Need help, advice and or suggestions on choice of shotgun

spenom

spenom

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Kamloops, B.C.
So Here is the situation. I already own a Norinco Tactical shotgun (pictured below. I have had it for years and have only really shot it about 100 times total. So as the shot count indicates I am not really into shotguns. I bought it back when I was young and my only concern was that it looked bad ass. I tried shooting clays once with it and realized that it was not my thing at all. Not sure if the short barrel was a factor but I was pretty terrible at it. So anyway I dug it out the other day and decided that maybe I should sell it and buy a different pump action 12 guage. I don't really like the idea of not at least having a 12 guage pump around though. It is one of those guns that I feel that use it or not you should just have one around for the odd occasion you may use it. Plus if I sell the one I have I have a damn good excuse to go gun shopping. So I have done some searching on the site and have found a few I like for totally random reasons. They are.... The remington 870 marine magnum, the dominion arms grizzly, the mossberg 500 persuader. The 870 is very popular and the marine magnum looks like it would hold up in rough conditions. It is also the most expensive I believe. Not sure if I would use it enough to warrant the cost. The dominion arms grizzly looks pretty mean and is supposed to be an 870 clone of sorts. I am liking to lower cost of this one and it looks flat out mean. Plus I could maybe get extra mags for it. The mossberg 500 got thrown in there because there are lots of them out there in different configurations and they seem to be cheaper than the 870. So as for my uses with the gun I would probably say possible hunting of the odd grouse that goes airborne (12 guage is big for this though I don't want a 410 or anything like that). Maybe the odd session of shooting at clay targets with not to much concern for how good I am at it. More just show up and shoot at clays because my friends are into it. I am not going to lie I also still like the wow factor when you take it out of the case and show a friend. Bottom line 50% looks 50% function. So any advice on my choices is appreciated. Oh and how much would a slightly used/but looks almost brand new norinco m-37 be sold for roughly?

P.S. sorry for sounding like a girl going out to buy a new pair of shoes (no offence to girls buying shoes of course)

The one I have
YL-1JZ-800px.jpg


Choice 1
870marinemagnum.jpg


Choice 2
dominiongrizz.jpg


Choice3
mossberg500persuader.jpg
 
I'm in much the same situation as you other than I've only had my 870 Police a short'ish time.

But in your case you're saying that you aren't using this one all that often and seem to lack a proper purpose for it. Yet you're looking at getting a shotgun to replace it that is straight out of exactly the same mold in terms of use and purpose. To me that makes no sense at all. I would suggest that you stop and decide what you want to do with a shotgun first and foremost or if you even WANT a shotgun other than you seem to think you need one. The simple fact that you claim to have only shot 4 boxes through it over a few years tells me that this style of gun really does not serve a purpose in your shooting. So why get another one that's pretty much the same?

You say you tried to use it for some clay shooting. No wonder you were frustrated. This just isn't the tool for the job. Likely the shot patterning was way out at that sort of range and likely the grouping was crap for the same reason. If you even THINK you should enjoy shooting at clays take a box or two of shells and wander out to one of the clubs that does trap and skeet and get talking with the folks and tell them you tried it but the shotgun was all wrong and you were wondering if you could borrow one of their guns to try it again with the right equipment. Having your own shells will just indicate to them that you're serious enough and respectful enough to not want to put them out of pocket even for this much other than getting a chance to try their gun. Using a proper gun may well turn you around. And if it doesn't then at least you'll know.


I bought an 870 Magnum Express with 18.5 barrel. It's silly but I enjoy shooting it in that form in the pistol range (it's allowed) and cutting the big paper targets in half. I've put about 12 boxes through it in the 6 months I've had it. Recently I got a long hunting barrel for it and I've been out once to try trap with it. The choke was wrong so I've got a full tube on order. I also bought a funky looking Remington Sure Shot black synthetic stock kit for it because it just looked so Sci-Fi'ish and tac'ish. Now I can switch from short and "black" to long and regular to suit my needs and mood. For me it's fun and I intend to feed it on a regular basis.

