- Location
- Vancouver Island BC
Johnn just happens to the northern rep for Sierra..........
308 norma magnum
- Thread starter profesional 111
- Start date
accuracy is great but when your bullet pancakes on the shoulder of a critter, you'd probably wish you went a little tougher constructed bullet when you're at the end of your trail looking for the animal. Sierras shoot great on paper, no doubts about that, but for the majority of hunting situations, that extra accuracy advantage is negated by the many disadvantages that those types of accurate bullets are plagued with once they impact. I dont know about you, but I dont shoot too many groups at critters!
Don't forget the exit hole.With 150gr Hornadys meat damage is minimal.[I don't eat lungs] and flat as pi$$ on a plate out to 300 yards sighted +3" high at 100 yards.Mine has a 1-12" twist some makes use 1-10" so bullet preferences may vary.A cartidge ahead of it's time literally! Guns made but no Ammo..........................Harold
Long Shot 1000
New member
- Location
- Barrie, Ontario
Thanks again for all the help and good information guy's! How hard is the reforming of the .300 Win Mag cases on the full sizing dies? My buddy and I use RCBS dies and presses. The one good thing is though once the cases have been fire formed we were just going to neck size them since they will be used in the same gun. This should help out with stress in the equipment and cases. Although we were talking today and the price I got for .308 Norma Brass was $86.99 /50. It is pricier then .300 Win Mag but less work and probably better brass then Reminton or Winchester so we could get a little more life out of the cases. As for primers any suggestions? I was thinking going with Federal. We are using Winchester right now for our other loading, however I was talking to a competative shooter at our club and a seasoned veteran suggester changing primers beacuse he was having trouble tightening up his .308 groups. Sure enough he now is driving tacks with the thing!! Same Powder and charge. Any one else had the same experience? Take care Jeff
Yes Norma MRP and RL-22 are the same powders but different lot#s.Bofor powders are not all that consistant in burning rate so it's a work up.Factory 180 is 3080f/s,and it's very wise not to exceed that. I use 73 or 74grs of N-560 for 3050f/s with a 26" barreled Enfield. I used Norma brass and it's lighter than domestic 300WM. So you might get there with less powder.
Just buy the right brass. 100 or so should last you the rest of your life, and it's not much money. Bashaw Sports had some last time I was in, and I think P&D did as well. - dan
Long Shot 1000
New member
- Location
- Barrie, Ontario
Thanks guy's; I think your right about the brass. My buddy and I were talking and both agree the Norma brass and use our .30 cal neck sizer/decapper on the fire formed cases. I'll just have to find someone here in Ontario that sells Norma powder or just use the Acurate. Although we have used RL 15 with our .303's with good results, so maybe the RL22 is worth a try. Plus we can use it with my buddies .300 Win Mag. So many options and choices!!!!
308 Norma brass
Before I found some 308Norma brass at a gunshow,I reformed Norma 300WM brass. New brass is easier to reform. You pushing the shoulder back on 300WM brass to what it should have been in the first place. I used Redding dies and Lee white lube,being careful not to over lube. Still,I dented one case out of 50.Since 300WM cases are longer,I trimmed with a Lee trimmer and a 300WM gauge that I had shortened at the screw end by 60 thou (I think). Except for the headstamp,it might be better using Winchester brass as my Norma brass is very soft.If you use 338WM,I don't think you have to trim.
Copper bullets have much different loading data so you can't use data for standard bullets.
Before I found some 308Norma brass at a gunshow,I reformed Norma 300WM brass. New brass is easier to reform. You pushing the shoulder back on 300WM brass to what it should have been in the first place
. I used Redding dies and Lee white lube,being careful not to over lube. Still,I dented one case out of 50.Since 300WM cases are longer,I trimmed with a Lee trimmer and a 300WM gauge that I had shortened at the screw end by 60 thou (I think). Except for the headstamp,it might be better using Winchester brass as my Norma brass is very soft.If you use 338WM,I don't think you have to trim.Copper bullets have much different loading data so you can't use data for standard bullets.
