Proposed Black powder storage regs

Why do we need such legislation?
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To add certainty. While it's nice being able to keep as much loaded ammo as "reasonable", it also opens the door for "someone" to say that the 2000 rounds someone might keep is too much, leaving him open to charges that have to be defended at considerable cost.
The new proposal also actually increases the amount of powder most of us can legally keep in our homes, and simplifies some stuff. Most reloaders never really understood the "separation distances" thing, for instance.

What we can see of this proposal isn't perfect, yet; but with a little adjustment I think we can gain some serious net benefits for all of us.


Trotter:
We already have police charge us for having too much ammo.
 
The last time they tried things they stopped and posted this on their web site. I saved the page and also printed it off knowing full well it would come back again.
This is from Natural Resources Canada, Explosives Regulatory Division.

"July 28, 2006 - Ammunition Update

Handloading Regulations
Currently, the government will not be proceeding with any new handloading regulations.

Handloading, when properly practised, has been shown to be a safe activity and it has a good safety record. Any potential amendments that are made to the regulations will only be done after a need has been established and extensive consultations have been conducted."

Note they said a need having to be established and extensive consultations being conducted. I think they are lying.
 
theDuck said:
The last time they tried things they stopped and posted this on their web site. I saved the page and also printed it off knowing full well it would come back again.
This is from Natural Resources Canada, Explosives Regulatory Division.

"July 28, 2006 - Ammunition Update

Handloading Regulations
Currently, the government will not be proceeding with any new handloading regulations.

Handloading, when properly practised, has been shown to be a safe activity and it has a good safety record. Any potential amendments that are made to the regulations will only be done after a need has been established and extensive consultations have been conducted."

Note they said a need having to be established and extensive consultations being conducted. I think they are lying.
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The rumour is that the "Extensive consultations" are being done with a major firearms group right now.
2KG of black powder shows that maybe they are consulting the wrong people.
 
"Stakeholders" and "firearms groups" seems to be mumbo jumbo designed to make it look like they are working with us. But as mentioned already the limits they are seeking to impose are rediculous. As mentioned 4kg of total powder is ludicrous for an active shooting family or even for someone with a few BP arms that require different grades of powder. Now if they said 4 kg in the house but allow for a separate magazine to hold the excess in an outbuilding then maybe.

And 300 loaded rounds? THAT'S NUTZ! ! ! ! If I sit down to load I'm going to do enough that I don't need to re-load for a while. And as we all know it doesn't take that long to shoot off 300 hand gun rounds.

It sounds more and more like if they are listening to any shooters at all that they are not including the various rifle and handgun groups.

It would be nice if the political powers actually dealt with a group that we know and support and that reports back to us independantly so we know that this is all on the up and up. But as it sits now the "stakeholders" and "firearms group" they are dealing with seem to be rather vacuous and ill informed if they even exist at all.
 
BCRider said:
"Stakeholders" and "firearms groups" seems to be mumbo jumbo designed to make it look like they are working with us. But as mentioned already the limits they are seeking to impose are rediculous. As mentioned 4kg of total powder is ludicrous for an active shooting family or even for someone with a few BP arms that require different grades of powder. Now if they said 4 kg in the house but allow for a separate magazine to hold the excess in an outbuilding then maybe.

And 300 loaded rounds? THAT'S NUTZ! ! ! ! If I sit down to load I'm going to do enough that I don't need to re-load for a while. And as we all know it doesn't take that long to shoot off 300 hand gun rounds.

It sounds more and more like if they are listening to any shooters at all that they are not including the various rifle and handgun groups.

It would be nice if the political powers actually dealt with a group that we know and support and that reports back to us independantly so we know that this is all on the up and up. But as it sits now the "stakeholders" and "firearms group" they are dealing with seem to be rather vacuous and ill informed if they even exist at all.
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The 300 rounds seems to refer to loaded black powder cartridges.
Not enough for two people to shoot a match but more than enough for one. I guess this would be a ligitimate reason to have a second home and get a legal separation....
 
