Help me make up my mind

[deadshot]

Hello need your in-put
I am looking at buying a Savage MODEL 12F/TR PRECISION TARGET in .308
or should I buy the 12F CLASS PRECISION TARGET 6.5x284 Norma
Looking for the pros and cons they both seem like a good bang for the buck
anyone who has shot both I would like to hear from you.
Thanks in-advance.

 

[2bad4u2]

If you're debating which one to go with then it's probably a good assumption that you're relatively new to precision rifles.

Pick the .308 Winchester. Easier to load for (less finicky as far as load development), brass is much cheaper, .30 cal. projectiles are more readily available, and bore life is exceptional (6,000-10,000? rds. possible) if you're not hot-rodding it with excessive pressures.

A 6.5x284 Win is ballistically superior but comes with somes strings attached. Higher component (brass) costs, greatly diminished barrel life (typically around 1,500 rds. or less), can be tempermental in load combinations, and 6.5mm bullet availability may be an issue.

Buy the .308 Win. and learn how to shoot the rifle. When you can honestly say that the cartridge is the limiting factor in your shooting, buy a new barrel and chamber is for whatever you like at that point.

No need to rush into anything exotic for a first time rifle.

 

[maynard]

I agree with 2bad4u2.

If you are planning to get into competitive shooting the .308 will put you into the F(F) class, against others shooting .308 and .223. If you go with the 6.5-.284 you are in the F(O) open class shooting with the big boys. Some of these guys use 2 barrels a year if they are doing allot of shooting. Barrels run about $600 each installed.

I would go with the learning to walk before learning to run thought.

 

[Obtunded]

No Question. Unless you are an experienced precision reloader that can tune a load very quickly, stick with the 308. You can compete in F-class and F/TR class with the Savage 308. Once you get your feet wet, you may want to re-barrel and try something that has excellent inherent accuracy and is cheaper to reload: 6mm BR Norma.

6.5-284 is one helluva long range cartridge, but you had best be capable of shooting that distance before you start shooting one. The cost of components and barrels make the 6.5X284 cost close to $3.00 per round to shoot.

 

[superd222]

Here's the alternate case - or at least part of it...

First of all, do you reload? If yes, then, the component cost/availability is not that big of a deal. I never had an issue finding 6.5mm bullets.

Secondly, what is your intended use for this rifle? F/TR or hunting varmints - and do you have a caliber restriction where you plan to shoot it? In Ontario, there are some areas where you can't hunt with (shoot) anything bigger than a 270. So the 6.5 is your option here - no 308's allowed.

As has been stated previously, the 6.5 is better ballistically for long range work. What distance do you plan to shoot it? Both can be great at 1000yds but in either case, a lot depends on the pilot.

I'd say the 6.5 kicks @$$.

Ever consider the 260 Rem? It's a blend of 6.5mm projectile in a 308 case necked down to 6.5. This would be the best option to get involved in F or TR or other longer range shooting. I think the 6.5-284 has had it's day and has it's place - perhaps not the best choice... There are a few up and coming 6.5mm cartridges that have enough HP to get it there without being overpowered - eg. 6.5mm Creedmoor & 6.5mm Grendel.

My suggestion is take a look at the 260 before you commit to one of the others - it would be the best of both worlds !!!

Good luck - I'm sure you'll have fun with whatever you choose.

 

[2bad4u2]

Here's the alternate case - or at least part of it...

First of all, do you reload? If yes, then, the component cost/availability is not that big of a deal. I never had an issue finding 6.5mm bullets.

Secondly, what is your intended use for this rifle? F/TR or hunting varmints - and do you have a caliber restriction where you plan to shoot it? In Ontario, there are some areas where you can't hunt with (shoot) anything bigger than a 270. So the 6.5 is your option here - no 308's allowed.

As has been stated previously, the 6.5 is better ballistically for long range work. What distance do you plan to shoot it? Both can be great at 1000yds but in either case, a lot depends on the pilot.

I'd say the 6.5 kicks @$$.

Ever consider the 260 Rem? It's a blend of 6.5mm projectile in a 308 case necked down to 6.5. This would be the best option to get involved in F or TR or other longer range shooting. I think the 6.5-284 has had it's day and has it's place - perhaps not the best choice... There are a few up and coming 6.5mm cartridges that have enough HP to get it there without being overpowered - eg. 6.5mm Creedmoor & 6.5mm Grendel.

My suggestion is take a look at the 260 before you commit to one of the others - it would be the best of both worlds !!!

Good luck - I'm sure you'll have fun with whatever you choose.

While you might not have had an issue finding 6.5mm bullets, others have. There's far greater availability of .308 match bullets than 6.5mm, thus easier to find.

Component cost not that big of a deal? Huh? With 6.5x284 brass costing near $100 per 100 pieces, how could you say it's insignificant?

Who in their right mind would bother to hunt with one of those Savage behemoths? Certainly not my idea of fun lugging something that heavy and ungainly through the woods.

While the .260 Remington would make a decent choice, name one domestic manufacturer curently offering this chambering in a heavy barrelled rifle. There are none. The poster never indicated he was interested in a custom, so it's hard to say if it would be of appeal.

