new build...338??

bingo1010

bingo1010

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with the short days of winter here i am looking ahead to my next rifle. i want something that will go 2000 - 2500 yards accurately, and not break the bank. in the early stages that i am in, i am looking at the 338 edge, the lapua, lapua improved, and possibly the 408 chey tac. am looking for comments from those that own and shoot these rifles. things like brass costs/bullet costs/ availability of said components/ optimum barrel lengths and such. i basically shoot steel targets and am getting bored at 1000 yards so want to stretch things out a bit more. currently i am leaning towards the edge just for the fact that a rem action could be used and brass is readily available, don't know if this is much of a reason or not? thoughts everyone:confused:
 
Hi Steve,

For what it's worth, I think you're on the right track. 300 RUM brass is far cheaper than lapua and you can use a Remmy action. You don't give up a whole lot over the Lapua in terms of ballistic perfomance.

The 408 is cool, but components are going to be a challenge. I know you have done the homework on this, but I vote for an Edge. I would go tight twist to anticipate the New Berger 300 though....
 
I would say a nice min is a 6.5 mystic or a 260AI and heavy VLD bullets. I have pushed my combo to 2300+yds accurately. Big problem is elevation and I have a scope base tha pivots to gain the elevation I need. There isn't a scope that is going to make this trip easily (100 to 120mins is tops).

I think a nice set up would be a 7RM pushing 180gr Berger VLD at 3000 to 3100fps. WAY cheaper then the big bores and ballistics that are right there with the biggest boomers. None of the boomers could be considered cheap to shoot.

As far as components goes, I can offer you all the reg. 338 stuff, brass, bullets, dies, etc. Can offer you 408CT brass if going that route but inexpensive should not be used in this description. Bullets for the 40 can be had from ABC bullet in Salmon Arm.

Barrel length is whatever you feel will fit your overall design. Really doesn't matter how fast you are going at the muzzle cause you are going to be subsonic that far out. So I would look at a 26 to 28" barrel and an effective muzzle brake.

Now if you want a real challenge, how about a fast twist 223? With modern bullets, reaching a mile is not a big deal but doping the conditions certainly is. If you want a challenge, this is it.

I shoot beyond 1000yds with my 223 all the time and find it more fun then any big boomer. I had no problem keeping up with a 338 LM at 1450yds this summer.

Maybe to increase the challenge, smaller is better the bigger? YMMV

Jerry
 
ian i am definetly looking at the berger as i am sure it will be a class leader. i would also think there would have to be a noticable gain in velocity by going to a 28 " min barrel, more realisticly...30-32"?? jerry what kind money is a person looking at for 408 brass and bullets, dies? just out of curiousity jerry how consistent are the smaller bullets (223 and 7mm ) when they go subsonic way out there? thanks guys. another note here also is how do you see bullet splashes with the small calibers out at 1500 + yards??
 
bingo1010 said:
regarding the rem action and a lapua round....i believe there are a few concerns as to the strength..not sure if this is founded or not.
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Totally unfounded. Remington produces a 338 Lapua, and I have built several on 700 actions with no issues. By the time you do all the required modification though you are within a few $$ of a custom action.

The Edge is the most economical to build and shoot, balistically it is the same as standard 338 lapua, the 338 Lapua AI is a significant step up in performance than either, but has drawbacks as far as mag options if a repeater is the plan.

408 brass is $5.50 per casing, dies are spendy and you are looking at about $3.00 per bullet, case life is short to boot. We stock all the 408 components, dies etc and will have several 408 bolt action rifles for sale in the near future.

If it is a budget thing 338 Edge would get my vote, if performance was the requirement 338LAI would be my advice.
 
i really have no need for a mag fed rifle so feeding singly wouldn't concern me. so far as dies go, is there much difference in cost between the edge lapua and lapua imp? what about press sizing....does the lapua require an oversize press or does a standard unit get the job done?
 
bingo1010 said:
i really have no need for a mag fed rifle so feeding singly wouldn't concern me. so far as dies go, is there much difference in cost between the edge lapua and lapua imp? what about press sizing....does the lapua require an oversize press or does a standard unit get the job done?
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If comparing comparable match type dies, there is only about $10.00 difference between all of them. We have Redding make Type S match dies that are matched to our chamber reamers.

A standard press like a Rockchucker will work with all but I prefer a bigger press so as to allow me to put a casing into the press with a bullet set in the mouth. The Redding Ultra mag press would be and is my choice.
 
