 2 or so stages that started out in a holster.

As to starting positions...... From my experience the "gimicks" when properly used serve to force the competitor into a position that the designer wants them to be in. However there should always be a REASON for this position to be required beyond the desire to make them "odd".

Now...I am not sure what you mean by carnival stages........
At the last Drama Daze I had a rotary target mover as well as a teeter totter mover. They were of course made of metal. Is that what you mean?

Of course the real solution for those who want stages of a certain type........DESIGN THEM!

As it stands I have only 1 more stage required for this match and am working on it.
 
stormbringer said:
Of course the real solution for those who want stages of a certain type........DESIGN THEM!

As it stands I have only 1 more stage required for this match and am working on it.
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John, you doing fantastic job and shooting in your range is always a joy.
To those who complain - shut up :)
 
PeterPan said:
John, you doing fantastic job and shooting in your range is always a joy.
To those who complain - shut up :)
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CK123 stepped up and submitted 7 fantastic stagest that I am really looking forward to shooting.

Azone sent in another.

An EESA member yet another.

I am doing the rest.

I am very pleased to see so many people coming forth to make this match happen.

Another person is working on a special surprise that will make this the match of the year!
 
With my eye sight and the stenght of my glasses, and basic optics, the depth of focus in really light condition is non existant for me. As such, my ability to hit the target in near-dark has NOTHING to do with my shooting ablity. I see nothing if I focus on my sights, and this is bull####, as much as some people might think it's "cool". this is even ignoring the fact that different people's eyes take different lengths of time to adjust to darkness, which totally throws out the windows the idea that ipsc matches are supposed to be test of SHOOTING ABILITY.

In misc level 1s or 2s, who cares. In the provincial championships, when the competition is so tights, putting in a stage where someone is ####ed because his depth of focus in low light is next to zero, has nothing to do with shooting or IPSC... That's how you should ready it ;)
 
omen said:
As such, my ability to hit the target in near-dark has NOTHING to do with my shooting ablity.
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So we now have to taylor all of our matches for the very few people with bad eye sight?

why don't we stop all kneeling port cause of the old guys with bad knees?
why don't we stop all movement so the guys with short legs aren't at a disadvantage?

you can't expect a sport or match to taylor to YOUR specific needs (as you posted above).


BTW: There is one stage I have submitted for review with limited light.. it was not targeted at any individual or skill set. It was created to have a different style of stage, and to challenge the shooter..
 
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ckc123 said:
So we now have to taylor all of our matches for the very few people with bad eye sight?

why don't we stop all kneeling port cause of the old guys with bad knees?
why don't we stop all movement so the guys with short legs aren't at a disadvantage?

you can't expect a sport or match to taylor to YOUR specific needs (as you posted above).


BTW: There is one stage I have submitted for review with limited light.. it was not targeted at any individual or skill set. It was created to have a different style of stage, and to challenge the shooter..
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It is wonderful to be young with great reflexes and eyesight and energy that never stops. I can almost remember. Maybe if we banned anyone over 50 the #####ing would stop. Let's have a vote at the AGM, eh?
 
arancio said:
Maybe if we banned anyone over 50 the #####ing would stop. Let's have a vote at the AGM, eh?
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to be honest, if they banned irrelevant comments like this, I think there would be less #####ing. ;)

the fact is that the ipsc membership Is diverse, as should be the stages. your skills or experience may be good at one, but suck at another. everone has that problem. only having 'one style' actually favors that type of shooter. if I'm not 'that style' then you are penalizing me.

the match director should look for a good variety of stage designs to try and cover as much as they can.
 
ckc123 said:
to be honest, if they banned irrelevant comments like this, I think there would be less #####ing. ;)
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OK, so I forgot to put a :D at the end. It was intended to be humorous.

Forget about it, you are still my hero.

I have been thinking (and it didn't hurt all that much) that maybe we should have another class. There is S for Senior and SS for Super Senior maybe we should have G for Geriatric. I think I might just qualify. At least I have been shooting like one for the last few 2 or 3 matches. :(

The foregoing was intended to be humorous. :D
 
omen said:
With my eye sight and the stenght of my glasses, and basic optics, the depth of focus in really light condition is non existant for me. As such, my ability to hit the target in near-dark has NOTHING to do with my shooting ablity. I see nothing if I focus on my sights, and this is bulls**t, as much as some people might think it's "cool". this is even ignoring the fact that different people's eyes take different lengths of time to adjust to darkness, which totally throws out the windows the idea that ipsc matches are supposed to be test of SHOOTING ABILITY.