10x said:
The 300 rounds seems to refer to loaded black powder cartridges.
Not enough for two people to shoot a match but more than enough for one. I guess this would be a ligitimate reason to have a second home and get a legal separation....
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Yeah right... I'll let YOU sell this one to the wife and then I'll stand back to see the outcome...... My moneys on her... :D
 
BCRider said:
Yeah right... I'll let YOU sell this one to the wife and then I'll stand back to see the outcome...... My moneys on her... :D
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This may mean she doesn't shoot in the next match, or if she wears the pants as you suggest you are not going to shoot while she does...
 
So has anybody found this on the NRCAN web site and can post a link, this does really look like the BS from years ago. If it is current there has to be a place where it came from or did I miss something?
 
I think the number in brackets is an approximate number of shells that can be loaded with 2 kg. or about 80 or 90 grains per shell. You will find a somewhat similar estimate down at the bottom of the page where it estimates the number of shells in 225 kg.

As I read it, you can have a separate outside storage of 25 kg and there appears to be no defined distance that the storage has to be separated from the dwelling. In other words you appear to be able to have a magazine a couple of feet behind the house as long as it is separate from the house.

cheers mooncoon
 
Get the facts before more speculation results in our opponents getting this as another reason not to let us have firearms.

Call the CSSA etc for details first
 
mooncoon said:
I think the number in brackets is an approximate number of shells that can be loaded with 2 kg. or about 80 or 90 grains per shell. You will find a somewhat similar estimate down at the bottom of the page where it estimates the number of shells in 225 kg.

As I read it, you can have a separate outside storage of 25 kg and there appears to be no defined distance that the storage has to be separated from the dwelling. In other words you appear to be able to have a magazine a couple of feet behind the house as long as it is separate from the house.

cheers mooncoon
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That would make security an issue. The magazine would have to be disguised as a garden shed and the owner would have to keep their mouth shut.
 
tstevet said:
Get the facts before more speculation results in our opponents getting this as another reason not to let us have firearms.

Call the CSSA etc for details first
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Raising a hew and cry over changes to the reloading regulations that are (or may) being considered shows the antis that we are dedicated and serious.
The individual that released this document claimed to be involved in the negotiations and claimed to be part of one of the large gun orgs in Canada.
This "leak" may be a test balloon to gauge reaction as to what the bureaucrats can get away with.
Or it may be real negotiations.
In any case having the folks that could be effected respond and call their M.P.s with requests to make the regs reasonable educates M.P.s and also keeps the NRCAN in line.

If there is a shooting organization negotiating these regs then maybe they should consult their members as well and make their members aware of what is on the table and what the Shooting org. is willing to accept.

Real and we have responded with our concerns and educated bureaucrats and politicians. If there is a shooting org negotiating we have also given them our concerns.
Fake and we have responded with our concerns and educated bureaucrats and politicians.

All it takes is for the shooting org to allow a 2Kg limit on black powder and they have sold out all of the black powder shooters in Canada.
I would hope that a shooting org would not sacrifice one group to gain in other areas.
Real or fake we can NOT afford to be complacent and we can not afford to let an unknown shooting organization negotiate deals with bureaucrats.
 
OK, this might sound like a silly question...

But when they are talking about "Black Powder", do they mean "black powder" or do they mean "black powder substitute"?

For a reason or another, I always thought that stuff like "Pyrodex" by Hodgdon fell under the same rules/regulations/shipping/storage guidelines as smokeless powder.

Personnally, I don't know of many individual who still use "black powder"
 
sillymike said:
OK, this might sound like a silly question...

But when they are talking about "Black Powder", do they mean "black powder" or do they mean "black powder substitute"?

For a reason or another, I always thought that stuff like "Pyrodex" by Hodgdon fell under the same rules/regulations/shipping/storage guidelines as smokeless powder.

Personnally, I don't know of many individual who still use "black powder"
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I shoot black powder cartidge almost exclusively. For a 2 day cowboy action shoot, I could easily need over 300 shotgun, pistol and rifle cartridges; all blackpowder!!!
 
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