357SIG for open - total noob asking

22lr

22lr

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Hello folks. I would like to put together racing gun and I am thinking about 357SIG since I have dies and brass. Is this is a good idea or should I consider 38 super instead?

Another question is the gun itself - where do I start? Is it possible to make reasonably good pistol out of generic (probably norc) 1911 or should I shop around for purposefully built racing pistol?

Thanx in advance
 
357 sig is a popular calibre for IPSC open. there are a lot of guys shooting it in BC and a couple in Alberta. The abundance of cheap 40 brass is one of the draws for it.

If i was going to build a Sig, i would build it around a S*I frame. A single stack frame will just make you slower all other things being equal.
 
In my mind, I cannot think anything would feed better in a pistol than a bottleneck cartridge. Cheap .40 brass, larger case for slower powders, my the idea is tempting. If considering a 1911 platform, and a Norc. what about the hi-cap .45 gun, for the frame? Maybe look into what mags will fit this frame, maybe Para? If that's the case, you could build a wide body 1911 on the cheap. If not maybe shop around and pick up a Para frame kit, or an STI and go from there. A single stack frame is fine, but takes more to nail a good reload. (I am discovering this now with my single stack standard gun.) I have been curious of the Norinco hi cap frame and what one could do with one. I hope you go ahead with your project!
 
I've never owned a .357 Sig, so my information is second hand. One of the BC guys shot the bottleneck cartridge, and had to be very fussy about which once fired brass he used. It would crack, he'd have case/head separations or it was bulged at the bottom (a la Glock). Others have not seemed to have a problem.

Personally, the only cartridge for me is the .38 supercomp. I shoot in the US, so capacity is an issue. With a tuned mag, you can run 30+1 in the US/Internationally. I understand that many people are making the 9major function reliably, but I'm not going to change my setup just to see what might work. The cost in lost brass is a bit more (by brass cost is around $300 per year), but not going to break the bank.
 
heavenIsAlie said:
that is the only one i can think of as well

what about using a norc frame+slide to build a 9mm major gun? even cheaper brass but its got to be able to handle the preasure
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Frame would probably survive, but the slide wouldn't.
Before the norc fans start chiming in that I'm picking on thier precious 'rincos; Springfield, Colt and Para slides rarely hold up to racegun abuse either... this is the big leagues for gun survival.
 
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22lr said:
Hello folks. I would like to put together racing gun and I am thinking about 357SIG since I have dies and brass. Is this is a good idea or should I consider 38 super instead?
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Answered well already.

Another question is the gun itself - where do I start? Is it possible to make reasonably good pistol out of generic (probably norc) 1911 or should I shop around for purposefully built racing pistol? Thanx in advance
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Have a look at all the raceguns that even get close to winning in Canada. 100% Double Stack, 95% STI/SVI. (others are Para and Tanfoglio) They're stronger and thier extra wide magazine holes offer serious advantages over any single stack racegun build.

If you're going to sink coin into a gun to compete in Open, you're better off starting on something that's proven rather than trying to re-invent the wheel and toss away precious funds.
 
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I have heard that 9x40 (9mm bullet c/w 40 S&W brass) is a more economical way to go than .357 SIG.

Can anyone confirm this?
 
Sorry, but building a gun around a set of dies just doesn't seem to make sense. 9mm Major or 38 super are generally the best options. If you are going to build or buy a racegun, do it right. If you want to build on a Norc frame, consider shooting Single Stack in the US. For either Standard or open, you have to go with a hicap frame, theres just too many advantages.
 
Walter Hornby said:
that is what a 357 sig is, 40 cal brass with a 9 mm bullet.
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I believe true .357 Sig brass gives you a longer neck, but as long as the neck provides enough tension, it's not a big deal. With a bottle neck case, it should be headspacing off the shoulder anyway.
 
Canuck223 said:
With a bottle neck case, it should be headspacing off the shoulder anyway.
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While most bottleneck cartridges do headspace on the shoulder, the .357 SiG, in fact, headspaces on the case mouth.

Canuck223 said:
I believe true .357 Sig brass gives you a longer neck, but as long as the neck provides enough tension, it's not a big deal.
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Not necessarily. .357 SiG is longer than a necked down .40 S&W. And since it headspaces on the case mouth, using necked down .40 S&W can be problematic.


Rutger said:
dimensionally, this is close, but 9x40 is a difference case dimension than .357 sig, which is unique in and of itself, no?
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Correct. The major differences are overall case length and the shoulder angle.
 
Dragoon said:
While most bottleneck cartridges do headspace on the shoulder, the .357 SiG, in fact, headspaces on the case mouth.



Not necessarily. .357 SiG is longer than a necked down .40 S&W. And since it headspaces on the case mouth, using necked down .40 S&W can be problematic.




Correct. The major differences are overall case length and the shoulder angle.
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When pistol cases are fired and resized, they tend to get shorter. I know that in theory the loaded round should headspace on the case mouth. In reality, the round headspaces off the ogive of the bullet, or the extractor, or the taper of the case meeting the chamber, or some combination including the case mouth.

With a bottleneck case, the reloader has the advantage of being able to eliminate a wee bit of that variability.
 
I have shot both, and currently use a 9x40. If you are going to shoot strictly in Canada, where capacity is not an issue, you should take a look at this cartridge. If you have any desire to shoot out of canada, go with a super comp or 9mm Major caliber.

As for loading. You need to pay attention when loading this cartridge. Attention to detail is the key. If you are not going to take the time to load well made ammo, this is not the cartridge for you.

The major difference between 357 Sig and 9x40 are that the Sig is a tapered case while the 9x40 is a straight walled case. I found the 9x40 stacks better in the magazine. Head spacing is done of the shoulder on a 9x40.

If you want your comp to work really well then you need lots of powder. This is where the bottle neck case shine. 15-16 grains of powder makes a 9x40 a very flat, soft shooting gun, although it is very loud. Component costs are economical.

If you are going to build a 9x40 you need to find a gunsmith that has this type of experience. Compensator selection is key in having the firearm track properly.

DVC
 
PH Racing said:
Sorry, but building a gun around a set of dies just doesn't seem to make sense. 9mm Major or 38 super are generally the best options. If you are going to build or buy a racegun, do it right. If you want to build on a Norc frame, consider shooting Single Stack in the US. For either Standard or open, you have to go with a hicap frame, theres just too many advantages.
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if your going to build it on a Noc frame then you will not be able to take it into the USA as Noc are baned
 
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