Wildcats based on 303 Brit

Noel

Noel

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I've heard Epps made some wildcats based on this case but haven't had much luck finding info....

My 1895 SRC seems to have a wore barrel and I am tempted to open it a smidge. Ideally it would go to 35 WCF to stay properly chambered but I don't have enough meat in this barrel and I think it would need magazine mods.

Of course another barrel would be an option but good luck finding that. One from an enfield is not an option ......

Thinking of going to 8mm or maybe 338 but that would be pushing it... iirc the muzzle is just under .600". The lands burnt out but I think the grooves are alright. Is it possible the bore is oversized?

Suggestions welcome!:D
 
blargon said:
.323-303...:d
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Fer sure, with a 220gr but is there such a thing and who has a reamer, dies etc.....

Kimberman, Ron will likely be getting the work regardless, but as to caliber it is going up in size, I want to keep the factory sights etc as well, so no new barrels allowed. Hopefully a handguard will be located for the gun as well.

This wore to white rifle just wouldn't look right with a new pipe.
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LittleBoyLefty said:
Awesome pic of a great '95 Noel!!:rockOn:

I'd lean toward a 35ish of some flavor. Not sure if a 35 British:))) ever existed, it just seems to work in a '95, for me.
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Thanks!

Yeah, it was the 35 WCF, just a bit bigger than a 303 British case...and it was factory chambered in these rifles but as mentioned the guts of the mag might need to be changed to go that route and my barrel won't allow it to go that big. 250gr at 2250 would be a serious moose and bear machine! The 338 could be just as lethal.:cool:
 
Noel said:
I've heard Epps made some wildcats based on this case but haven't had much luck finding info....

My 1895 SRC seems to have a wore barrel and I am tempted to open it a smidge. Ideally it would go to 35 WCF to stay properly chambered but I don't have enough meat in this barrel and I think it would need magazine mods.

Of course another barrel would be an option but good luck finding that. One from an enfield is not an option ......

Thinking of going to 8mm or maybe 338 but that would be pushing it... iirc the muzzle is just under .600". The lands burnt out but I think the grooves are alright. Is it possible the bore is oversized?

Suggestions welcome!:D
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Noel, slug your bore, you may be able to seat .323 diameter boolitz in that thing and actually get it to shoot.
 
I do know of one fellow with a '95 in 30-40 Krag that had to shoot .303 (.312?) Hornady bullets to keep the thing from keyholing. That rifle was near mint when he got it, so the bore must've been cut a tad large.
Do you know how to paper patch bullets? If not pm me and I'll try to get you a great article by Ross Seyfried on that subject, or one of the black powder/express buffs may be able to shine the light on it for you. Ben Hunchak(?) might know something about it. I think that would just plain look cool too;)
If you cast or know someone that does, you could make some cast 200+ grain soft points and really do things cool out of the old girl.
 
Guess I better learn me how to slug a bore. Can cerrosafe be used several times? I have a casting of another rifle chamber I no longer need and could try to melt that perhaps.

rem338win,
I have gotten Ben to make me some pills for my other older guns, you may be right in trying to go that way. Thanks for mentioning the paper patch too, I've not done it before but might give it a try.

I don't know what the sights were calibrated for shooting with this rifle but I'd like to toss heavy 200-220 gr pills. Doubt it would take shots past 200yds, depending on how it shoots after of course!
 
Yes, Cerrosafe can be use many times.
I agree with the above, slug the bore before playing with a rechambering.

For Epps wildcats, you will find interesting stuff in the Ackley books. It geos up to .323".

BTW, very nice rig.
 
Hey Baribal, long time!

She is in rough shape but it is classic that shouldn't be put to rest.

The factory loaded WW bullets have no sign of rifling cut in them at all. They are scorched from the gas pressure passing them in the bore so I think you are right. If I can swage down 220gr .323" I will be laughing.

Thanks for all the input!
 
To slug the bore, clean it, then push a lubricated lead slug through. Slug has to be bigger than max. groove diameter to start. You could likely use a buckshot pellet, flatten it a bit to increase diameter if necessary.
Depending on what you discover, a rebore to .32 (8mm), .338 or .35 might be possible.
How is the headspace? Extraction is OK at present?
 
