300WSM Sub Sonic

[Gatehouse]

A couple of years ago when Trailboss powder came out, I got some of it and made some subsonic ammo with it for my 30-30 bolt action. At the time, I thought the rifle was a great "truck gun" since i could load one magazine with 130gr TSX ammo (for big game) and one magazine with the 165gr hard cast subsonics (for grouse or yotes near population)

Anyway, the concept was good, but I never really used the rifle much, always grabbing my favorite custom 300WSM instead. Eventually Hodgdon started printing reduced velocity loads for other, non traditional "cowboy" cartridges, and I noted they used a 150gr bullet in the 300WSM. I had these 200gr Lapua Sub SOnic bullets that Boomer had mailed me well over a year ago, when I was playing with the 30-30 subsonics, but I never got around to trying them.

So, today, I was lazing about the house in the summer heat and occasionally cooling off in the pool, when I decided to go play with the 300WSM, trailboss and the Lapua subsonics.

My home range only goes to about 90 yards, and I still haven't got around to building a proper bench for it, but I didn't want to drive to the range and I figure these are close range loads anyway, so I would give it a whirl.

200gr Lapua Sub Sonics

Hodgdon listed 16 gr with a 150gr bullet as a starting load, so I picked 15gr and worked down. I was after 1000-1050fps

15gr got me 1186fps
14- 1087
13.5-994
13-925

I bet the group woudl have been better if not for the wobbly bench

So I figured 13.6 woudl put me where I wanted to be,and loaded 3 rounds

13.6
-1055
-1059
-1049

Now it's just a matter of seeing where the bullets impact at 25 yards in relation to my regular hunting load zero, and determining where to hold with my ballistic plex scope.



I've long made reduced power ammo for my hunting rifles , and pack along a few on hunting trips to shoot grouse or ptarmigan but Trailboss makes it very easy. Hodgdon has ben listing reduced loads for a number of cartridges recently. They haven't done the .375 Ruger yet, but they did do the 375 H&H which is close enough for this stuff. The 375 Ruger is next!

 

[saskboy]

Wow I alway try to get my 300wsm as fast and accurate as I can, might as well just carry a .22 on the seat beside you. Kind of a waste of bullets, primers, and powder if you ask me. Each to his own I guess.

 

[Bobby Ironsights]

Wow I alway try to get my 300wsm as fast and accurate as I can, might as well just carry a .22 on the seat beside you. Kind of a waste of bullets, primers, and powder if you ask me. Each to his own I guess.

I disagree.

Subsonics are alot more versatile than you'd think. They're capable of neat things, very, very efficient. I've been downloading my mosin nagants for awhile now with cast bullets and getting such great results that I'm looking into the .300 whisper in a shilen tube for my savage, bullets can get 950 fps out the muzzle and still retain 850 fps past 500 yards, and accuracy is said to be wonderful.

Subsonics can be very cheap to run, and very easy on brass, using small amounts of double base pistol powder. Barrels shooting cast bullets may outlive you while maintain match grade accuracy if you start with a quality barrel to begin with and have a fast enough twist to support real subsonic work.

There's no point comparing a subsonic .30 caliber rifle to a rimfire either even though it's slow; a 320 grain bullet, subsonic, can still easily carry energy equivalent to a .44 magnum at 100 yards, with much better accuracy. Not your first choice for long range elk, obviously, but no joke, either, and even much lighter bullet weights will dispatch smaller game with authority.

Noise level is probably the most well known benefit, no need to go there.

 

[Gatehouse]

Wow I alway try to get my 300wsm as fast and accurate as I can, might as well just carry a .22 on the seat beside you. Kind of a waste of bullets, primers, and powder if you ask me. Each to his own I guess.

Just because you are ignorant of a concept, and dont' understand it, does not mean that the concept is not worthwhile.

 

[gallen270]

great post, ive been looking for similar loads in my 270.

 

[Gatehouse]

You are inluck

Hodgdon lists 130gr Trailboss Loads

14gr for 1318 FPS minimum load

That is still supersonic, but you could work down a grain or 2 if subsonic is your goal.

If you just want a low recoil,low noise load, just use the 14gr

 

[Andy]

Interesting thread - thanks. I'm messing around subsonic loadings with a JW-103 (in 7.62x39), right up to 230grs.

What makes the 200gr Lapua bullet a "200gr Lapua Sub Sonic"? It looks like many other bullets. Have you tried the bullet seated backwards?

 

[John Y Cannuck]

Since I took a doe with a subsonic 44-40 load a couple of years back, all I can say, is go for it.
Tests I did on end grain penetration of pine blocks with cast hard lead were really surprising too. 4 to six inches.
The load I used was about 900fps, the shot was 50 feet. With a 200 grain bullet, I got complete penetration. Not recovered.

 

[Gatehouse]

]

Interesting thread - thanks. I'm messing around subsonic loadings with a JW-103 (in 7.62x39), right up to 230grs.

Suputin made a great thread regarding 7.62x39 and subsonics. I don't know if the thread still exists, but his experiments were pretty comprehensive.

What makes the 200gr Lapua bullet a "200gr Lapua Sub Sonic"? It looks like many other bullets.

http://www.lapua.com/index.php?id=853

Scroll down, you will see the bullet listed as "subsonic" Lapua developed the bullet specifically to shoot subsonic.

