Unique is a 45/70 reduced load??

[Holleyman]

I have a bunch of Unique and was wondering if anyone had much luck with 50 and 100 yard shooting reduced loads for the 45/70 using cast bullets.
What kind of accuracy can I expect out of an XLR and is lead fouling a concern with a micro grove barrel?
Any favorite pet loads?

 

[gunlaker]

I have a bunch of Unique and was wondering if anyone had much luck with 50 and 100 yard shooting reduced loads for the 45/70 using cast bullets.
What kind of accuracy can I expect out of an XLR and is lead fouling a concern with a micro grove barrel?
Any favorite pet loads?

You might want to check out MarlinOwners.com. Someone there will be able to point you in the right direction. I've played with Trail Boss for reduced loads but not Unique. Are you sure you have a microgroove barrel on the XLR? I thought all of those were Ballard rifled. My 1895G sure is. It works very well with cast.

Chris.

 

[Johnn Peterson]

I've used a number of cast bullet/powder combo's in light load applications. Unique is one of the powders I've used for these light loads in my Marlin 1895GS and Pedersoli. My best light load cast bullet results though has been using 2400 and IMR 4227, and a filler to keep the powder in close proximity to the primer.

 

[Holleyman]

Good question, I just assumed it was micro-groove, will have to double check that.

 

[sunray]

My old Lyman book gives cast with gas check Unique data for a Win 1886. Up to 552 grains. Lightest is a 292 grain cast with gas check.

 

[H4831]

You have a good powder for the 45-70, mostly with lighter loads.
The first edition Lyman handbook of cast bullets lists Unique with all weights of cast bullets from 140 grain to 500 grain.
With a 500 grain bullet they show a top load of Unique giving 1625 fps. WOW!
If you want a copy of the listings for the 45-70 in the Lyman cast book, PM me your email address and i will send it to you.

 

[sunray]

"...top load of Unique giving 1625 fps..." Something screwy there. That a lever action load? My 45th Edition Lyman book gives the 552 with 14.0(max load) of Unique at 1100fps. A 482 gives a max of 1242fps. Both for a Win 1886.

 

[Johnn Peterson]

Another powder option for light 45-70 cast loads I'm just getting into is Trail Boss.

 

[Al-Sway]

Unique will work fine as a lower velocity load, in the 1100 - 1200 fps range. As for accuracy or leading in your micro-groove barrel, that will depend on the bore diameter and the bullet diameter. Don't assume your bore diameter is .458"; you need to slug it. Then use bullets sized to that diameter.

 

[Edward Teach]

Another powder option for light 45-70 cast loads I'm just getting into is Trail Boss.

13 grains under a 405 grain cast...

 

[Mean Steak]

"...top load of Unique giving 1625 fps..." Something screwy there. That a lever action load? My 45th Edition Lyman book gives the 552 with 14.0(max load) of Unique at 1100fps. A 482 gives a max of 1242fps. Both for a Win 1886.

Yeah thats a bit fast I think. Tho I could be wrong? The fastest load I could find was from my Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook (cica 1973)
OAL 2.550
292 gr H.P. Bullet mould # 457191 (using #2 Alloy)
Unique powder
start grns 14.5 fps 1285
Max grns 18.0 fps 1460

I hope this inf has been helpful
Cheers

 

[unstableryan]

I have been using unique for a while and I have done between 8gr and 14gr. I typically do 11.5 or 12gr behind a soft cast 340gr hp. My best guess in 1100-1200 and it's a 100 yard gun with those.

 

[Johnn Peterson]

13 grains under a 405 grain cast...

Thanks guy. I appreciate that and it matches some Trail Boss load info that was sent to me and I have a 405grBB bullet I've been using. In the info sent to me there are also load listings for a 300grLFP.

Also a friend and shooting buddy, hs4570, that fairly recently passed away, did a lot of load experimenting/development using TB as info was somewhat lacking for many calibers. He posted some of his results/findings on HBC. Very basically, he'd start out at 50% of available case capacity, work up in 1/2 gr increments and found the best light load accuracy at about 62%. By available case capacity, I mean the volume of the case minus the amount of space taken up by the bullet. Anyway, his theory seems to work. Thanks again.

 

[10x]

Unique will work fine as a lower velocity load, in the 1100 - 1200 fps range. As for accuracy or leading in your micro-groove barrel, that will depend on the bore diameter and the bullet diameter. Don't assume your bore diameter is .458"; you need to slug it. Then use bullets sized to that diameter.