But in your case 4 boxes over a number of years says to me that you just don't know why you have it. Far better to just sell it and put the money into the guns you DO use. Don't compound the waste by buying another shotgun that is just the same style and will be ignored in turn.
 
First off thank you for the reply. I think you have me all wrong. I never said I was frustrated with my current shotgun. I know it is not the propper shotgun for shooting clays. I was just saying it is not really my thing. Given a choice I would prefer to sit down and take my time shooting at paper targets hundreds of yards away with a rifle, not rapid firing at flying objects. Although I am not opposed to rapid firing at flying objects from time to time. Basically I enjoy going out with my friends who really like shooting clays for the social aspect of it, thus the reason I feel having a 12 guage pump around is just something that you should have on hand. I should mention that I do have other guns. I am specifically talking about a pump action here. I have a break action shotgun that way out performs my current pump action for shooting at 1 clay at a time. But a pump you can go for 2+ per pull. So I don't have to worry about "if I even THINK" I enjoy shooting at clays. It is fun I like doing it, but I do not need a pump action dedicated to it. I also know that I don't plan on getting to serious about shooting clays. Or even hunting with it for that matter. Having other guns also explains the low round count. My norinco is a bottom eject as well so I cannot cycle it as fast as a side eject or it tends to have feed issues. It is things like that I wonder about with the pump actions I suggested as replacements. Like for example does the mag fed grizzly like to be cycled quickly ect. Bottom line I am thinking about selling my current pump action and with the money from it plus a few more dollars out of my pocket buying another pump action of better quality. It is like you said about your 870 Magnum Express with 18.5 barrel. It is silly but you enjoy shooting it.

That being said I like the idea of an 870 with 2 barrels to swap between. Can the long hunting barrel be purchased in the same finish as the marine magnum I wonder? What is the difference between the remington 870 and the dominion arms grizzly 870 knock off that makes it cost way less? Hot does a mossberg stack up against a reminton? Any little irritations about these guns from people that own them?
 
Mossberg 590. I own both a Remington 870 and a Mossberg 590 and if I had to chose one when the SHTF I would take the 590 hands down.
 
Ah, that helps set the stage a little better.

So you're after a lot of options so you can switch it up to suit the needs of the moment. Yep, that sounds like why I went with the 870 when I saw it. I knew I could get a different barrel later on and I knew that there was aftermarket stocks available so I jumped on the Express Magnum when it came up.

The DA 870 clone is supposed to be 870 compatable and vice versa but I've heard of a couple of "tolerance stacking" issues that prevented an 870 barrel fitting onto a DA reciever or back again. And I saw one such situation personally when we tried to fit my 870 barrel to a DA reciever. So while they should be able to swap stuff there MAY be issues unless some cleaning up is done.

If you're patient the 870 stuff seems to come up at good prices often enough. With the original Police 870, the Sure Shot stock and the long Express finish barrel I'm into the whole kit for around $550'ish at the moment. I could have spent more but I patiently searched for the barrel at a good price and was rewarded finally. Took me around 3 months of checking the EE each day.

I'm also glad I stuck with the "Original" 870. It's solid as a rock and I know it's the one the others are patterned after so it'll take all the parts without question. And being a steel receiver it's that little bit more kind to the shoulder compared to the lighter Mossbergs and such. If I was a hunter carrying all day long it would be a different story.

Anyhow that was my reasoning for what I got and I'm very happy with the setup.

I'm sorry if I implied that you were frustrated with your shotgun or with shooting at clays. What I was trying to say is that since you admit you don't shoot it a lot it seems like you wouldn't really miss it if it went away and the money from it went into your rifle shooting or some other shooting that you do more. If you want to keep A shotgun in the safe for those times when you want to shoot it then buying one along with some barrel and stock options to let you convert it from one use to another would not be a bad plan at all. But at only 4 boxes of shells over a couple of years it seems like it wouldn't be hard to just say "Meh, I think I just won't bother with shooting shotguns" and move on. But that's your choice of course.

