Starting to plan a custom build thinking 6.5mm calibre

ceriksson

ceriksson

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Ok, been reading up and looking at ballistics I am going to settle on 6.5mm rounds, now to pick the right case. Right now i'm going between either 6.5-06 or 6.5mm Winchester Magnum.

This will be a long range rifle so I'm going for higher velocity for heavier rounds to get the most of the BC of the 140gr and higher rounds.

Jerry I'm thinking of you and plan on giving you a call so we can actually get some ideas going.

I'm thinking a shilen barrel, then as for actions something that can have a rem 700 footprint so I can have more choice in stocks.

I like the more tactical look but lets not get ahead of ourselves

I can't afford to built it in one go right away so right now picking the right cartridge and then barrel is the first step.

I'm thinking of going with either a shilen heavy barrel (like a Heavy Palma contour or similar) or another maker like Krieger, Rock Creek or Gaillard. Shilen looks to make a good variety though.

SO ideas?
 
6.5X284 will exceed the 65-06 and will be close enough to the win mag with better barrel life. You will not find a 6.5 round with a better long range reputation, plus you can get great brass for it. Not so the other two, unless you can find some lapua 30-06 brass.

Ackleyized 260 is very close too, but the 6.5X284 is a no muss way to get great results.

I keep heavy barrel 6.5's in stock
 
If I had to do my 6.5-08 over again I would go with the 260AI.

My 6.5-08 will shoot 1/2 MOA or better way out there if I can do my part but it's only going 2840fps.
 
After looking at some ballistics data I'm really leaning towards 264 Winchester Magnum for the velocities.. BUT

You do make some good points obtunded about the 6.5x284. I think you may have a PM coming
 
I shoot the 123gr Scenar out of a 30" Shilen chambered in 260AI from Jerry for about 3200 FPS ( I can't remember exactly what the chrony said right now) And I love it.. I have only been to 735 yards so far but everything looks good.. Definitely sub MOA and I think it will be better now with my new scale for more accurate powder measurement.
 
I built a 6.5x55. Same bullet as a Win Mag, but way better barrel life and powder, easy to shoot. They all go sub sonic at some time. I think the extra high speeds are great at hunting ranges, but when you get out really far, who cares. If the drop of one bullet is 6' and the other is 8', does it really matter? You still have to KNOW the drop and once you know it, it doesn't matter what that drop is. At hunting ranges, maybe being 6" low at 400y vs. being 10" is worth the speed, especially at unknown ranges, but at 1000 or so, all those bullets have more or less slowed down and are flying right beside each other, dropping like stones. You still have to know where they're going to land. My .02$ anyway. I built a 6.5x55 on a heavy Krieger barrel
 
Well I just placed an order with obtunded for a 6.5mm 5R Krieger Barrel so there is one part out of the way.

Now I have to start thinking of an action and stock. I'm going to go with a 6.5x284 round which gives me an option for Short Action actions. I'm thinking of something with a 700 footprint.
 
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I rebarreled my LTR to a 260AI and am very happy with it. I can push 140gr class bullets near the 3000fps mark out of a 24" barrel, I keep it in the LTR stock for hunting, but I have another option that runs AI mags that will allow me to seat bullets out farther.

I also shoot a few 6.5x55's and they are very nice as well. Anythin with bigger capacity and barrel life starts get reduced a fair bit.
 
ceriksson said:
Well I just placed an order with obtunded for a 6.5mm 5R Krieger Barrel so there is one part out of the way.

Now I have to start thinking of an action and stock. I'm going to go with a 6.5x284 round which gives me an option for Short Action actions. I'm thinking of something with a 700 footprint.
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When you look at $600-$700 to get a custom barrel and have it installed, I would want something that would stay competitve for more than 1000-1200 rounds.Gunsmiths and barrel makers love the 6.5-.284 because it keeps the customer coming back year after year. If you only shoot 100 rounds a year, no problem, the barrel will last 10 years. But if you are putting 1000 rounds plus down range a year you will have to rebarrel at the end of the season.

The 6.5-.284 would not have any real advantage over any of the other 6.5's or any caliber for that matter at ranges out to 600 yards. At the end of the day it is the best wind reader that wins the match regardless of the caliber you shoot.
 
If you want a SA, do consider the Savage as it has a longer mag box then the Rem. The 140's are very long and seated to 2.80", it will be quite into the case.

The Savage will allow almost 3" so you can put them where they belong.

The 6.5-284 IS a great LR cartridge and will push the 140's faster then a 260AI/6.5 Mystic. It will also wear faster but that is the cost of playing fast. This only becomes apparent at distances beyond 800yds. The difference in speed would be around 100/150fps for the larger case.

Personally, if mag feeding was needed and I wanted decent mag capacity, I would go with the 6.5-06. It is every bit as accurate as a 6.5-284 in the type of rig you are describing and will offer a bit more case capacity so speeds will be the same if not faster.

And if you go with a Rem action, the 6.5-06 will feed easily. Not sure how much fussing will be needed to get a 6.5-284 to feed in a Rem SA.

The 264Win mag is way too much case capacity unless you plan on using a 28 to 30" barrel. Otherwise, you are just making noise.

Good luck with your build.

Jerry
 
I'm not too concerned with barrel life as I don't shoot anywhere near 1000rnds/year. I shoot maybe 200 a year. Plus I would plan on rechambering the rifle to a larger round eventually once it does wear out.

