LOP For Combat/Police/IPSC Shotgun?

[mmattockx]

I am building an 870 with an 18.5" barrel for use as a truck, animal protection, IPSC competition type gun. I am keeping the standard stock, but would like to shorten it up a bit. I typically use a 14.5" LOP for a trap shotgun and the 870 currently sits at a touch over 14", which feels a bit long for quick handling. How much should I look at shortening it up and what type of recoil pad would be recommended? I am thinking a sporting clays type of pad that will not snag on clothing when mounting from a low ready position.

Any experiences, thoughts, ideas welcome.

Thanks,
Mark

 

[Wendell]

An adjustable length of pull, recoil-attenuating, pistol-gripped stock is the obvious choice.

Either the Knoxx (Blackhawk) Spec-Ops or the Mesa /Enidine for AR stocks.

http://www.blackhawk.com/product/SpecOps-Adjustable-Shotgun-Stock,1158,165.htm

http://www.mesatactical.com/index.php?id=55

Canadian retailers would include TSE and S&J Hardware.

 

[mmattockx]

An adjustable length of pull, recoil-attenuating, pistol-gripped stock is the obvious choice.

I would prefer to keep the wood stock set on it now, I much prefer it to a plastic pistol grip stock. However, I may break down and buy one anyways. That versatility is one of the greatest things about a 12ga pump shotgun.

That said, how short do people set their LOP with conventional stocks?

Thanks,
Mark

 

[870P]

I run a 12" LOP Hogue stock on my 870 and while I orginally thought it was going to be too short I find that its just about right for "tactical" shooting.

 

[badboybeeson]

I have a slightly used 12" lop stock set from houge withthe short forend for $85

 

[THE.KJK]

Take the gun and hold the trigger with your trigger finger nice and comfortably. Then where the but end of the stock meets the 90 degree bend in your elbow should be the comfortable LOP.

 

[manbearpig]

I would prefer to keep the wood stock set on it now, I much prefer it to a plastic pistol grip stock. However, I may break down and buy one anyways. That versatility is one of the greatest things about a 12ga pump shotgun.

That said, how short do people set their LOP with conventional stocks?

Thanks,
Mark

you can cut the wood down to length.
but, this will involve having to either grind the factory pad or buy a grind-to-fit limbsaver or pachmeyer pad and a lot of grinding and shaping and sanding to get it to fit perfect. .

wood stocks are nice, but shortening them is a lot more work than you think, and is a totally irrevocable modification. do yourself a favor and get something like a knoxx specops stock. if for some reason you end up not liking it, you can sell it within minutes on the EE. the knoxx stock isnt just a quality adjustable stock with great ergonomics, but the recoil reduction in it is very effective and itll help you get back on target quicker, as well as not feel so sore after shooting a couple boxes of slugs or heavy buck -- which is also the reason you shouldnt skimp out and get the cheap NRS (non-recoil reducing version) or youll find yourself wishing you did later.

if youre on a budget and already have ARs, another option is to just pick up a TSA adapter from brownells (#432-000-002) - its a $35 adapter that allows you to use AR stocks and grips on an 870.

if you really, really despise the pistol grip collapsible stocks then order a hogue short LOP stock set. mine cost around $100 to my door straight from hogue (call in the order) with a forend. here it is on a wingmaster:

again if you decide you dont like it, these stocks also sell very quickly on the EE.


...and i should also add another advantage of synthetic stocks for trunk/truck and beater guns that a lot of people overlook: they let you very quickly and liberally oil/grease the gun (youll need it if youre storing it in a car for any period of time) without having to worry about it running into the stock/end grain and (over time) ruining your stock. theyre also totally impervious to moisture and POI changes from humidity, though this is a factor on an 870.

 

[Claybuster]

The LOP on my target guns is 14-3/4 inches. On my 870 the Hogue stock is 13-3/4 inches. Because I am used to using conventional stocks I find the pistol grip stocks awkward and unfamiliar.

The very short 12" stocks don't work at all for me. Compared to my regular stocks they also feel awkward and they are so short that I risk having a thumb jammed in my face under recoil. Try one before you buy one if possible.

I'd suggest taking your stock and cutting it down in 1/4" increments. Remount the recoil pad and see how it feels. Cut more if you need to and once done get the recoil pad fitted that you want keeping in mind that your recoil pad may have a different thickness and that has to be taken into account for LOP measurements.

 

[faizi]

Where Hogue short LOP stock only can order?