I'm new to shooting and it took me a couple of months of lusting over everything to realize that I just can't do it all. I STARTED on buying all the stuff for tactical 3 gun but then discovered CAS. Based on that I made the decision to not shoot in Tac events because there just isn't enough time on the calender to do everything. So now I'm waiting to see if a local guy wants to my my M1 carbine and leave me with a much needed hole in my safe so the others jumbled in have a spot to sit. The 870 was one of the 3 guns but it's proven to be so much fun on it's own that it's staying.... besides, there's NOTHING that sounds like an 870 being cycled. It empowers the holder and makes the bad guy wet hisself.... :D
 
The only honourable thing is to keep the Norc shorty and get another shotgun. I had the same issue and kept my Fabarm martial shorty (fishing, hiking buddy) and bought a Fabarm Axis Sport for clay sports. It is an o/u and it fires 2 shots so no pumping is required. Much nicer imho than a pump gun for that purpose.

As metioned there is no sound on earth quite like a 12g pump being racked!
 
Hey no worries about implying anything BCRIDER. I am glad you are giving me your 2 cents about shotguns. It is all good. I have actually just got in the door from wholesale sports. I looked at the 870's among other guns. First off the marine magnum is almost twice the price of a regular 870 that is not nickel plated. At $800+ dollars the marine magnum is pretty much out of the picture. Plus the counter guy said they don't make a longer barrel in the nickel plated finish. True or not that is just too much cash for a shotgun I will not be using to often. On a final note with the marine magnum, I noticed the one on the self already had rust on the portion of the barrel you can see from the ejection port. So it is obviously not the rust proof gun I thought it was. I looked at some of the regular and tactical 870's and they could still fit the bill. I like the idea of your setup with the 2 barrels. Plus it seems like the aftermarket loves to make make stuff for the 870. Another thing I noticed is that some models of 870 were tapped for a rail and some were not. If I go this route I will be making sure I get one with the taps.
As per undergivers advice I tried to look at the mossberg 590 but they did not have one in and they say they do not carry the 590. So I looked at some youtube videos of it and liked some of what I saw. The location of action release and safety are convenient. correct me if I am wrong but the 590 does not have the ability to install a choke. The only mossbergs they had at the store were were the m88. I basically just didn't like the fit or feel of the m88. Granted it was only $280. To be honest though I think my current norinco feels better all around than the m88. So given todays findings I am thinking that a dominion arms 870 knock off might be a possibility (going to read some posts on it after I post this). Also I am going to take BCRIDERS advice and maybe be patient and cruise the EE looking for true remington 870's and parts. Hell keeping the norinco and just buying another gun is also a possibility. Hell I think I am just going to go shoot my shotgun right now and do some thinking.

X3 on As metioned there is no sound on earth quite like a 12g pump being racked!
 
I did the same thing as BC Rider.

I did some research and the general opinion was that an 870 Police model was the way to go. I bought one off the EE and later added a 28 inch barrel to it, which supplemented the 18.5 inch one that came with it. Now I just switch back and forth between barrels depending on whether I'm shooting trap or just paper targets. The 28 inch barrel is also threaded for Remchokes so that I can even hunt with it if I wanted to. The 870 is really quite versatile for not a lot of money.

If you do go the 870 Police route just be careful. There are a few folks calling their shotgun "Police" models just because they have shorter barrels. Mine actually has police written on the side of the receiver. Good luck.
 
Thank you London22. This is exactly the kind of advice you can only get talking to other people in the know......

If you do go the 870 Police route just be careful. There are a few folks calling their shotgun "Police" models just because they have shorter barrels. Mine actually has police written on the side of the receiver.