Rick,

Just out of curiosity - why don't you produce a custom die with your custom rifles? My gunsmith told me that the best way to reload is to take the same reamer and use it to produce a matching die instead of just using the Redding body/neck dies. He still recommends nk sizing but for the actual FL re-sizing he recommends that you use the same reamer to produce the die. Wouldn't it sell better for you then the Redding stuff (which is quite good I might add)?

Glock
 
Glock4ever said:
Rick,

Just out of curiosity - why don't you produce a custom die with your custom rifles? My gunsmith told me that the best way to reload is to take the same reamer and use it to produce a matching die instead of just using the Redding body/neck dies. He still recommends nk sizing but for the actual FL re-sizing he recommends that you use the same reamer to produce the die. Wouldn't it sell better for you then the Redding stuff (which is quite good I might add)?

Glock
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On any of the calibers that I have non SAAMI spec reamers, I get Dave Manson, my reamer supplier to make 2 identical reamers. 1 gets sent to me the other goes to Redding with which they then make my dies with.
The Redding body dies are an exact match to the chamber. Neck dies use bushings so you can tailor the neck tension as desired. We cut the sleeve for the seating dies here as they are not hardened.
So in all are doing as your guy suggests just in a slightly different way.
 
One thing to keep in mind if you are contemplating a smaller caliber is that spotting misses is much more difficult with the little bullets. Bigger, heavier bullets produce a bigger dust cloud on impact.

I shot a fast twist, hot rodded .243 to 2000 yds and the two problems we ran into was spotting misses and wind drift. If you really want to have a good chance at distances beyond 1500 yds then you will need a bigger caliber.
 
If your not worried about barrel life take a look at something like a 338 Allen Magnum. An "improved" 408 case with the shoulder moved forward and necked down to 338. Or something like a 375 cheytac/375sniptac/375allen mag. All based off of the 408 case.
 
LongBomber said:
If your not worried about barrel life take a look at something like a 338 Allen Magnum. An "improved" 408 case with the shoulder moved forward and necked down to 338. Or something like a 375 cheytac/375sniptac/375allen mag. All based off of the 408 case.
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Yup brutal barrel life. The 2 guys who pioneered the 408 (505 Giibbs originally)necked down to 338, 20 plus years ago (Skip Talbot and #### Davis) found 500 rounds about all she wrote.
Talk about grossly overbore.
 
LongBomber said:
If your not worried about barrel life take a look at something like a 338 Allen Magnum. An "improved" 408 case with the shoulder moved forward and necked down to 338. Or something like a 375 cheytac/375sniptac/375allen mag. All based off of the 408 case.
Click to expand...

3300fps with a 300 SMK.......that would truly make an awesome LR hunting rig. However, a guy would have to develop a load for him and then put it away in the safe. I don't think you'd want to be doing too much "plinking" with that monster.
 
UPDATE; As promised, a range report from my custom 6.5x55 that I bought here on CGN. Only had 16 rounds loaded as it arrived unexpectedly (wasn't sure it was coming for a while) but it made the most of them. Printed .3" groups@ 100 yds with norma factory and .2" with Sierra 140's. The rifle is extremely accurate, hitting 2 ft gong at 1000. Never thought that I'd consider a 1000 yd range not long enough till today. Sure hope weather stays nice so I can go to my own little (2000 yd) range and push it even further
 
If you're truly on a budget, the often over-looked/forgotten 340 Weatherby may be an option as well. You can buy relatively inexpensive and easily obtainable (RP) 300 Weatherby brass and neck-up the brass as required.

You'll be within 200 fps (or so) of the standard .338 Lapua and you can of course use a standard LA Remington with no issues.

In the .338 game, you have a number of cartridge options available. All of them are capable performers, as Rick can no doubt attest.
 
My vote would be for the Edge as well. Maybe even the Edge AI. The L.Imp. would be even better, but you're much more restricted in what action you can use.

My recommendation is to definitely go custom. If you want to ring gongs, punch paper or shoot creatures way out there you'll be much happier with a custom rig that has the potential to do it. I handled a Remington MLR (didn't fire it) and must say that I was nto impressed with the fit and finish or the barrel length. I believe that the 338 Lapua/L.Imp. wants to have a 28-30" barrel to wring out all the potential of the big case. The 26" barrel on the MLR would be better suited to a 300 WM, not a case that burns upwards of 100 grains of slow powder in a small bore.
 
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