Flight 140 TTSX

I've long thought that the Barnes bullets must be at least somewhat velocity dpendant - by that, I mean, it seems to me that for them to do what they do, they are designed to maintain a high rate of speed during the pass-through, thus creating a much more significant hydrostatic shock than a bullet that looses most of it's velocity (and weight) in the first few inches of penetration.

So, if my redneck reasoning is correct, I would expect that at long range (lower velocity) impacts, that they'd do about what yours did - punch a nice expanded-bullet size hole, but not thrash up the innards too bad.

I have no scientific data to back any of that up - it's just my thoughts on the subject.
 
The bullet must be supersonic during the pass through for hydrostatic shock to be a factor. The TSX opens hydraulically when fluid enters the hollow point, so the bullet expands to full diameter much quicker than does a lead core bullet, and can attain its full diameter of expansion at lower velocity. You have probably noted that lead core bullets that have hit at low velocity or that have hit targets with little resistance do not open up to their potential. The larger the frontal area of the supersonic bullet, the larger the shock-wave that comes off the bullet, and the greater the effect of hydraulic shock, and the greater the penetration because there is no fluid of soft tissue that touches the bullet until it becomes sub-sonic. Despite my criticism of them, the TSX's are a great general purpose game bullet for this reason.
 
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chuck nelson said:
I was shooting the TTSX. No exposed hollow point.
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Yes, but the hollow point is still there. The real difference is that the TTSX opens mechanically as do similar bullets with a plastic or metal wedge that is driven into a hollow cavity. The TSX I believe is the better bullet for general use because it is less reliant on velocity for consistent performance.

Now I have used neither the TTSX or the MRX, but I have shot TSX's quite a bit and grudgingly like them. I have also used a broad range of tipped bullets as far back as the CIL Saber Tip and the Remington Bronze Point Expanding. Sometimes though, you have to be able to see through the advertising to understand what it is that you are getting. Barnes's claim leads one to believe that the TTSX opens faster than the TSX, ("the tip and re-engineered nose cavity provide even faster expansion") but I don't see how that is possible under all circumstances as the expansion of tipped bullet is velocity dependent. Then they turn around and call the MRX, which has exactly the same style of mechanical expansion as the TTSX, a controlled expansion bullet. The hardened core of the MRX does not extend to the expandable section of the bullet, so it has no effect on the speed or extent of expansion. Therefore, if the MRX is a controlled expansion bullet, so must be the TTSX. There is nothing wrong with this, and I believe that on some large game species it can be preferable to have deep penetration occur before the bullet fully expands. At normal hunting ranges, I doubt if the claimed flatter trajectory of the TTSX or the MRX over the TSX would prove useful to the average hunter. The hunter may benefit from a fast expanding bullet like the TSX or a controlled expanding bullet like the TTSX depending on his circumstances.
 
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Boomer said:
The TSX opens hydraulically when fluid enters the hollow point,
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I always find it amazing that people think this about the TSX....Bullets expand from resistance on the nose...Not from anything else, period. For a TSX to expand from fluid it would have to stop, part the hair, cut a hole through the hide (to avoid plugging the tip with skin) and then rev back up and hammer on through....Unless you are hunting in the rain of course...

Stop and think about this whole thing...A bullet is going really really fast....It impacts something that is not. All that it can do is start to slow down, and the nose of the TSX is softer than the shank, so it peels back, simply due to the fact that it encountered resistance.

Think of it this way; whats harder, cement or steel? Obviously steel is harder, or we would use diamond chisels in jackhammers to break it up. Now, if we all agree on that, take your favorite hunting knife and go stab it as hard and fast as you can into a cement wall and see what happens to it....Even though its harder than cement, it still bends.....
 
You are incorrect and watching a slow motion video of the TSX open in ballistic gel should prove it to you. Unlike the nose of the older X bullets the TSX has a very small opening and it is not prone to plugging.

The hollow cavity of the TSX has exactly the same hardness as the shank.

Liquids are not compressible, therefore can be relied on for a wide range of useful work.
 
KodiakHntr said:
I always find it amazing that people think this about the TSX....Bullets expand from resistance on the nose...Not from anything else, period. For a TSX to expand from fluid it would have to stop, part the hair, cut a hole through the hide (to avoid plugging the tip with skin) and then rev back up and hammer on through....Unless you are hunting in the rain of course...

Stop and think about this whole thing...A bullet is going really really fast....It impacts something that is not. All that it can do is start to slow down, and the nose of the TSX is softer than the shank, so it peels back, simply due to the fact that it encountered resistance.

