buck shot

I got your back Dutch. I use buckshot with great effectiveness. I have done the homework with patterning and determining point of impact vs point of aim on beaded shotgun barrels. I hunt ethically in limiting the range at which I shoot. I have followed your buckshot related posts and they make sense. You don't claim to kill deer at 80 yards with buckshot. You only claim that it works well for you (and me) under the conditions you place on it's use. If the other guys have had some problems with buckshot I can only say that maybe they used the load outside of its effective limits.

regards, Darryl
 
I have to say I am not a huge fan of the stuff myself but it can be hard to argue with results sometimes. My buddies daughter has taken a deer from her stand every year for 17 years straight and she shoots her father's A-5 with a 2 3/4" load of 00buck. Her ground blind is in an area affording her a maximu shot of 30 yards. To date her longest shot has been just that with all her shots except that 30 yarder at under 20 yards. Her father taught her how to shoot that gun with that load and absolutely "stressed" she wasn't to stretch the shot any further. She shoots a few boxes each year on paper to refamiliarize herself with his gun/shell combo and then off she goes. Most times she has her deer by the end of opening day and the furthest one ran on her after the shot was the 30 yard buck she took, he went two steps and collapsed. Personally as I said , not a huge fan of the stuff but I wouldn't hesitate to shoot it if it's all I had or in her case what I felt confident with.:)
 
I was really enjoying a deer chop (from a deer that I had taken with a slug) and all of a sudden, I bit down on something really hard! It shocked me because the piece I cut didn't have any bone in it. It was a piece of f**king 00 Buck that just about broke my tooth!

Quite apparently, this deer had previously been shot (at) but not killed with pellets.

Buckshot = buck shot, but not killed!

Slugs are for deer!!!

I'll never use anything other than slugs from a shotgun on deer :D:D:D mostly because I can see farther than 30yards - and if a deer comes within 100yds, it gets a slug. Slugs work at <30yds too - why limit yourself?
 
The only guys I know of around here that use buckshot, are the bush-pushers (or gangs).

Their motto is "if it's brown it's down"...and will shoot 100+ yards if they have to.

They are just hoping for a "hit" to slow it down for the next guy to get a better shot.

Buckshot is acceptable within 30-40 yards (max), IMHO.
 
nuncupata said:
FWIW... a couple of shooting buddies and myself shot buckshot at an old fridge at about 30 yards... It didn't go all the way through the fridge.
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that proves nothing about penetration on animals. steel, plastic and insulation are much different than flesh and bone. ive shot an old car and dryer with the 12 gauge for ####s and giggles with both lead and steel shot. lead #4 or #6 shot didnt penetrate neither target while the steel loads punched right through the sheet metal. weird considering lead pellets get more penetration on live targets than steel shot...

superd222 said:
Slugs work at <30yds too - why limit yourself?
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its called challenging yourself ;)

taking a deer ethically with buckshot is harder than with a slug due to range limitations. getting within bow (buckshot) range is much more difficult then getting close enough for a shot with a slug and many people enjoy that. with buckshot you MUST wait for a close shot while with a slug you dont have to wait for the deer to get close enough.

if i had to choose between the two id take buckshot because it forces you to get close to the deer. personally, hunting is all about getting as close as possible to the critter before letting them have it.
 
beefman said:
The only guys I know of around here that use buckshot, are the bush-pushers (or gangs).

Their motto is "if it's brown it's down"...and will shoot 100+ yards if they have to.

They are just hoping for a "hit" to slow it down for the next guy to get a better shot.

Buckshot is acceptable within 30-40 yards (max), IMHO.
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I know exactly what you are talking about. I enjoy buckshot fun in the fall disposing of old pumpkins but thats about all.
 
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beefman said:
The only guys I know of around here that use buckshot, are the bush-pushers (or gangs).

Their motto is "if it's brown it's down"...and will shoot 100+ yards if they have to.

They are just hoping for a "hit" to slow it down for the next guy to get a better shot.