If you do anything to that rifle, its value will drop in half.
"...heard Epps made..." .303 Epp's. Essentially a .303 Improved. Lots of info on .303british.com.
"...possible the bore is oversized?..." Slugging the barrel will tell you the diameter. Hammer a cast .30 calibre bullet or suitably sized lead fishing sinker through the barrel using a brass rod and a plastic mallet, then measure the bullet/sinker with a micrometer.
 
Noel said:
Thinking of going to 8mm or maybe 338 but that would be pushing it... iirc the muzzle is just under .600". The lands burnt out but I think the grooves are alright. Is it possible the bore is oversized?
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A bit of a conundrum, Noel! This may sound loony (but that's why we "loonies" are here, right?) but if you were in on the 9.3x57 handloading thread(s) on the Swedish Civilian Arms Forum, you may remember BC'er "Daryl S'" and his experiments with sizing down .375 bullets for the .9.3. I wonder if you could size down some 8mm bullets to fit your bore? The reduction would be about the same.

Alternately, if Steve Redgwell is doing a run of his "Mk.9" 200 grain .303 bullets, you could try his largest size, which is .314 IIRC.

And yes, Cerrosafe can be reused; at the price, I should hope so, too!

:) Stuart
 
The 30-30 case is used a lot for wildcats in the T/C Contender's here are some by Bullberry Barrel Works.

6mm Bullberry

6mm Bullberry Improved

25 Bullberry

25 Bullberry Improved

6.5mm Bullberry

6.5mm Bullberry Improved

Here is some info on the cases being formed for the above loadings.

Brass was first full length resized in a standard 30-30 Winchester die. The 6mm cases were then necked down using a tapered shouldered 25 caliber die to a point slightly below the position of the base of the neck on the finished case. Cases other then the 6mm's were reduced in one step and by sizing in a tapered shoulder sizing die for the appropriate caliber to the correct neck base position. Improved cases were then sized in the appropriate full length sizing die. All cases were trimmed to the correct length, those not requiring trimming were all trimmed for uniformity.

The powders used for fire forming varied by whatever was on hand, but the lowest reduced load of any loads shown will fireform without excessive pressure.

Sticky opening as a sign of pressure: HOG WASH!

At the point that sticky opening of the action occurs, maximum pressures have been exceeded! This phenomenon can occur at 50,000psi to 60,000psi. Some frames appear to have a greater ability to not display this sticking even with loads that typically register above 54,000psi. While the sticky opening is a good indicator of over-pressure it is not adequate to reduce a load by a couple of tenths of a grain and think that all is well.

Life of brass varied from as few as 15 loadings to as many as 30 as long as pressures were kept below 48,000psi. The first sign of brass failure was neck cracks and low neck tension on seated bullets, followed by stiff extraction. Stiff extraction (not to be confused with sticky opening) is seen as difficulty in the extractor moving the brass reward in the chamber (extraction).
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tiriaq said:
To slug the bore, clean it, then push a lubricated lead slug through. Slug has to be bigger than max. groove diameter to start. You could likely use a buckshot pellet, flatten it a bit to increase diameter if necessary.
Depending on what you discover, a rebore to .32 (8mm), .338 or .35 might be possible.
How is the headspace? Extraction is OK at present?
Click to expand...

Headspace would be at the bigger end of allowance, it has the expansion ring on the case similar to what an Enfield usually has for instance. Haven't measured that officially.


If you do anything to that rifle, its value will drop in half.
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That's why you need to help me find an origonal 303 barrel IF this one is indeed pooched.;)
 
Pg.165 of the 1979/80 Ellwood Epps catalogue has a list of cartridges that they had reamers for. Among the .303 Epps cartridges listed are the .338-.303 and the .35-.303. There are also .22, 6mm, .257, 6.5, .270 and 7mm x .303 Epps. And of course there is the, once very popular, .303 Epps Improved- I have 2 of these rifles. RCBS carried dies for all of these cartridges.
 
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