Think of it this way; whats harder, cement or steel? Obviously steel is harder, or we would use diamond chisels in jackhammers to break it up. Now, if we all agree on that, take your favorite hunting knife and go stab it as hard and fast as you can into a cement wall and see what happens to it....Even though its harder than cement, it still bends.....
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The dirt berm at our range is littered with bullets of all descriptions. Many of those are TSXs that didn't expand after smacking into dirt. They must have encountered resistance.
 
Hang some pics then of all the unexpanded TSX's from your dirt berm...And I'll counter with pics of perfectly expanded TSX's pulled from dry sand berms....
 
Boomer said:
You are incorrect and watching a slow motion video of the TSX open in ballistic gel should prove it to you. Unlike the nose of the older X bullets the TSX has a very small opening and it is not prone to plugging.

The hollow cavity of the TSX has exactly the same hardness as the shank.

Liquids are not compressible, therefore can be relied on for a wide range of useful work.
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I've been a Barnes fan for at least 15 years, and believe me, I've watched all the videos...

You are almost right about the hardness of the tip, compared to the shank...The tip has the same consistency as the shank, but by virtue of not being solid, is softer...Has a hollow cavity in it, and expansion lines in it...
A hollow pipe is not as strong as a solid rod.....


And regardless, there is a long bit of animal to get through before you encounter liquids....Expansion initiates at impact...IF anything, the slow motion videos should prove that to YOU!
 
KodiakHntr said:
Hang some pics then of all the unexpanded TSX's from your dirt berm...And I'll counter with pics of perfectly expanded TSX's pulled from dry sand berms....
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I don't normally pack range junk home but did keep a couple .416s if I can find them. I do have the only three that I recovered from a gemsbuck, zebra, and a cape buffalo. One of then turned 90 degrees in the buffalo. They "look" OK, if looks could kill anything. What the other 4 dozen that exited look like are up to conjecture. I'm rapidly losing interest in Barnes bullets except for the biggest game, and the versatility of shooting little stuff with big guns without tearing them up too much. When choosing between the penetration of the TSX and the faster killing of softer bullets I'm moving back to softer bullets.
 
I switched to 120 tsx out of my 7mm-08 last fall. So far I'm 2 for 2 on small-ish whitetails (say 150lbs). One was at 180 yrds. I hit him a bit high in the lungs and found a small entrance, loonie sized holes in the lungs, and a small exit. He went down so fast I thought I'd missed. The second was a 100 yrds shot quartering toward me. I hit him right on the point of the shoulder, there was a quarter sized hole throught he center of the heart, and a quarter sized exit just forward of the diaphram. I just butchered last night and while ther ewas almost no bloodshot meat, there was bone gravel all through the shoulder. He went about 10 feet. While neither animal was very big, I think the second shot illustrates why I like the bullet. It allows me to shoot a light for caliber bullet, as fast as I can make it go, and be completely confident that the bullet will hold together, make it to the vitals, and usually exit. I used to shoot 139 hornady interlocks, but often didn't get exits, even on broadside shot's w/o bone contact, and ended up w/ deer going further without leaving any blood trail. This sure is no exhaustive study, but I sure like the results so far.
 
Dunno....But you sure hear a lot about "unexpanded TSX's" found at rifle ranges...But no one ever has a pic of them...Would just like to see a pic or two....Photographic evidence goes a lot farther than someone saying they saw a "bunch" of them on the ground....
 
I remember reading an article about the TSX and worry of some shooters about the consequences of a plugged hollow point. The author tried to plug the hollow point with all kind of stuff that might occurr naturaly in some ones pocket and even when as far as to seal the hollow point with epoxy. He fired all his bullets in some sort of media (can't remember exactly what it was) and all the bullet expended to a perfect Barne's "X". I agree that fluid is not required for the expansion of a TSX or TTSX. I've seen some expanded TSX from the dirt berm as well (sorry, no pics).
 
Boomer said:
Then they turn around and call the MRX, which has exactly the same style of mechanical expansion as the TTSX, a controlled expansion bullet. The hardened core of the MRX does not extend to the expandable section of the bullet, so it has no effect on the speed or extent of expansion. Therefore, if the MRX is a controlled expansion bullet, so must be the TTSX. There is nothing wrong with this, and I believe that on some large game species it can be preferable to have deep penetration occur before the bullet fully expands. At normal hunting ranges, I doubt if the claimed flatter trajectory of the TTSX or the MRX over the TSX would prove useful to the average hunter. The hunter may benefit from a fast expanding bullet like the TSX or a controlled expanding bullet like the TTSX depending on his circumstances.
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I don't know where you got this information:confused:. The MRX is no more a controlled expansion bullet than a TSX or TTSX. The MRX was built with a tungsten core to give it more weight and reduce it's overall lenght, it has nothing to do with expansion. That's my understanding anyway.
 
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