Lets talk about sxs

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kennedy

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Since there are so many people here with tremendous knowledge about shotguns and not to mention some really nice ones posted in this forum, it has made me hungry for one. I'm looking for a nice side lock but can't decide which make is better due to lack of knowledge. So, here is a list of possible ones and if anyone is interested in playing this game they can number them by preference of choice of which is a better gun. If you like you can even explain why.
the choices are:
Ugartechea, Grulla, Arrieta, AyA and Merkel
 
I'll just pick my first choice and that would be the AYA hammergun(modern) that I keep seeing pics of in the mags. in AYA advertisements. The others would be up there too but only if they make a modern hammergun too!
 
The guns listed are all of good to excellent quality. When I purchase a shotgun there is one very important factor to consider & that is fit. Unlike a rifle, a field shotgun should come to the shoulder fast and fall so that your sight picture is immediate. Length of pull, to be right, there should be no longer than 1 1/4" from the tip of your nose to the top knuckle of your thumb (hence the old British gunfitters tern "Rule Of Thumb")
Your second concern will be budget. Buy the gun that fits you best for the $ you have to spend.
In order of quality
1- Merkel
2- AYA
3- Arrieta
4- Grulla
5- Ugartechea
Note: Just because the Uggie is listed last. it is a fine gun, particuarly in their upper end sidelocks. Their Boxlocks are average $ in league with Fausti, Weatherby and other run of the mill mid priced guns --- they will all last you a couple of lifetimes.
BTW I had a chance to shoot the Franchi Highlander in 12 ga last night --- sweet gun!
Cheers/luck, John
 
Grouser said:
BTW I had a chance to shoot the Franchi Highlander in 12 ga last night --- sweet gun!
Cheers/luck, John
Click to expand...

John; I suspect that's the one from our shop? Care to give a bit of reveiw? They are the first we've had in stock. I don't know much about them except that they are normally $3500+ and should be a 'good' gun. I haven't shot one but I'll likely keep a 20 for myself.
If I'm correct and its the one from here, I really liked the elegant wood (not fancy, but nicely grained) . The gun was very tight when I put it together before shipping. I suspect it will be better every time it gets put together?
Thanks
Clay
 
Grouser said:
In order of quality
1- Merkel
2- AYA
3- Arrieta
4- Grulla
5- Ugartechea
Click to expand...
I don't quite agree with this ranking as it applies to the Spanish makers. Current production AyA sidelock guns IMO are not quite to the same quality as Arrieta and Grulla when comparing guns in a similar price range.

When comparing boxlocks the Ugartechea is not much different than AyA although I'd probably give AyA the edge.

The Spanish makers all draw their actions and barrels from the same source. The only difference is the time spent on making the gun. The wage rates and abilities are comparable among the makers so there are not huge differences among them.

Merkels are a different style of gun and an excellent choice. I don't have enough experience with them to measure their quality against the Spanish guns.
 
I agree with Grouser, fit is all important. Merkels do not fit me at all, Aya are great. I like SxS and have a few, but my fav is the old Browning BSS. They are heavy & not ideal for most to shoot upland, but it fits me and that transfers to hits. I gess the point is handle them & note how they feel. Try any at the range you can. Good luck AJ
 
Be cautious when it comes to ranking makers' products by brand. A piece of advice that was given to me many years ago still holds true today - "Judge every gun on it's own merits, not by the name of the maker."

In all of history, makers that only produced one grade/quality of gun are exceedingly rare. Even the same make, model and grade can experience changes in quality and design "improvements" from one year to the next. (I put "improvements" in quotations because makers always position design changes as improvements, even when they are often cost-cutting measures that don't necessarily add benefit to shooters.)
 
I have a 28 gauge AYA Model 3A that I purchased new in 1976.It has seen a lot of use since 1976 and has never given me any trouble.
 
The Beretta 471 EL (Extra Lusso - or "Extra Finish") is a very substantial gun, but it's a box lock, not a sidelock. Despite being a Beretta fan, I'd far rather spend that kind of money on a Arrieta, Grulla or AyA sidelock. Beretta's sidelocks are way-up in another "snack-bracket" altogther. Merkel's are a very well made gun, but to me, not as lively feeling as the Spanish game guns.
 
The Merkels are built like tanks, and will never,ever shoot loose. A consideration if you prefer the heavy / fast loads so common on dealers shelves. I would not subject my AYA#1 sidelock to a steady diet of 1-1/4 oz 1300fps loads, but my old Merkel could and did so for several years without ill effect. If you intend to hunt pheasant and late season sharptails without a pointing dog, heavy loads may be a consideration. New Merkels are also rated for steel shot if not choked full, another plus for versatility. I do not know for sure, but I don't think that any of the other guns mentioned in that list above are rated for use with steel. However, a sidexside is best as a specialized upland gun, For light weight and handling, advantage is with the spanish guns.
Fit, suitability to the game hunted, quality of workmanship, and price are the way I'd advise you to decide, in that order. And take it from one who has experimented with short 25" and 26" barrels - as long as the gun is well balanced, longer barrels work better for nearly everything!
 
Yes, the 471 el does have side plates. it's a beautiful gun indeed and not to mention how light it is at 6.5lbs for a 12 gauge. does anyone know how much they are brand new? will they be able to make the stocks to your dimensions since it is a higher end gun? the fausti is pretty much the same as the beretta. im thinking about buying the AyA but before i do would like to know about how all these measure up against each other. for example not sure if the aya is better quality than the Arrieta or grulla's. but at least these you can get them with your exact dimensions.
 
Yep, Merkels are built like tanks but they are still light & lively in the hand. My 16ga O/U weights 6.15 lbs and the 1620 comes in at 6.2 lbs. I like Merkels not only fot the obvious quality but mainly for the way they fit me. I am in the market for a 20 and a 28 ga SxS and am seriously considering Uggie sidelocks --- trying to get info on stock drop and cast.
Cheers, John
 
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Last I looked, a new 471 EL will set you back over $ 10,000.
And no, you don't get to specify stock dimensions, these are not Custom Shop guns.

Of the Spanish guns, I think I would order them Arietta, Grulla, AyA then Ugaratechea ... you can custom order any of them, but be prepared to wait 8 to 10 months or more for delivery.
 
With any side-plated Beretta you pay for a lot of "fancy" but the gun itself is no better than the base model. Sideplates on a boxlock gun make the stock weaker and increase the price because they need to be engraved.

The Silverhawk is only available as a single selectable trigger. If that is what you want then you might want to reconsider a Spanish sxs. They are best avoided in a single selectable configuration

In the $10,000 range my temptation would be to book a flight to Spain and order the gun directly from one of the shops. It's a great adventure. :)
 
can i order a gun directly from spain? don't i need a dealer to do that for me? yes, the beretta's are nice guns but they are still a boxlock and not a true side plate. i really want one nice side by side to hunt with.
so, if one upgrades the wood to an exhibition type of wood will it make the overall gun weaker? or is that wood as strong as the grade 2 or grade 1 wood?
 
sxs

kennedy said:
can i order a gun directly from spain? don't i need a dealer to do that for me? yes, the beretta's are nice guns but they are still a boxlock and not a true side plate. i really want one nice side by side to hunt with.
so, if one upgrades the wood to an exhibition type of wood will it make the overall gun weaker? or is that wood as strong as the grade 2 or grade 1 wood?
Click to expand...

Call Will Bilozir in Alberta (403) 938- 6066. He is the Canadian Distributor for Arrieta, AYA, Grulla & Ugartechea. I know that he stocks the AYA's and Uggies. I believe Grulla and Arrieta are Bespoke guns made to order.
Cheers, John
 
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