What is wrong with my savage

J

Jayph

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I have a savage model 12 FVSS in .223 Rem with the following problem.

In December I was on a coyote hunt after getting a new load zeroed and tested at longer ranges, I fired 20 rounds with out a problem. During the coyote hunt i had called two coyotes to within 15 steps (later walked off) I lined up on one and CLICK reloaded slowly CLICK stood up as they were now on the run and took a shot BOOM I told my hunting partner what happened and he looked at me like yeah right you blew it. Next stand were walking in and there is a coyote out in the open 200 yards away no wind perfect, get down on the sticks take hold CLICK. At this point Iam frustrated and sit down and pick a old mound of sand and line up with my friend watching. I tried to Fire 4 times. BOOM CLICK CLICK BOOM. My friend asked what the heck is wrong with that thing as now he had to believe my click story.

So off to the gunsmith (very reputable built many guns for guys on this forum) Gun fired everytime for him. Took the bolt apart, checked the sear, measured fireing pin protrusion. All in working order.

So it has worked fine since I got it back untill today. Sat down at the last stand after a deer ran into the side of my fathers new truck denting it :mad: I catch some movement to my left and watched the coyote walk infront of me and stop (later measured at 11 steps). Lined him up CLICK recock CLICK recock CLICK recock CLICK by the forth time even though I was as slow as I could be he figured it out. I lined up on a running shot straight away and BOOM it fires. Told my dad what happened and lined up on a hill about 50 yards away BOOM fired no problems.

I really wan't to like this savage as it shoots lights out but it almost went for a ride in the bush today.

If anybody has had this problem please let me know if you have fixed it and how.


Thanks.

Jason

I have only recovered one round that it did it on as most were recocked and shot at coyotes but it had no mark on the primer.
 
Tried different ammunition?
What do the misfired primers look like?
And as BrotherRockeye wondered, is cold a factor?
 
1 Could be grease from the cold.
2 Not getting finger centered on accu trigger
3 Trigger is too light and needs to be turned up
4 All of the above and not neccessarily in this order.
 
If it is only a cold weather thing, degrease your bolt and re-lube with something that wont gum up.

You may also have a sear engagement issue, and the sear is rubbing enough to slow the firing pin down enough to cause the pin to impact too slow for detonation.
 
tiriaq said:
Tried different ammunition?
What do the misfired primers look like?
And as BrotherRockeye wondered, is cold a factor?
Click to expand...

Yes it's fired many kinds of ammo factory and hand loads

I have only seen one primer as I keep recocking trying to get the coyote. There was no mark.

Today it was cold but the last time it happened it wasn't if I recall right.

Thanks
 
shotgunjoe said:
1 Could be grease from the cold.
2 Not getting finger centered on accu trigger
3 Trigger is too light and needs to be turned up
4 All of the above and not neccessarily in this order.
Click to expand...

The gunsmith re greased the bolt after taking it apart and used grease he has used for all his bolts and never had a problem.

After nothing was wrong last time the smith mentioned that. We assumed that must of been the problem. that was ruled out today two of the clicks I had were taken slowly with propper trigger controll. Also I took it off center on purpose and the grey piece locks out till you #### again. When it goes click the trigger is loose like the rifle fires.

Trigger is 3.3 lbs as set from the factory nothing has been touched.

I will double check thanks for your post.
 
220Swifty said:
If it is only a cold weather thing, degrease your bolt and re-lube with something that wont gum up.

You may also have a sear engagement issue, and the sear is rubbing enough to slow the firing pin down enough to cause the pin to impact too slow for detonation.
Click to expand...


This seems to be a common answer so I may just degrease and re-lube for piece of mind. Any suggestions from people for extreme cold?

I don't know much about that stuff, but it's what the gunsmith thought was the problem when I told him about it. Only when he checked it he said all was fine. Any way to check this at home?

Thanks for the post.
 
honkerhitter said:
factory ammo also mifired or just reloads? Primers seating depth? primers may have been damp/ high humidity while being stored. is this a new gun chamber dimenions.
Click to expand...