I have found that bullets sized to bore diameter will not shoot as well as bullets that are 0.001" or 0.002" over bore diameter.
My marlin 30/30 with microgroove will not shoot a .308 cast bullet accurately at all but the same bullet sized to 0.310" gives groups under an inch at 100 metres with the same load.
I have found that Lee Liquid alox works as well as the lyman and RCBS lubes.

I have used 13 - 15 Grains of Unique with a dacron filler with a 405 grain bullets in both gas check and plain base. The gas check bullets shoot much more accurately than the plain base bullets. If I load the plain base bullets into the bore in the same orientation that they came out of the bullet mold the groups will equal those of gas check bullets.

 

[SandRoad]

Unique is more position sensitive in the case than Trail Boss if Unique is used without a filler.

http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php?t=290656&highlight=unique


You are best to download the complete PDF document as it seems the first page image is now missing from the page.

 

[nrut]

Also a friend and shooting buddy, hs4570, that fairly recently passed away, did a lot of load experimenting/development using TB as info was somewhat lacking for many calibers.

Sorry to hear about your friend hs4570 passing Johnn...
I always enjoyed reading his postings..

 

[Johnn Peterson]

Sorry to hear about your friend hs4570 passing Johnn...
I always enjoyed reading his postings..

He was a good guy, retired LEO and a very knowledgeable shooting buddy, especially concerning light load applications. Bit of a side issue to this thread and I'm not trying to hijack but I was amazed at how fast 'things' progressed. We got together for a 'look' for a Pepperoni Black Bear up a local logging road and at coffee after I asked if he was interested in doing something similar the next day. He said he would but he had a Dr.'s appointment the following morning to get the results of, as he put it, a 'lumpectomy'. You could set your watch by what he said he'd do and when so after not hearing from him after a couple of days, I started making inquiries. It turned out the 'lump' was malignant, he also had cancer in both lungs plus an aggressive brain tumour. I went to visit him and when I got home I told my wife, I wanted to make one more visit before we headed to AB for 1 1/2 months because to me, it didn't look as though he'd be around by the time we got back. About a week later on my next visit, he was already in palliative care in the Naniamo hospital. Just over two weeks into our AB visit, he passed away.

 

[H4831]

"...top load of Unique giving 1625 fps..." Something screwy there. That a lever action load? My 45th Edition Lyman book gives the 552 with 14.0(max load) of Unique at 1100fps. A 482 gives a max of 1242fps. Both for a Win 1886.

I have to agree with you, too, that's why I didn't give any figures.
However, the bullet, Lyman #457406, 500 grain gas check, is whooping right along with some other powders they give.
3031 @ 1770 feet per second
4227, max @ 1615
Hi Vel @ 1760
4320 @ 1710
As far as the lever action Marlin goes,the magazine Handloader had extensive tests on loads in the August 2007 issue. They give pressures and velocities for a great many loads and all loads were shot in the 1895 Marlin.
With 415 grain bullet, they show H-322 giving a max of 2000 fps.
Others go in the 1900+ range, and this column is classed as, "Loads that do not exceed 35,000 CUP."
In the loads that, "Do not exceed 28,000 CUP," they have a 420 grain bullet going 1866 and a couple of loads of H4198 and H4895 going about 1950 fps. with a 415 grain bullet.
The load in the Lyman book that I quoted still looks out of place with the 500 grain going 1625 with Unique.

 

[Garand]

When loading for my Shilo Sharps #3 Sporting rifle in .45/70 and using Unique, my favorite load is 16.2 grains pushing a 405 grain Lead FP GC from the Bullet Barn. At 100 yds it will give me groups anywhere from 1 to 3 inches and a muzzle velocity of 1292.2 fps. I have have no problem hitting gongs out to 300 yds and you can shoot the rifle all day with no recoil problems.

 

[10x]

When loading for my Shilo Sharps #3 Sporting rifle in .45/70 and using Unique, my favorite load is 16.2 grains pushing a 405 grain Lead FP GC from the Bullet Barn. At 100 yds it will give me groups anywhere from 1 to 3 inches and a muzzle velocity of 1292.2 fps. I have have no problem hitting gongs out to 300 yds and you can shoot the rifle all day with no recoil problems.

If you cast your own gas check bullets and orient the bullet to the bore the same every time those groups will get smaller and more consistent.
A cast bullet needs a really good and true base to be accurate.
And for some reason I have found that when I use an index mark from the mold and load the bullet with the index mark in the same position in the chamber each time the groups drop in size.