No.5 MkI - input requested (update: post 25)

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mmatt

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I recently bought a "bargain" Jungle Carbine. It seems I got exactly what I paid for. :rolleyes: But whatever, I like working on guns and figured this would be a good project.

All the metal parts; receiver, bolt, mag, etc. are in good overall condition, the barrel is kinda dark but the rifling seems really sharp and the patches are starting to come out grey now instead of black so I figure there's hope for it yet. I have begun de-greasing and cleaning it up for a new coat of black paint.

The wood, on the other hand, is where I have encountered my first real problem; all three parts are totally mis-matched. :eek: I have sanded them all down to bare wood and while I don't know what kind of wood it is, one is rather red, one is very white and one is kind of a grey. I have tried experimenting with different stains to get them to at least come close to matching but it's just not going to happen.

As this gun has obviously been created using the parts of its probably "dead comrades", I'm sure it has little to no historic value left which is why I don't feel too bad about my decision to paint the wood. :redface: I know, I know... you'll have me tarred and feathered by the end of the night, but I really have little other choice.

My question to you is, what colour should I go with? I could go with a dark tan so that it looks like it still has its original wood from 20 feet away, I could go with a light tan as a sort of "homage" to the current war in the desert, or I could give it a kinda modern look with either flat black or olive drab. Bear in mind that all the metal parts will be black. Waddya think?


And now the question. I'm sure I could spend hours looking around online for this info, but since I have your attention anyway... :p

What are some things I can do to "accurize" it? Currently it shoots about 7 MOA. :confused: The barrel is completely free-floated which I think is part of the problem. I think I read somewhere that these rifles like a pressure point midway down the barrel. Is this right? What else can I do?

Sorry for such a long post and thanks if you've read this far. :)
 
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... Well. I'd definitely recommend holding off on Painting. It's perhaps a desperate suggestion, but try running all the "wood" through a dishwasher, then a light sand and THEN if necessary a touch of stain. The wood /Furniture is most unlikely to be numbered to the rifle, and sometimes it just doesn't all match as to color anyway. As to the bedding, grouping, it's worth trying a bit of "shimming" to create upward pressure on the barrel at the tip of the for-end. ( Gasket material works for me ) just try it loosy placed, and if effective, then it can be glued in place. ..... David K
 
I don't know if its recommended to "accurize" a No.5. They are notoriously innacurate, for reasons unprovable. Some say its the milling on the receiver to lighten It up, some say barrel configuration, who knows. I have one, all original, and the only baddies It would have shot where obese ones at 10 yards, cause I can't put more than 2 rnds on paper at 20 yards if my life depended on it. Its still fun to shoot though.
 
mmatt said:
...
As this gun has obviously been created using the parts of its probably "dead comrades", I'm sure it has little to no historic value left...
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A service rifle from a big war, refitted with parts recovered from other rifles, sounds rather historically authentic to me.
 
Rutger said:
I don't know if its recommended to "accurize" a No.5. They are notoriously innacurate, for reasons unprovable. Some say its the milling on the receiver to lighten It up, some say barrel configuration, who knows. I have one, all original, and the only baddies It would have shot where obese ones at 10 yards, cause I can't put more than 2 rnds on paper at 20 yards if my life depended on it. Its still fun to shoot though.
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I had a couple of Jungle Carbines that shot very well. They're not all bad. If it can't hit anything at 20 yards, the barrel must be pooched.

As for the OP...wouldn't recommend the paint thing. Try some different stains. I came up with some alcohol based stain, I think it was from a shoe store, it did penetrate.
 
Rutger, I once bought a Remington 788 that was as accurate as your No.5, but it turned out to need a cheap and easy fix: If you haven't tried cleaning yours for copper fouling, I suggest a bottle of Barnes CR10 and the time it takes might get you a worthwhile result and is not a lot to lose. Good luck.
 
mmatt said:
I have begun de-greasing and cleaning it up for a new coat of black paint.

The wood, on the other hand, is where I have encountered my first real problem; all three parts are totally mis-matched. :eek: I have sanded them all down to bare wood and while I don't know what kind of wood it is, one is rather red, one is very white and one is kind of a grey.

As this gun has obviously been created using the parts of its probably "dead comrades", I'm sure it has little to no historic value left which is why I don't feel too bad about my decision to paint the wood. :redface: I know, I know... you'll have me tarred and feathered by the end of the night, but I really have little other choice.
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Hey Matt,

I'm not going to suggest tar and feather, but one little, humble tip - and that's one I've been given by others when I myself had an approach similar to the one you've described: Ask questions first, then work on the gun.

See, there may have been some historical aspect left in the gun before you started work on it. Maybe not much, maybe none; but maybe some. So by asking questions before, you would have had many opinions, advices, and some of them may have stopped you from sanding the stock, for example.