 

[manbearpig]

straight from Hogue - phone in your order and ask for just regular post (NOT UPS/FedEx) to Canada as the shipping method.

or buy BBB's used one for $85 that he mentioned above. if i didnt already have two, id have bought his already.

 

[faizi]

I have a slightly used 12" lop stock set from houge withthe short forend for $85

This stock for which shotgun?can it be fitted at Maverick88 shotgun?

 

[manbearpig]

Hogue sells different stocks for 870 and 500s.
http://www.hoguestore.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=18

try ordering one from the factory. but IIRC from an older thread i remember you saying you were in the middle east, youll probably run into problems with US export restrictions.

 

[mmattockx]

Take the gun and hold the trigger with your trigger finger nice and comfortably. Then where the but end of the stock meets the 90 degree bend in your elbow should be the comfortable LOP.

That gives me the 14.5" LOP, which is good for field and trap guns, but too long for "tactical" shooting.

you can cut the wood down to length.
but, this will involve having to either grind the factory pad or buy a grind-to-fit limbsaver or pachmeyer pad and a lot of grinding and shaping and sanding to get it to fit perfect. .

<snip>

if you really, really despise the pistol grip collapsible stocks then order a hogue short LOP stock set. mine cost around $100 to my door straight from hogue (call in the order) with a forend. here it is on a wingmaster:

again if you decide you dont like it, these stocks also sell very quickly on the EE.

I am OK with the work to shorten the stock and install a recoil pad. It is definitely irreversible, though. A short Hogue set may work for me, I really do prefer a conventional stock style over a pistol grip. Maybe I will buy one of the many 870 Express synthetic stock sets off the EE and shorten that a bit at a time to find what feels good and then look at a Hogue set at that LOP.

What barrel length is your 870? That looks pretty much exactly like what I want to end up with.

Fair point on synthetic stocks for truck use/abuse and bush use. Wood really does get beat up and scratched pretty fast when pushing through heavy undergrowth and bouncing around in a vehicle.

The very short 12" stocks don't work at all for me. Compared to my regular stocks they also feel awkward and they are so short that I risk having a thumb jammed in my face under recoil. Try one before you buy one if possible.

I was worried about getting hit with my thumb, too. My M1 Garand will bop me one if I am not careful about how I place my cheek on the stock and hold my thumb off to the side and it is a bit over 13" LOP.

Thanks for all the help gentlemen,
Mark

 

[manbearpig]

thats an 18.5" barrel with a +2 mag extension (Scattergun Tech/Wilson Combat). since that pic was taken ive also added an S&J bayonet adapter/barrel clamp and swapped the mag extension with a bayonet compatible one

IMO a shorter LOP is much easier to adjust to than a long one. im over 6' and in just a t-shirt my face is still an inch away from my thumb with that hogue short LOP stock. ive never had a problem with hitting my face under recoil. perhaps if you had a gigantic head like Tito Ortiz it would be a problem, my head is average sized.

Claybuster undoubtedly has a lot more experience fitting shotguns than i do, so im not disputing what he said -- just that the Hogue short LOP stock works for me.

i am not sure how successful you would be at cutting down a factory 870 synthetic stock - for the following reasons:
1. the new pads cant be ground.
2. the stocks are hollow and have sortof plastic 'tubes' molded into them that the screws go into. cut the stock down too much and these 'tubes' get too short for the length of the screw. you can shorten the screws, but there will come a point where you cannot cut the stock down any further -- and you may be able to cut far less than you think.

i would consider taking up BBB on his short LOP stock offer - if it doesnt work out you will have no problem selling it on the EE for that much.

Fair point on synthetic stocks for truck use/abuse and bush use. Wood really does get beat up and scratched pretty fast when pushing through heavy undergrowth and bouncing around in a vehicle.

its less about getting them 'beat up', as i wouldnt mind a wood stock specifically put on a trunk gun getting beat/scratched up a bit.
its that, at least in my area, you need to really liberally oil/grease a trunk/beater gun to keep it from rusting. which means frequent oilings, spraying oil into the action to displace water after using it in snow/rain, etc. with synthetic you dont have to worry about any of that oil - or water - soaking into the stock. warping is not an issue since there wont be a POI change with a shotgun like there may be with a warped rifle stock.

this is another one of my shotguns that has had about a bit more than an inch cut from the LOP and the factory remmy pad reground:

i prefer the oldskool look of wood but if you are going to use this as a trunk gun/beater then synthetic is a better choice IMHO.

