Help with an Old Colt 1911 (pics)**serial number added**

Bomber

Bomber

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For all of the 1911 guru's on CGN's. A freind of mine recently had this Colt 1911 passed to him from his fathers estate. He wants to know what is is worth as he isn't into 1911's and is thinking about selling this.
As shown in the pictures it is marked
-Model of 1911 US Army (on the right side)
-Patented Apr 20 1897, Sept 9 1902, Dec 19 1905, Feb 14, 1911, Aug 19 1913 and Colt's PT.F.A.MFS CO Hartford CT. USA (on the left side)
Serial number is 505492
As well it comes with a .22 Conversion Unit that is original from Colt and is still in the orginal box and dosen't look like it's ever been used.
Other than holster wear on the blueing the pistol looks to be in great shape. Nice shiny bore and no evidence of heavy wear on any of the parts.
So I'm throwing this out there as I don't know a lot about values for older Colt's like this. Any help in determining a value or more info on how old this 1911 is would be greatly appreciated.
http://s245.photobucket.com/albums/gg46/methos1100/?action=view&current=OldColt2.jpg
http://s245.photobucket.com/albums/gg46/methos1100/?action=view&current=OldColt1.jpg
http://s245.photobucket.com/albums/gg46/methos1100/?action=view&current=Oldcolt6.jpg
http://s245.photobucket.com/albums/gg46/methos1100/?action=view&current=OldColt4.jpg
http://s245.photobucket.com/albums/gg46/methos1100/?action=view&current=OldColt3.jpg
 
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I only see red Xs.
Does the serial begin with a "C"?
Is it US Property marked?
Colt conversion units are well thought of.
As far as the pistol is concerned, condition is critical to value.
 
Bomber said:
For all of the 1911 guru's on CGN's. A freind of mine recently had this Colt 1911 passed to him from his fathers estate. He wants to know what is is worth as he isn't into 1911's and is thinking about selling this.
As shown in the pictures it is marked
-Model of 1911 US Army (on the right side)
-Patented Apr 20 1897, Sept 9 1902, Dec 19 1905, Feb 14, 1911, Aug 19 1913 and Colt's PT.F.A.MFS CO Hartford CT. USA (on the left side)
As well it comes with a .22 Conversion Unit that is original from Colt and is still in the orginal box and dosen't look like it's ever been used.
Other than holster wear on the blueing the pistol looks to be in great shape. Nice shiny bore and no evidence of heavy wear on any of the parts.
So I'm throwing this out there as I don't know a lot about values for older Colt's like this. Any help in determining a value or more info on how old this 1911 is would be greatly appreciated.
Click to expand...

OldColt2.jpg

OldColt1.jpg

Oldcolt6.jpg

OldColt4.jpg

OldColt3.jpg
 
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Can't see the pics either. Need to see detailed pics showing markings, script, proofs, etc and overall condition. Both sides & also closeups to show the small parts - hammer, slidestop, thumb safety, mainspring housing, etc. [To see if the small parts are correct for the pistol]. Also, a pic of the magazine, too.

Serial number would help to pin down date of mfg and if the other parts are matching.

Details provided about the slide would indicate a WWI era military slide. An actual pic of the script will indicate whether it is an early or later mfg slide from that era.

"C" prefix to serial number will indicate a Colt Government (commercial] model.

No letter prefix to serial number would indicate a military model. However, depending actual serial number & other marks [inspector proofs] could be Colt, Springfield or Remington-UMC mfg.
 
Can't really tell much from the pics that I can see....

Grips are WWII era Colt plastic grips for sure. Correct grips should be double diamond checkered hardwoods.

Lanyard mag is correct for early WWI production. Are the other two mags marked on the bases or the front top of the base lip?

Mainspring housing is WWII arched. Is it checkered or is it serrated? [For a correct WWI ms housing it should be smooth & flat]. Other small parts look correct for a WWI Colt [Slide stop, thumb safety & hammer].

The slide is later production, could be late WWI or early WWII. If the frame has an early mfg date then the slide is a mismatch. If the frame is a later WWI mfg then the slide could be correct. Check under the firing pin stop of the slide to see if there is a serial number stamped there - if there is a serial number & it doesn't match the one on the frame then it is a mis-match slide. If there is no number then it may be original to the frame or it may not.

Inspector proof above the mag release button on the left side of the frame would be an Eagles head over a number. Indicates latter WWI era mfg military frame. As does the "United States Property" on the forward dust cover flat on the left side of the frame.

The conversion unit probably is 1960's or later vintage. The early units came in a plain cardboard box. The foam box with the cardboard slider is modern era just before the .22 units were discontinued. [Check the slide stop it for it, if it is correct it should be marked with a "2" on the inside flat].

Serial number will pin-point year of mfg....... Need better pics to determine if finish is original or not and to give an estimate of it 'value' on the Cdn market.
 
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Grouse Man....
Ya, I tried to tell him he should hang on to it considering it was his fathers but he wants to buy a new SP-01 for PPC and wants the funds.
 
Condition from what I can see in the pics overall condition is only ~ 75%. There are some non era parts on it [wrong grips, wrong mainspring housing]. It needs to be determined if the slide is original to the frame or a mis-match. However, that all said, value is probably ~ $1,000'ish.

Maybe a tad more to someone looking for a WWI era Colt military model and had a line on correct parts to restore it to 'original'. Correct grips & mainspring housing are going to be a ##### to find, though. Much easier to find correct small parts to restore a WWII era Colt than a WWI era one. [i.e. not too many sets of original double diamond checkered hardwoods and flat mainspringhousings with lanyard - then try to match those to the condition of the pistol itself so it looks 'right'].

The Colt .22 Unit is worth $500-$600 with one mag. The extra mag adds another $75-$100 to it.

So, for the whole thing 1911 + conversion unit & all the mags maybe $1,600 - $1,700.

Much easier to sell the Colt 1911 with mags & leather separate from the .22 Unit, IMHO.
 
I agree with one thing, he will REGRET selling it, if not now, in the near future.
But what the heck, it's only an OLD GUN with no family connections. He will make someone else very happy!

I have added to my collection from a few good funerals when junior didn't give a damm.:rolleyes:
 
Thanks for all of the info from everyone. I'll pass it on. I totally agree about not selling it. If it had come to me it would never get sold (only passed on to my son or daughter) but I guess it would be better to go to someone who can appreciate it and give it a good home.
Once the info is passed on I'll try to convince him to join CGN and put it on the EE so someone here can grab it.
Again......thanks everyone.......
 
One other thing... the barrel....

Also, given that the pistol had, at some point, been "upgraded" with WWII Colt plastic grips & an arched mainspring housing, it would be interesting to know if the barrel had been changed out. For a correct WWI Colt era military barrel you should be able to see a tiny "H" and "P" on the exposed area of the barrel hood.

If the barrel has no markings on the hood but is marked "Colt .45 Auto" along the underside above the lug link & pin area it is a later [1924 and post] replacement.

If it is marked with an "HS" [High Standard mfg] or "F" [ Flannery mfg] on the barrel lug then it is a WWII replacement.
 
Bomber said:
Serial number is 505492
Click to expand...


Indicates 1918 Colt mfg. Would be consistent to the Eagles head over number inspectors proof and the later 1911 slide.

Check out the script of the "United States Property" line on the frame and compare it to the script of the patent dates etc above it on the slide. Does the font match? If so, then the frame & slide are original together (or at least 'correct').
 
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