Buckshot is acceptable within 30-40 yards (max), IMHO.
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and those are the type of guys who take hail mary shots and wonder why the deer didnt drop. if the deer survives then the next hunter will shoot the deer thats been wounded by buckshot and assume that buckshot is junk because the deer survived. so now we have the original guy and his group telling their buddies that buckshot sucks plus the hunter that eventually dropped the deer will likely tell his buddies that buckshot is crap too.

next thing you know theres 10 guys who have been convinced that buckshot sucks when it was really the hunters fault for taking a ridiculous shot and/or not patterning his gun.

notice a pattern here? the only time you hear bad things about buckshot is when people dont use it properly.

the same can be said for people who are against bow hunting. they see a deer walking around with an arrow sticking out of it or find a rotten deer with an arrow in it. they will assume bow hunting is not ethical because of this when it was really the hunters fault...
 
Buckshot is perfectly acceptable when used within range. The major issue is everyone seems to believe that it is capable of 100 yard kills and compensates for poor marksmanship. I've shot at 5 deer with buckshot and 4 of those ended up in the freezer. The first one was a miss (or very possibly a wounding shot) caused by me being young and inexperienced and taking too long a shot. I generally carry rifle or slug gun while deer hunting, but there are situations where a close range gun with an open patern is desireable. Those who claim that even OOB lacks the energy to kill deer must know something I don't. I took 2 wounded deer down this year at 15-20 yards shooting 2 3/4" 4Buck and neither ever knew what happened. 4buck has long been the choice load for my truck gun.
 
Pudelpointer said:
Now I know in a bear defense situation there are likely no sidewalks about, however, 9 (or more) lead balls may come out the far side of a bear at a variety of angles, no? I would much rather have ONE projectile to worry about, then 9 or 15, or 18.
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Man, I've been in a bear defense situation... they don't usually happen in crowded city streets. The last thing you worry about is where your misses go... 9, 15 or 18 projectiles? If I had an MLRS missile I would have fired it... When a grizzly is chasing you, you don't worry about exit angles, just exiting the situation... alive and uneaten.

Jeff
 
canadian hunter312 said:
its called challenging yourself ;)


if i had to choose between the two id take buckshot because it forces you to get close to the deer. personally, hunting is all about getting as close as possible to the critter before letting them have it.
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Based on this logic I think I will forgo firearms altogether and try to get my deer with a sleeper hold. If I can't achieve this then I will resort to ground and pound... If he overpowers me I guess I will use a sharp and pointy stick...

Seriously though, I have a lot of respect for you and your desire for a challenge but for me I want a deer. That's it. I want the meat and the hide and if they let me use a minigun I might give it a shot! If I was confident that I could take the buck at 400m I would do just that! I'll go with the slug (but only if they won't let me use a rifle)... I use the best steel axe I can afford even though a stone axe will cut wood too...

Jeff
 
rhshooter said:
Man, I've been in a bear defense situation... they don't usually happen in crowded city streets. The last thing you worry about is where your misses go... 9, 15 or 18 projectiles? If I had an MLRS missile I would have fired it... When a grizzly is chasing you, you don't worry about exit angles, just exiting the situation... alive and uneaten.

Jeff
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With respect, that depends where you are. A dangerous bear confrontation in town or in a crowded camp comes with all sorts of considerations and complications, and these situations are among the few instances where I believe shot is the proper tool on a large animal. The first rule in a dangerous bear situation is to keep your head and think. Your brain is your ultimate survial tool, and if you shift it to neutral, you're in trouble. If the grizzly is chasing you, you've made a mistake. I won't run from a bear, first because I can't shoot whats behind me and secondly because it won't do any good anyway . . . you just die tired.
 
Pudelpointer said:
And Boomer, your comment about safety when shooting around others in an emergency, I have to say I respectfully disagree. Any projectile heading in the general direction of a bystander (or bear chew toy) is bad news. I used to work for Brinks way back when, and we were issued both buck shot and slugs for the truck shotgun. Think about it, 9 round lead balls, bouncing and skipping down the sidewalk! Needless to say the buck shot always got left in the cup holder.

Now I know in a bear defense situation there are likely no sidewalks about, however, 9 (or more) lead balls may come out the far side of a bear at a variety of angles, no? I would much rather have ONE projectile to worry about, then 9 or 15, or 18.
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Well, change your perspective from shooter to bystander. We were driving to work one day when a fellow shot a bear off his front step, we were perhaps 25 yards away. He shot the bear in the face with a load of birdshot with the muzzle of the gun against the bear's head, we were not aware of any pellets exiting. Had he used a slug, we were in direct line of fire and would have been hit with what would have potentially been a lethal blow. Had his gun been loaded with buck we might also have been hit, but the pellets would have had little velocity after penetrating a foot of bear skull. This is the situation that made me a believer in shot for use populated areas.
 
