Pat Rogers "Tier 1" Guns

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blueblast

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Anybody read the article on Pat Roger's training facility in December's Combat Arms magazine?
The author mentions Pat's "Tier 1, 2 and 3" for ranking ARs. The only guns he lists are a LM&T MRP and S&W's M & P carbine, in the Tier 1 category. (I'm assuming that Norcs are Tier 3).
I googled the heck of of this one, and can't find this list anywhere, or what other guns are Tier 1 and 2.
Anybody got any more info on this list, or idea or where other AR's would fall?
 
Is Stag tier 1? I would put FN, Colt/Diemaco in there as well as its a contract gun.

Perhaps KevinB will come along and provide all the necessary info.
 
USP said:
Is Stag tier 1?

Perhaps KevinB will come along and provide all the necessary info.
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STAG parent is CMT....

Tier 2 would be your Armalite, DPMS and Bushmasters, RRA

Tier 3 would be places like Olympic, Doublestar, Bravo company, Del-Ton....the stores that end up assembling their own Rifles
 
This should be fun...:popCorn: None of it really matters and given money and will any Company can put out Tier 1 guns (as the term has been commonly used) Stag special run guns certainly are, but I don't think they get the destructive testing that Colt/FN/Diemaco does on their production units...
 
rivetc78 said:
STAG parent is CMT....

Tier 2 would be your Armalite, DPMS and Bushmasters, RRA

Tier 3 would be places like Olympic, Doublestar, Bravo company, Del-Ton....the stores that end up assembling their own Rifles
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Where does Vulcan Arms or Hesse fit in?

I mean, They are "the machine guns of the special forces!"
 
sparrow said:
This should be fun...:popCorn: None of it really matters and given money and will any Company can put out Tier 1 guns (as the term has been commonly used) Stag special run guns certainly are, but I don't think they get the destructive testing that Colt/FN/Diemaco does on their production units...
Click to expand...

Yeah I was under the impression that the Tier 1 stuff had been tested with certain destructive test, metal checks and different levels of anodizing. Passing tests though is an expensive proposition and doenst necessarily mean that the product is superior, just that it meets certain standards and tests. Some smaller manufacturers could possibly build a superior product yet fail to have it tested due to cost associated with it.
 
Wendell said:
He's so high-speed, he says he won't train Canadian civilians.

Who gives a f**k what he thinks?
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He won't train Canadian civilians for a reason...

Pat is respected in the biz and his courses not only are in demand but fill up. Seeing how training the Canadian civilian population doesn't pay his bills...I am sure he doesn't give a flying f**k what you think either. :kickInTheNuts:
 
Some of that destructive tested is pretty hard on a gun too ...don't get me wrong, I drink the Kool-Aid but realistically addressing the way most guys use their guns they would sheit at seeing the proofing done ...I say stake the receiver lock ring and the gas key ...buy tons of ammo and forget about the "Chart" or the "Tier" ratings. Professional use is a whole different ball game though.
 
Wendell said:
He's so high-speed, he says he won't train Canadian civilians.

Who gives a f**k what he thinks?
Click to expand...

He can't train Cdns (or other foreign nationals) under the same ITAR that restricts the sale of cool AR parts up here.

Your scorn should be directed at B.S. U.S. laws rather than Pat Rogers.
 
recce said:
He can't train Cdns (or other foreign nationals) under the same ITAR that restricts the sale of cool AR parts up here.

Your scorn should be directed at B.S. U.S. laws rather than Pat Rogers.
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That's not true.

Other ITAR-regulated U.S.-based training businesses like Sigarms and the U.S Training Centre are happy to accept our applications, and - unlike him - they will apply for the necessary waiver from the U.S. DOS.
 
Wendell said:
That's not true.

Other ITAR-regulated U.S.-based training businesses like Sigarms and the U.S Training Centre are happy to accept our applications, and - unlike him - they will apply for the necessary waiver from the U.S. DOS.
Click to expand...

They are also both bigger firms than Pat's. It's the same as Brownells willingness to deal with the paper work BS where other companies won't. If you have a source that is willing to do the required paperwork and provide the training you want, then go to them. Don't blame someone for not wanting to jump through hoops for a small market.
 
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