Have you tried the bullet seated backwards?

No, and I don't intend to. Accuracy seems good enough to me. If Boomer hadn't given me these bulltes, I might have tried some backwards boatails, though.

 

[josquin]

According to entries in Cartridges of the World, J.D. Jones at SSK Industries has developed a number of cartrdges (the "Whisper" series) based on bullets with very high BC's driven at sub-sonic velocities.

Stuart

 

[Gatehouse]

According to entries in Cartridges of the World, J.D. Jones at SSK Industries has developed a number of cartrdges (the "Whisper" series) based on bullets with very high BC's driven at sub-sonic velocities.

Stuart

Yes, they have been around for awhile, and from what I hear they are very good for a single purpose rifle. Loading some subsonics or even very low velocity rounds for your hunting rifle is a good way to double your fun.

 

[H4831]

Many of us have been playing around with very low velocity rifle loads for a long time. We never referred to them as sub sonic, because at that time the words sub sonic and super sonic were pretty well only used in relation to fighter aircraft.
I never used Trail Boss powder, but my understanding of it is that it is so bulky that double charges are highly unlikely. I doubt if it is any more accurate than Unique, 4759, 4227, 2400 or one of the many other fast burning powders we have tried.
My super low velocity loads in 30-06 I test fired in my basement. I would just tell the wife and she later would tell me she could hardly hear them go off, and wouldn't have taken the noise for shooting. I could get them to make one enlarged hole at forty feet. All these low velocity loads were with cast bullets.
This was great accuracy for grouse, but Gatehouse, I never did get a sighting that worked for those, as well as the normal 30-06 loads. I did get them shooting directly under, so just had to hold up to get the grouse. If the neck was nice and still, a hold just over the head would take the head off.

 

[Boomer]

Gate, glad to hear you put those slugs to work. As far as I'm concerned anything that makes a hunting rifle more versatile is a good thing. I haven't played with Trail Boss yet and still have enough Unique and 2400 to keep me going for a while. I like 4759 the most, but it never seems to last very long when I do buy some.

 

[Gatehouse]

I never used Trail Boss powder, but my understanding of it is that it is so bulky that double charges are highly unlikely. I doubt if it is any more accurate than Unique, 4759, 4227, 2400 or one of the many other fast burning powders we have tried

My super low velocity loads in 30-06 I test fired in my basement. I would just tell the wife and she later would tell me she could hardly hear them go off, and wouldn't have taken the noise for shooting. I could get them to make one enlarged hole at forty feet. All these low velocity loads were with cast bullets.

.

Accuracy has many variables, including the rifle, so whether it's more accurate or not for different rifles, I couldn't say. Trailboss *is* very easy to work with, though. The third picture I posted shows a 3 shot group at 90 yards, so I think that it's accurate enough.

This was great accuracy for grouse, but Gatehouse, I never did get a sighting that worked for those, as well as the normal 30-06 loads. I did get them shooting directly under, so just had to hold up to get the grouse. If the neck was nice and still, a hold just over the head would take the head off.

I went to the range on Tuesday, to play around with some other rifles and loads. Using the ballistic dot thingy on my scope, I placed one dot on the target at 25 yards and got nice bullseyes with the subsonic ammo. I've removed the heads of many grouse with full power rifle cartridges and reduced loads, but using a scope like this makes it even easier.

 

[Gatehouse]

Gate, glad to hear you put those slugs to work. As far as I'm concerned anything that makes a hunting rifle more versatile is a good thing. I haven't played with Trail Boss yet and still have enough Unique and 2400 to keep me going for a while. I like 4759 the most, but it never seems to last very long when I do buy some.

It took me awhile, but I'm sure glad I have them. These seem very accurate, and once I figure out how to hold for them at various ranges, I don't see why they wouldn't' be capable of MOG (minute of grouse) out to a good distance. Plus, they are fun to shoot. Did you get these in Canada without too much trouble?

Now I need to find some more nickel plated brass, so I can have a hundred or so rounds on hand.

 

[rookie wildcat]

Many people have been using reduced loads for a long time. In fact we used to go to the club and see who could get the bullet from our .303's out the farthest without falling from the barrel. Now that was a fun day, used up a lot of 1/4in dowel. As for the use of hunting with reduced loads, I loaded a round that was very effective at 25-50 yds in my SKS. I used a load of 4.5gr Unique behind a 220gr Sierra boattail (.30 cal) game King. Avg 930fps.
This quietly took two deer last year within 45 seconds. It wasn't loud enough to spook the deer in the field and the deer hardly acted up when the first one dropped in the spot with a head shot.
LOTS of accuracy and loads of energy at that range.

I'ii have to dig up my data for the 30-06 and somewhere I have some stuff for the .303 with cast 215's. So much stuff, so deep a pile, now...where did I put that...?

 

[Gatehouse]

I'ii have to dig up my data for the 30-06 and somewhere I have some stuff for the .303 with cast 215's. So much stuff, so deep a pile, now...where did I put that...?

If you are interested in trying trailboss powder, Hodgon lists one load with a minimum velocity of 1016 fps

Townsend Whelens famous favorite 30-06 reduced load went a bit faster, (160fps) and he used a FMJ bullet with 4759

 

[Boomer]

Did you get these in Canada without too much trouble?

Yup, Peter Dobson at Hirsch Precision.