Long Shot 1000
New member
- Location
- Barrie, Ontario
Thanks Downwindtracker2. Our only concern was stressing the .308 Norma die to much. how did you find it....pretty easy or alot of stress? I think the .338 WM and the 7MM come up short on the COL....I could be wrong though, that's why we were going to use the .300 WM brass as well as we already have it for my buddy's .300 WM. I'd rather trim back since we want to seat the bullet out as far as we can so there's not alot of free travel. I already have 60 rounds of Norma Factory ammo that my father in law had....did I forget to mention he has never put a round through it! pretty sad EH. :-( I put the first 6 rounds through it ever in May
Only 1 in 50 dented that's pretty a pretty good resizing job you did then. Our loading press and dies are mostly RCBS, although we do have some Lee. The .308 neck sizer/ decapper is Lee if I remember right.
I gather it's not worth going for copper bullets then in your opinion?
Is it hard to find Norma powder here in Canada/Ontario? Do you know where I could find some?
Have you heard much on this Hodgdon Hybrid 100V powder? If your interested in the September 2008 Shooting Times Magazine, there is a article on a custom Winchester Model 70 chambered in .308 Norma Magnum. It has some reloading recipes. That's where I heard about this powder.
Take care.
Only 1 in 50 dented that's pretty a pretty good resizing job you did then. Our loading press and dies are mostly RCBS, although we do have some Lee. The .308 neck sizer/ decapper is Lee if I remember right.
I gather it's not worth going for copper bullets then in your opinion?
Is it hard to find Norma powder here in Canada/Ontario? Do you know where I could find some?
Have you heard much on this Hodgdon Hybrid 100V powder? If your interested in the September 2008 Shooting Times Magazine, there is a article on a custom Winchester Model 70 chambered in .308 Norma Magnum. It has some reloading recipes. That's where I heard about this powder.
Take care.
Loads that are listed for the 300 Win Mag are perfectly safe in The Norma. Case configuration is slightly different, but available internal volume is identical. Max OAL is the same. The only real difference is that the Norma is rated at a (very) slightly higher maximum pressure, but we don't go there, do we?
I own, and shoot, three 308NMs, and a couple of 300Wins. I work up all of my loads individually for each rifle, and was pleased to find that I came within one grain of powder (all other factors being held equal, same ullets, primers, neck tension, et al). This held true for each of the several powders that I tried in all of the rifles.
The thing is that I work up for optimum accuracy, which isn't always the same as maximum pressure/velocity. I assess my results on the basis of what happens at the chronograph and down range. I have not often had to go near the listed maximums. I do not like flattened primers, and really freak when a rifle blows up.
As to "needing" that extra 20fps, how dead is dead? The animals will be unimpressed by the slower bullet and will shrug it off, that's why it is no longer possible to kill anything bigger than a west coast blacktail with a 30-06, the big deer know that there are magnums out there and wait for them!
Well Nosler is way off on that 308 Norma Capacity, since I regularly shoot 75.5 grains of IMR 7828 behind the 200 Partition in mine, and it is only a slightly compressed load [about 102%], and the 200 is a long bullet. I have about 40 years of experience with the 308 Norma Mag, about 30 with the 300 Win Mag, and There is not much difference between the two. Actually about 2 -3 grains in case capacity, but since the 300 Win mag has the bullet intrude more on case volume, the difference is moot. Similar velocities are attainable from both at safe pressures. I prefer the slightly shorter case of the Norma, but eschew Norma Brass, which tends to be "soft". Reforming 300 Win Mag brass is a walk in the park, with no specific "stress" to the 308 Norma Dies. Do not put any lube on the shoulder of the cases, or you will have dents. Trim to 2.550" and away you go. I always use unfired [new] WW brass, because I like it best. Regards, Eagleye.
Good, someone got the exact numbers. Nosler's numbers did look a little lite,since I use 74gr of N560 and a 180.(VV max 75gr)I have always thought of it like the others, 264,338,or 7mmRM as a 75gr case and the 300WM as a 80.With the 1/4 rule,% gain in capacity= 1/4% gain in velocity,gives a theoritical gain of 1 1/2%.But again I say the case capacity different is enough not to use 300WM data.