I don't have much to add. I just want to get my post count up. Buck Shot is great, when used appropriately. The only deer I have shot was with buckshot. Dad has taken 3. None wounded.
 
I dunno for sure guys...I have never shot a deer with a shotgun...but I seen Les Jonson from predator quest absolutely HAMMER a coyote at 80 yards with his "escort shotgun, pattern master chokes tube and 00 buck".
I can't say how effective that shot would have been on a deer at 80 yards... but the coyote didn't even finish the step he was taking, and I sure as hell wouldn't have wanted to be on the receiving end of that blast!

Another video I watched, was showing that bird shot was the personal defense shot of choice, when shooting in ones own home. This was in order to prevent hitting neighbors or loved ones through a wall with a slug or buck. In the demo the built a simulated house with 3 walls standing 12 -14 feet apart, with 2x4 s and double sided with drywall, but not painted. he fired from 10 feet away from he first wall...The buck shot went through all 3 walls and the final exit wounds on the last wall were still only the size of a soft ball. The slug did what a slug does... and the bird shot made a surprising hole in the first 2 walls but did not exit the 3rd wall.

Proper equipment and patterning makes all the difference as far as I can see. Is a slug superior? You bet... but I think buck shot could be used out to all bow hunting ranges effectively and ethically on deer.
 
Boomer said:
Well, change your perspective from shooter to bystander. We were driving to work one day when a fellow shot a bear off his front step, we were perhaps 25 yards away. He shot the bear in the face with a load of birdshot with the muzzle of the gun against the bear's head, we were not aware of any pellets exiting. Had he used a slug, we were in direct line of fire and would have been hit with what would have potentially been a lethal blow. Had his gun been loaded with buck we might also have been hit, but the pellets would have had little velocity after penetrating a foot of bear skull. This is the situation that made me a believer in shot for use populated areas.
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Okay, I'll agree with that, and I have to say that point-blank shots would be safest with smaller shot. So what size are you carrying Boomer? 00, 000, #4 buck? I would think in camp, #4 buck might be the best compromise between penetration and pass-through.

How did this become a "bear-defence" thread? :redface:

Never did get an answer on how often buck-shot hunters hit guts....
 
If I'm not mistaken, Slugs are superior in the ricochet department as well.. Scenario: Deer walks out of bush, heads toward where you are standing on a fence row. SW Ontario farm country. Deer decides something isn't right, decides to cut across field rather than keep following fence row. This presents you with a broadside 50-60 yard shot. Heres the catch. Theres a barn 250-300yds behind deer. With buckshot I would think this would be considered a safe, ethical shot. With a slug, I don't think so. Those things seem to bounce across the field forever..

Now to play the devils advocate to my own scene above, why would you be out of the bush, blocking a fence row, with buckshot? Unlikely I guess...
 
If the law requires I use a shotgun I'll use a slug.

If I expect the critter that will be on the other side of the shotgun weighs over 100 lbs. or is more than 30 yards away I'll use a slug.

Little beasts at close range can be be taken with #4 buck.

For everything else there are Brennekes.
 
Pudelpointer said:
Okay, I'll agree with that, and I have to say that point-blank shots would be safest with smaller shot. So what size are you carrying Boomer? 00, 000, #4 buck? I would think in camp, #4 buck might be the best compromise between penetration and pass-through.

How did this become a "bear-defence" thread? :redface:

Never did get an answer on how often buck-shot hunters hit guts....
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While I have no objection to #4 when buck shot is required, I carry a few rounds of 3" 00 in the sidesaddle. It patterns well to 25 yards from my gun, and because I'm as likely to use the gun at short range against a dog or a rabid fox. Unless I'm at home or on the street, I wouldn't shoot a bear with shot. The magazine and rear half of the sidesaddle are loaded with 3" Brenneke slugs and I load the Speed Feed with 23/4" Challengers as the springs seem to object to a pair of 3" shells. Those slugs are what I rely on when I'm near town. With a full load of 17 rounds (chamber empty) I can be out for several days with this thing before I have to worry about my ammo supply.

Not sure how this became a bear defense thread, but I'm always quick to jump in when I see one going that way. Besides, there isn't a whitetail within 500 miles of this place.
 
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