 

[terez]

Lop

I have a short LOP Hogue on one of my combat 870's and it is ideal when wearing body armor and or a heavy winter jacket but it is too short otherwise.

I am 5ft 11in tall and of average build.

I use the short LOP Hogue on a 14in 870 to make it as compact as possible for camping/hiking etc but I use a normal LOP stock for most shooting.

If I was going to alter a stock I would shoot for something around 13.5in for a good fast handling length.

 

[faizi]

Hogue sells different stocks for 870 and 500s.
http://www.hoguestore.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=18

try ordering one from the factory. but IIRC from an older thread i remember you saying you were in the middle east, youll probably run into problems with US export restrictions.

Yes,u r right.i am residing in Pakistan nowadays.but one of my buddy is comming to Pakistan on vacation fron Canada.
i hope Hogue will deliver to Canada directly.

 

[manbearpig]

to the OP:

i just finished cutting down a wood 870 Express stock to a shorter LOP and it turned out excellent, so if you have a sacrificial wood stock you could try it. this time i used an 8" bench grinder and it went a lot smoother than the last time i tried it on a smaller grinder where i couldnt use the flat sides of the wheel to grind. this was one of the older style (very common) 870 stocks with the solid black rubber, pre-R3/SuperCell pad. here are some tips that worked for me, perhaps someone else has something to add:

1. take some 2" wide painter's masking tape and wrap a strip a couple times around where you want to cut. draw your cutting line on this because its more visible than on the stock. this should also reduce grain tearing out at the edges of the cut.
2. when you finish cutting, 'lap' the base of the stock a bit on some sandpaper taking care not to rock it while youre lapping.
3. screw the buttplate on. the top screw will work fine, the bottom screw will need to be replaced with a short screw or itll go right through the stock. if you make a significant change to the LOP, then even a short screw wont work - youll need to do what i did, which is re-drill a pilot hole for the bottom screw at an upwards angle. i filled the original hole with epoxy. this solution worked fine and let me use a standard length screw, its angled upwards at roughly the same angle as the bottom of the stock.
4. with the pad screwed on, use a sharp exacto knife to score a line around the hard plastic plate of the pad to mark how much you need to grind off. careful not to damage the stock.
5. using a bench grinder, grind off the pad. be careful, it goes pretty fast on these old pads. if you are making any significant changes to LOP youll be grinding a lot of rubber off, so a dust mask is mandatory and i recommend you wear crappy work clothes since youll be coated in black dust. take your grinder outside to do it. a wide paintbrush is great for dusting both yourself and the grinder off afterwards.
its best to refit the pad every now and then and doublecheck how much you are removing since once the material is ground off its gone for good

with the fine side of a grinding stone the resulting finish on the rubber recoil pad actually looks pretty factory, not the rough mess i expected it to be. as for the fit, its 95% - i have a couple spots on my pad which are a few thousandths of an inch wider or narrower than the stock but its only visible under very close inspection and its no worse than a factory express. if you wanted a 100% perfect fit, youd probably have to refinish the stock and sand the stock and pad together. mines for a hard use gun and not a safe queen so i could care less.

ill post some pics later.

 

[OC-3]

I have a Houge 12" LOP on my HP9. It is compact but it is a little short, with slugs you need to keep your thumb on top (not wrapped around) the reciever or you will get a smack.

I ended up adding a 1" slip on recoil pad which is then covered up by the velcro of my shell carier. This adds a bit of length and makes the LOP workable.

 

[CNADNSL8-5]

cutting down a wood stock is not too hard. just take your time and don't rush. Manbearpig gives good instructions in his post. Here is one I did earlier this year.

 

[manbearpig]

^mine pretty much ended up almost exactly like that, except i think i took off a bit more. exact same old style rubber recoil pad too.
did you have to angle the screw as well or did you just use a really short one?
i estimate after cutting the bottom screw would have only had about 1/4" room to go if id have kept it in its original hole.

ill post pics when i get home, i forgot to bring my camera card reader with me.

i hope you dont mind, i used your photo to illustrate what i mean by angling the screw. i dont have photoshop either so a crude MS paint drawing will have to suffice. the yellow parallel lines are the factory screws, the green is what i had to do with the bottom screw to work with the short LOP. i used a 1/8" drill bit to drill a pilot, but check your pad screws and make sure you are using a proper diameter drill bit. i recommend you do this BEFORE you grind the pad, so that any small shift in the pad when you change the bottom mounting point wont result in an ill-fitting pad.