Jerry, are you bringing in actions at all?

mysticplayer said:
If you want a SA, do consider the Savage as it has a longer mag box then the Rem. The 140's are very long and seated to 2.80", it will be quite into the case.

The Savage will allow almost 3" so you can put them where they belong.

The 6.5-284 IS a great LR cartridge and will push the 140's faster then a 260AI/6.5 Mystic. It will also wear faster but that is the cost of playing fast. This only becomes apparent at distances beyond 800yds. The difference in speed would be around 100/150fps for the larger case.

Personally, if mag feeding was needed and I wanted decent mag capacity, I would go with the 6.5-06. It is every bit as accurate as a 6.5-284 in the type of rig you are describing and will offer a bit more case capacity so speeds will be the same if not faster.

And if you go with a Rem action, the 6.5-06 will feed easily. Not sure how much fussing will be needed to get a 6.5-284 to feed in a Rem SA.

The 264Win mag is way too much case capacity unless you plan on using a 28 to 30" barrel. Otherwise, you are just making noise.

Good luck with your build.

Jerry
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Nope, sorry no firearms or actions.

Just remember that these long VLD's don't like going much over 3000fps. That is the main reason most 6.5-284 are underutilized and run right around this speed. Some even have to run slower.

I have yet to hear of anyone getting bughole accuracy at 3100fps or faster but I would to hear about it.

Big reason why I designed the 6.5 Mystic in the first place. It gave me the speed I wanted 2900 to 3000fps with the heavies and is way easier on the barrel. Accuracy has been splendid too and I have pushed out to 2350yds.

The big reason for more speed is if you are hunting and then the extra velocity WILL offer an advantage on target but for paper punching and steel gongs, an extra 200fps (if it will shoot) is lost in the noise.

If you really want extreme range ballistics, the 6.5 is eclisped badly by the 7mm. I am just starting to play with a Shilen 7RM barrel. I will be pushing 180gr Bergers over 3000fps. Chronie froze up (literally) but I was just at 3000fps and my best load so far uses more powder. My SWAG would be around 3050fps.

Best part, this bullet can sit at mag length and there is plenty of case capacity to make it all work.

Run the numbers of the 180gr Berger at 3050fps and it will be very eye opening. Barrel life will be about the same as the 6.5-284 but performance AND recoil will be substantially higher.

Jerry
 
The `142 Sierra is the 6.5mm long range bullet paradigm and it is not a VLD bullet, but it DOES have outstanding ballistics. I have personally found this bullet works better than the 140 VLD Berger, but that is only my personal subjective observation.

The 6.5 284 Norma is second only to the 300WM shooting huge bullets (with barrel life no better and with ballistics only slightly better) in F-Class and long range BR wins. Yes, the 7mm 180's are making a serious dent in that record now, but the 6.5 Norma is a proven performer.

I think the 264 Win Mag would make a great sheep hunting cartridge in a rifle that shoots a dozen rounds per year, but for target shooting, it is over the top.

No match barrel is going to perform its best after 1000 rounds regardless of caliber, (ok... maybe a 22 rimfire) and I never shoot in big matches with old barrels.

It takes more than a good bullet, it takes wind reading skill and practice, but at least with this combo, you know it can be made to be a top performer. 6.5-06 is almost unheard of in F-Class competition. It seems long and thin are not as well liked as shorter and fatter.

The 65 norma will feed fine from a long action mag, but will need to be single shot loaded in a short action using long bullets.
 
Ok if barrel wear with the 6.5x284 is such a huge issue then convince me of another similarly performing cartridge. Keep in mind I've already set my self up for 6.5mm with the barrel so keep it to that calibre.

As you said Jerry, the 6.5-06 is another option for me that I am open to, My uncle is planning on building one so I was thinking of doing something different so we can compare but having another 6.5-06 is still a possibility.

I have been doing some reading and 260AI is looking to be more and more compelling as well. Just to comfirm here, the 260AI is the same name for the 6.5mm-08 Ackley Improved correct? I see it being used back and forth in other sites

Here is what I want:

Well I want to be able to hunt with the cartridge up to 600yds

And I want to target shoot comfortably at 1000yds

And I want to be able to feed with a Short Action

I want my velocities to be 2800fps-3000fps

The 260AI is sounding better and better, I think my mind may have been changed
 
The 260AI or Mystic variant may not feed as smoothly as you want. Really depends on the mag and action used.

I have run them in my Savage and the new center feed mag. NO problem feeding but they don't stack so you only get 3 rds vs 4 like a standard cartridge.

Another excellent option would be the 6.5 Swede or improved version.

The 6.5-06 will wear just as quickly as a 6.5-284 as it has more case capacity. If you want speed, there is really no free lunch.

Although, there is much printed about short fat shooting better then long skinny, my rifles that I have built over the years don't seem to notice. At least at the 1/4 min level.

I have taken a palma barrel in 308, then 30-06, then 30 Gibbs. Accuracy remained the same, the bullet just went faster. This barrel shot 1" or under 5rds at 250yds regardless of the chamber.

If long skinny was so inaccurate, how come so many LR records are set by long skinny cartridges - 300WM being one and it even has a very short neck so a double negative.

Another 1000yds unlimited darling are wildcats based off the 300Wby. That is definitely long and skinny.

I feel it has more to do with an appropriate powder for the case volume and bullet configuration, then case shape. Today with so many 'tween powders, you can find something that will work.

Jerry
 
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