In misc level 1s or 2s, who cares. In the provincial championships, when the competition is so tights, putting in a stage where someone is f**ked because his depth of focus in low light is next to zero, has nothing to do with shooting or IPSC... That's how you should ready it ;)
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Damian,
you are a good shooter and I can see why you complaining. You go there to win or be a contender, however there are some shooters who liked that stage, including me. Actually in the whole match, that was my best stage.
I think we have to adapt to all kinds of condition as long as they are IPSC type and safe.

Good Luck to You, ;)

Peter
 
If IPSC was solely about shooting ability, we wouldn't have reloads, or movement or any of the other things that make IPSC fun. There are lots of stages where people have advantages/disadvantages because of various physical handicaps/deficiencies, yet everyone competes and accepts that there are sometimes physical challenges that need to be overcome.

I don't know about the stage in question that Omen is talking about, but I've shot darkhouses where you can barely see the targets. I've shot stages where I only thought the targets were. We've shot Nationals with a variety of stages that have had nothing to do with shooting ability. The bicycle turret stage in 2003, the suitcase stage in 2005, the motorized cart stage in 2004. I've shot stages with vertical slats designed specifically to screw over open shooters yet I've never heard complaints from them that the stage was unfair. You shoot them and move on. If you don't like the stages, step up and design them yourself. Everyone else will thank you for taking on the work and going to the effort of putting on the match.
 
props

hungrybeagle said:
I don't know about the stage in question that Omen is talking about, but I've shot darkhouses where you can barely see the targets. I've shot stages where I only thought the targets were. We've shot Nationals with a variety of stages that have had nothing to do with shooting ability. The bicycle turret stage in 2003, the suitcase stage in 2005, the motorized cart stage in 2004. I've shot stages with vertical slats designed specifically to screw over open shooters yet I've never heard complaints from them that the stage was unfair. You shoot them and move on. If you don't like the stages, step up and design them yourself. Everyone else will thank you for taking on the work and going to the effort of putting on the match.
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Don't know about you, but I really dislike those HOIZONTAL slats. In lots of matches you always end up with one "prop manipulation stage". It tests your ability to manipulate a prop instead of shooting or physical ability. Yes, physical ability is part of this sport, contrary to what some would like to believe. The very fact that it's partly based on speed makes it a physical challenge. Manipulating a prop tests your ability to ride a cart or pedal a turret mechanism. This in itself is questionable, but sometimes accepted IF the stage design allows the prop to be the SAME for everyone. Not usually the case with these stages. The props are usually not the same and change their timing/effort required during the course of the match. A rotating motorised target array is basically a fixed time stage, and should not be used except for standards. This then makes them unfair, and according to the rulebook, not legal. Try telling that to someone who spent days and hours building it!! Area 8 last weekend is a good example of a match with technical stages designed without silly carneval stages or flimsy props, yet challenging by design.
 
Horizontal slats go ay back, the first time I saw them was at the '92 North American, where scopes were just starting to show up and the intent was to screw up the open guys with scopes (I got that right from the guy that built the stage)...but it was still won by an Open shooter with optics. Most carnival stages only serve to spread the gap in points from the masters on down (usually the opposite effect of the intent) so I say, bring on the carnival! Make the match as hard as possible, if you can't make the shots, I might! Lets see some more 50ys shots, the guys that aren't accurate will have trouble. Have at the point blank stages, the guys that can't manipulate their guns quickly will fall down. Memory stages for the guys that can't plan, and big runs for the out of shape. Bring it all on :D
 
So I should not cancel the 12 merry go round horsies that I have on order!

(just kidding).

From my perspective there will be no carnival stages at this years provincials.
 
PH Racing said:
Horizontal slats go ay back, the first time I saw them was at the '92 North American, where scopes were just starting to show up and the intent was to screw up the open guys with scopes (I got that right from the guy that built the stage)...but it was still won by an Open shooter with optics. Most carnival stages only serve to spread the gap in points from the masters on down (usually the opposite effect of the intent) so I say, bring on the carnival! Make the match as hard as possible, if you can't make the shots, I might! Lets see some more 50ys shots, the guys that aren't accurate will have trouble. Have at the point blank stages, the guys that can't manipulate their guns quickly will fall down. Memory stages for the guys that can't plan, and big runs for the out of shape. Bring it all on :D
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So I should go ahead and submit my stage design entitled "knapsack full of lead ingots" then?
 
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