,since I use 74gr of N560 and a 180.(VV max 75gr)I have always thought of it like the others, 264,338,or 7mmRM as a 75gr case and the 300WM as a 80.With the 1/4 rule,% gain in capacity= 1/4% gain in velocity,gives a theoritical gain of 1 1/2%.But again I say the case capacity different is enough not to use 300WM data.The point I was trying to make is that the extra pressure rating of the Norma offsets the very slightly larger volume of the Win. If a load is safe in the Win, it will not blow up a Norma, all other things being held equal. Please note that I also specified that I was not talking about max loads! Using 300Win Mag data is a safe way to work up 308 Norma loads using components that hare written up for the Win, but not the Norma.
Normal cautions about not starting at maximum are always understood to apply, but the Win Mag data gives you a safe basis of comparison.
Normal cautions about not starting at maximum are always understood to apply, but the Win Mag data gives you a safe basis of comparison.
Both Oldbadger and Eagleye touched on some of the advantages of the 308Norma.The factory ammo runs at CIP max,unlike 300WM which is a bit under loaded to the tighter SAAMI max. The design of the cartridge ends up almost an 1/8" shorter making it much better fit in the 30-06 standard 3.340 box.Which is why I had my P-17 rechambered 308Norma instead of the much more common 300WM.The longer neck also gives a more even release pressure,in theory allowing better accuracy.
The downside is just what is being discussed,the lack of reloading data. That that you do find is both stale and generally arrived at using seat of the pants pressure signs.This is case where I use a chrony to keep under the 3080f/s 180gr max and am leary of using high pressure bullets like Swifts,Failsafes or Barnes.
I just wish I had finished the stock in time for the moose hunt this August.
The downside is just what is being discussed,the lack of reloading data. That that you do find is both stale and generally arrived at using seat of the pants pressure signs.This is case where I use a chrony to keep under the 3080f/s 180gr max and am leary of using high pressure bullets like Swifts,Failsafes or Barnes.
I just wish I had finished the stock in time for the moose hunt this August.
Long Shot 1000
New member
- Location
- Barrie, Ontario
Hey guys. Lots of good information here I'm really learning alot, thanks!!
Just in case it got lost in my last post. There in an article in the September 2008 Shooting Times Magazine on a Custom Winchester Model 70 rechambered in .308 Norma Magnum. If you are interested downwindtracker2 or anyone else, send me a private message or let me know and I'd be more then happy to send you the reloading information from that article since it is newer information and is one more piece of information and referance material.
I'm heading to the cottage tomorrow for a week and taking the Norma and the Mini 14 in .223 REM with me to have some fun......my wife is claiming the Mini 14 as her's by the way. I'm going to try and get out to 200-250 Yds.
This means I'm going to have to get my but in gear to get the brass reloaded for Deer Season out here.
I'll let you know how it goes.
Are you making your own stock downwindtracker2 or did you buy one?
How long ago did you have you P-17 rechambered from 30-06 to .308 Norma?
Just in case it got lost in my last post. There in an article in the September 2008 Shooting Times Magazine on a Custom Winchester Model 70 rechambered in .308 Norma Magnum. If you are interested downwindtracker2 or anyone else, send me a private message or let me know and I'd be more then happy to send you the reloading information from that article since it is newer information and is one more piece of information and referance material.
I'm heading to the cottage tomorrow for a week and taking the Norma and the Mini 14 in .223 REM with me to have some fun......my wife is claiming the Mini 14 as her's by the way
. I'm going to try and get out to 200-250 Yds.This means I'm going to have to get my but in gear to get the brass reloaded for Deer Season out here.
I'll let you know how it goes.
Are you making your own stock downwindtracker2 or did you buy one?
How long ago did you have you P-17 rechambered from 30-06 to .308 Norma?
Johnn Peterson
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Chemainus B.C.
Wellllll, sort of. If a component performes well, you'll hear about it. If it doesn't, again, you'll hear about it, but the icing will be differentJohnn just happens to the northern rep for Sierra..........
. I'm looking for results, not excuses. By the way, be nice. I was down seeing DG today and picked up some cast 45 cal 420gr GC unsized for you. Give me a shout when you want them.