So I went out shooting my norinco just know and actually had a blast (no pun intended). I have found something I enjoy way more than shooting clays. I went out into the woods and went for a walk shooting at those extra large dandeelions with birdshot. Soooooo fun. I took my norinco pump, dominion arms backpacker and a friend brought 2 different break action shotguns. I have one hell of a sore shoulder. Lets just say the round count in the norinco is about 150 now and 3" magnum slugs in the backpacker are insane!! That little gun weighs so little and so short it hammers you. I shot 3 and am for sure going to have a bruise tomorrow. You can see a 2foot ball of flame when you shoot the backpacker with the magnum slugs. My friend said he would buy the norinco off of me but now I am thinking of keeping it. That short little barrel is crap for clays but pretty kick ass for dandeelions :) But to get back to the thread topic I think I actually might just go with bcriders advice and keep the shotgun and put money towards some other gun dream rifle. Here is a question for you shotgun guys now though. Were would a guy go about buying different chokes for a norinco (i have the threaded barrel.

dandee.jpg
 
First step would be to get the choke you have out and take it around along with your barrel to the shops in your area to see if they can match it to one of the regular Remington, Mossberg or "other" choke tube diameter and threading.

The Mossberg method with the safety being a slider on the back of the pistol grip portion is brilliant. The silly button block on the Remington is the one drawback to it.

It's always nicer to actually have something you can USE a gun for. I attended a shotgun course put on here by an ex police member and he passed on a lot of great info. But when it comes to tac/police shotguns there really isn't any sort of match event other than tactical three gun. I'm almost thinking about how to put together a fun event similar to the handgun speed steel event my club has. Obviously it'll be a steel popper shoot for the most part but I'd like to put a popper or two out far enough that it would require a slug upload so there's some skill involved rather than just blast at a bunch of up close stuff. I gotta think about it some more. The issue is that to keep things simple and moving quickly it's nice if no one needs to go out and set fallers back up. But how to set it up so there's a way to tell that the target was hit solidly enough to qualify as a hit rather than just a couple of pellets?
 
Are you going to look at it or shoot it ??
If you just wanna look at it, hang a picture up and say, yeah, I had one of those.
If you plan to shoot it, figure out what the purpose is and buy the proper gun for the job.
If it comes down to when the SHTF anything that goes bang works.
If your gonna brandish your shiney little short shot gun while someones trying to kill you, you'd have been shot twice by someones duck gun.

Guns like the Short pumps are short for a reason, storage area, i.e. boats, gun racks, police cruisers. THEY ARE NOT SKEET GUNS....

My 2 cents.

M.

any yes, it sounds like your buying shoes.
 
spenom said:
If you do go the 870 Police route just be careful. There are a few folks calling their shotgun "Police" models just because they have shorter barrels. Mine actually has police written on the side of the receiver.
Click to expand...

Isn't that getting out of hand, recently there are a few guns being advertised as..."magnum" and that being the same a the police model. I feel sorry for the people who don't do the research before they buy. but then again, maybe I don't
 
Shooting skeets may well not have ben your thing, but if you have rifle sights/ ghost rings sights it does make it a lot harder to hit skeet instead of just a bead.

As for shotguns.. You can never go wrong with a Remington 870 or a Mossberg 590.

They each have their pros and cons. They both cost around the same price, they both are shotguns.
It all comes down to personal choice, the Remington isn't better then the Mossberg and vice versa.
Handle them, see if a member that lives close by has both shotguns you could try.
 
I currently have a 870 with a 26" smoothbore barrel but also a 20" rifled barrel with sights. Being able to switch barrels for different jobs is nice.

My buddy has a Bennelli supernova 12g pump, which is a much nicer shotgun, but also cost twice as much and accesories cost much more as well.

You can't go wrong with the 870 when it comes down to value.
 
spenom said:
The norinco it is is a cylinder bore with no choke right now. There are threads on the exterior of the barrel though for a choke I believe.
Click to expand...

Exterior threads would only be for an add on polychoke or a muzzle attachment. The regular Remington chokes fit into the end of the barrel, not on the outside.
 
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