There are always options, some better than others ;)

Lou
 
I have one that came with a glass bedded forestock.
Shoots dead-nuts on , out of a cold barrel . But if it's heated up , the groups expand substancialy.
I wonder if the MkVll round is abit to hot for the No5 ?
...I really need to learn how to reload...
 
cantom said:
As for the OP...wouldn't recommend the paint thing. Try some different stains. I came up with some alcohol based stain, I think it was from a shoe store, it did penetrate.
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I second this. If you're looking for alcohol based stain, Feiblings Leather Dye worked for me. I just recently matched some handguards to an origional stock and it worked miracles.
 
Don't paint! Don't sand! Stain and don't sweat little differences. Some rifles with stamped, matching wood have colour differences. As for accuracy, I have two that shoot great, don't assume what some say about the no5 to be the gospel truth. Every rifle is different, don't judge yours by someone else's experience with a different rifle. If I had a mauser that shot crappy would I post that mausers are all in-accurate? Ahh... no... From what I've heard, a lot of the stories of "wandering zero" on these rifles was fabricated to push military minds to replace the Lee Enfield once and for all. Some felt that the no. 5 would extend the service life of this design, and wanted to move on to a semi-auto replacement. Lo and behold, they got their wish. Plus, the recoil wouldn't have made it popular to anyone firing more than a few rounds at a time!;)
 
Years ago, when they could be picked up 'very' reasonably, I had two with very light coloured wood and eventually sold both. Recently I got the opportunity to pick up a pair that belonged to a shooting buddy. One of which is near mint with sling and I also acquired a bayonet for it.

MyJCwithbayonet.jpg


On the second, the woodwork was on the rough side so I thought I'd use it as a parts source but thought I'd clean it up first. I also have the original butt stock but it came with one from Bishup I believe. It's not 'mint' by any means but it did clean up farily nicely so I put a scope on it and have used it for some load testing. What I used on the wood after the clean up was a Miniwax Wood finish stain, Red Oak and then, as recommended, a fast drying polyurethane.

SmokeyBobJC303Br.jpg


Initial accuracy with both isn't too bad.

303BrJCBG.jpg
 
Speaking of accuracy, I have a JC that had been FTR in India or Pakistan (Ishy screw in wood, markings scrubbed) and with a decent bore.

It shot so so with 185 gr lead bullets sized to .311, but became amazingly accurate with unsized, .313 bullets. Four of five bullets made one hole at 50 yards, with the "flier" very close below the rest. I wouldn't discount the accuracy of one of these rifles from a couple groups with one sort of ammo.
 
So I'll try some different ammo and I'll hold of on the paint for now... but I really want the wood to match as close as possible and not be too dark. I suppose I'm asking for too much though, eh?
 
Here are some pics of the wood. You can see just how different they are. The top of the fore stock is close... but the rear stock is way lighter in colour. It's gonna be a huge challenge to get it even close methinks.

13329_388308665198_509315198_5393796_4780382_n.jpg


13329_388308700198_509315198_5393797_1636535_n.jpg
 
MMATT. You have a No4 butt and a very light one at that.....you should look at getting a No5 walnut butt. With some aniline dye and BLO you can get the pices very close to a common colour. Ron
 
NiceRice858 said:
John, was that group shot open shoulder or in a vice?
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I have a selection of bean bags that I use for a rest load testing. My Daughter and her Mother In Law made up a big batch of them and gave me some.

Our F&G club has a fairly informal range complex. As the 100yrd & 200yrd ranges were having some work done on them, I shot that target on our handgun range which is just a touch over 85yds. The bullets I was using were 174gr FMJ's that were pulled from military ammo and I got them from a guy in the B.C. interior. In addition to the FMJ's I have since picked up some;
  • Cast bullets, 188gr GC & 225gr GC
  • Hornady 174gr RN
  • Sierra 180gr Spitzer
  • Woodleigh 215gr RN SN
I've picked up a few other toys I'm presently playing with but as soon as I get back to the Jungle Carbines, I want to try out the 215gr.
 
rgg_7 said:
MMATT. You have a No4 butt and a very light one at that.....you should look at getting a No5 walnut butt. With some aniline dye and BLO you can get the pices very close to a common colour. Ron
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Yeah well, the one I have fits me very nicely and is very comfortable to shoot as it does not have that crappy "recoil pad". :rolleyes: Besides, being currently unemployed makes it quite difficult to buy all the "toys" I'd like to have; in fact I'm quite lucky to have what I do. :redface:

I'll keep my eye out for a walnut butt stock though... perhaps I'll get lucky and fine one that matches.
 
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