Only misfired on factory ammo. All ammo is stored propperly and less than a year old. It is a factory rifle. I will rule out primers as there wasn't a mark on the one I inspected. So it's not getting struck.

Thanks for your post.
 
Freeze Ups

Have had the same thing happen to me on a bolt gun and just recently my Ar-180b when coyote hunting.Only seems to happen on sub zero temperature days.My theory is you take the rifle out of a warm house and incase it and put it in your warm truck then you pull it out into frosty cold and the firing pin through frost or thickened lubricant freezes up or sticks.On the Ar-180b recently it fired the first cartridge but would not cycle to load the second and had to cycle it manually for a follow up shot and worked flawlessly on the rest of the shots after that.I would do what the rest of the guys have suggested in cleaning the bolt center and firing pin assembly with brake kleen then lubing lightly with CLP or REM Lube.Hope this helps and I would also cycle the action and dry fire it just before you get into your set up spot to call to help unjam any freeze ups when in the severe cold.--Thanks--Dieseldog!!:ar15:
 
dieseldog said:
Have had the same thing happen to me on a bolt gun and just recently my Ar-180b when coyote hunting.Only seems to happen on sub zero temperature days.My theory is you take the rifle out of a warm house and incase it and put it in your warm truck then you pull it out into frosty cold and the firing pin through frost or thickened lubricant freezes up or sticks.On the Ar-180b recently it fired the first cartridge but would not cycle to load the second and had to cycle it manually for a follow up shot and worked flawlessly on the rest of the shots after that.I would do what the rest of the guys have suggested in cleaning the bolt center and firing pin assembly with brake kleen then lubing lightly with CLP or REM Lube.Hope this helps and I would also cycle the action and dry fire it just before you get into your set up spot to call to help unjam any freeze ups when in the severe cold.--Thanks--Dieseldog!!:ar15:
Click to expand...

Thanks for the post.
 
Tumbleweed said:
Amen to that...and you might also have some crap inside the bolt left over from when they made it. Get right inside there and clean it out REAL good.
Click to expand...

The bolt was completely dissasembled by a smith and re-greased I will ask him what he used. If I had the ability I would try myself.

Thanks for the post.
 
Jayph said:
This seems to be a common answer so I may just degrease and re-lube for piece of mind. Any suggestions from people for extreme cold?

I don't know much about that stuff, but it's what the gunsmith thought was the problem when I told him about it. Only when he checked it he said all was fine. Any way to check this at home?

Thanks for the post.
Click to expand...

Ok manys guys wont like me but the #1 rule with cold is : dont use any grease or oil! Keep it dry! Always worked with all my guns bolt or semi-auto.
 
Is it possible that you're wearing thick gloves that push the trigger part of the accu trigger before the sear release part? I've done that on mine while wearing heavy gloves. Just try it at home, #### it and pull on the trigger ONLY not on the bladed part in the center of the trigger. Is this what its doing while hunting?
 
I'm going to blame your accutrigger. As you said in your first post, the primer on the misfires are un-marked. If it were cold grease, firing-pin protrusion, lack of clearance at the cocking button (technical term I just made up) the misfires would have some mark, even if too shallow.
On the savage you have stamped metal cocking indicator on the righthand side of the action. When you dry-fire it, the cocking indicator will drop all the way down, but if you just pull on the edge of the accutrigger without deploying the inner "safety" part it will only drop halfway down. Halfway down doesn't make it to the primer, which is actually what it's supposed to do when the trigger isn't used properly, or the gun is dropped.
I'll bet that on your misfires, that the cocking indicator only drops halfway, gun goes "click" and shooter goes"***#####!!!".
 
Chances are the accutrigger is catching the unwanted sear release. Remove the stock and play with it until it faults. Look at the trigger and determine if the accu-release lever is catching an unwanted sear release. Make sure the bolt handle is fully lowered, the 2nd base screw from the front can be too long. I wouldn't think the rifle would click if grease was the problem but cannot say for sure. For a hunting rifle, I prefer light oil or a FILM of graphite depending on the temp.
 
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