Besides, you'd be in the open class with a .260 Remington, would you not? Definitely not the best place for a novice shooter to be if they plan on doing any competitive shooting. He'll get his ass handed to him every time and that'll discourage him from competing which is counter productive, is it not?

 

[deadshot]

Thanks guys for all the input. Let add some missing info. I do reload my own rounds. what I am looking for is a decent $1000 plus or minius $300 target rifle optics not included, no hunting, straight up target 1000 yards plus that uses cheap rounds. Thanks again.

 

[maynard]

Savage MODEL 12F/TR PRECISION TARGET in .308.
Shoot 155 gr bullets to stay in F(F) class or shot 175-190 gr and shoot in F(O) open class.

The only thing that is cheaper to shoot out to 1000 yards is a .223 with a fast twist.

 

[GunBoy]

Here's the alternate case - or at least part of it...

First of all, do you reload? If yes, then, the component cost/availability is not that big of a deal. I never had an issue finding 6.5mm bullets.

Secondly, what is your intended use for this rifle? F/TR or hunting varmints - and do you have a caliber restriction where you plan to shoot it? In Ontario, there are some areas where you can't hunt with (shoot) anything bigger than a 270. So the 6.5 is your option here - no 308's allowed.

As has been stated previously, the 6.5 is better ballistically for long range work. What distance do you plan to shoot it? Both can be great at 1000yds but in either case, a lot depends on the pilot.

I'd say the 6.5 kicks @$$.

Ever consider the 260 Rem? It's a blend of 6.5mm projectile in a 308 case necked down to 6.5. This would be the best option to get involved in F or TR or other longer range shooting. I think the 6.5-284 has had it's day and has it's place - perhaps not the best choice... There are a few up and coming 6.5mm cartridges that have enough HP to get it there without being overpowered - eg. 6.5mm Creedmoor & 6.5mm Grendel.

My suggestion is take a look at the 260 before you commit to one of the others - it would be the best of both worlds !!!

Good luck - I'm sure you'll have fun with whatever you choose.

I concert, I just finish building a 260rem, will test fire this weekend, and let you know, I will have picture later also, is a good round no matter what size in 6.5mm.

 

[Obtunded]

for a grand +/- stick with the Savage. It's the only factory rifle under 2.5 grand that can compete on anything near equal terms with a custom. Stick with the 308 and have fun.

Palma shooters are kicking @ss out to 1200M with 308 rifles, iron sights, and off their elbows and shooting 155 grain bullets. Once you get past 800, it doesn't matter what the gun can do, it's all up to you.

 

[Ganderite]

I agree with 2bad4u2.

I have used 2 Savages in 6.5 x 284 (my wife and I) Have used many 308's. If you can develop a good handload before wearing out the barrel (tongue partly in my cheek) the 6.5 is better at long range. At short range 500 yards and less, the 308 is just as effective and much easier to get a good load for.

A 6.5 barrel lasts me about two seasons, max. Then we start over again. I have just changed to a 260 Ackley, looking for better short rnage accuracy and longer barrel life.

The other advantage of shooting the 308 is that you will learn a lot more about reading the wind, which is an important part of long range shooting.

 

[Mystic Precision]

Thanks guys for all the input. Let add some missing info. I do reload my own rounds. what I am looking for is a decent $1000 plus or minius $300 target rifle optics not included, no hunting, straight up target 1000 yards plus that uses cheap rounds. Thanks again.

Savage 12FV in 223 - modify the stock to widen and strengthen. Under $600 Same ballistics as a factory 308 with 1/2 the costs. 75gr Berger or Amax at 2950fps is easily achieved. LOTS of shooting before you wear this out.

the Stock on the F/TR is not my idea of a good time and no better/worse then the plastic stock on the FV for shape. They both need help.

The Savage F(O) stock is miles ahead and should be duplicated in all their F rifles. Why they dont do this? who knows....

There is also a 6BR in the F(O) model. That would make a great entry F(O) rifle. Solid barrel life and decent LR capabilities. Running costs are not that much cheaper then a 6.5-284 but your barrels will last 3 times as long.

The 6.5-284 IS NOT A GOOD BEGINNERS RD!!!!!!!! You need trigger time and if your pipe wears out in 1000rds, you may not even get much past developing a load. Yes, its days of LR dominance are nearing an end.

As to learning at LR, the 308/223 is going to be very demanding and the learning curve is much longer then the 6.5's. But barrel life is much better.

If you want quick success, the 6.5's will give it to you. You may not win, but you will hit more 10's and X's sooner simply because you don't get bounced around in the winds as much.

I shoot a 6.5 Mystic which is my version of the 260AI. Same performance as the 6.5-284 but I get about 50% more barrel life. I use 308 Win brass so brass cost is cheap and no different then the 308. Lapua 139gr bullets are no more then 308 MK's and Bergers these days. Powder volume and primer costs the same.

What I get is less recoil and a 1/3 to 1/2 reduction in wind drift at 1000yds. So if I miss a wind read by a few MPH's, my 6.5 will go into the 10ring - 9 ring at worse.

The 308 might just hit the 8/7 ring. that can be very frustrating when learning as you will likely not know why you missed by so much.

Jerry