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- Thread starter The Hackmaster
- Start date
I'll 'shoot'
ENGLAND is an early export marking. The tab in the wood to the left of the safety would indicate replacement Indian wood.
Lots of proof marks in pic 2, the BNP is for nitro proof. The '27 is when it was re-barreled. The combined ED in 'ED 31' is 'Enfield' and GR is for George Rex.
Q 41 looks like a scrubbed serial number. What does the CFC registration slip say?
GR ENFIELD 1911 (13?) shows that the rifle was built by Enfield in 1911. Which means that it should have been a MK. III and the two horizontal strikeouts are odd. They indicate the removal of a mark and the only mark that might be so removed is a star indicating the absence of a magazine cut-off. Does your rifle have a slot on the right side of the receiver for a magazine cutoff?
ENGLAND is an early export marking. The tab in the wood to the left of the safety would indicate replacement Indian wood.
Lots of proof marks in pic 2, the BNP is for nitro proof. The '27 is when it was re-barreled. The combined ED in 'ED 31' is 'Enfield' and GR is for George Rex.
Q 41 looks like a scrubbed serial number. What does the CFC registration slip say?
GR ENFIELD 1911 (13?) shows that the rifle was built by Enfield in 1911. Which means that it should have been a MK. III and the two horizontal strikeouts are odd. They indicate the removal of a mark and the only mark that might be so removed is a star indicating the absence of a magazine cut-off. Does your rifle have a slot on the right side of the receiver for a magazine cutoff?
Serial number is 41a and it is Enfield built, meaning that original proofs would have been through the London Proof House.
The BNP stamps are Birmingham Nitro Proof, put on in 1927, when the new barrel was installed. They worked over a LOT of WW1 rifles in the '20s, then scrapped a whole bunch right through to about '37 or '38 because it was well known that just as long as WE trashed our War Reserve rifles, that nice Mister Hitler would be happy to do likewise. NOT!
The strikeout marks I do NOT understand on this rifle. Wish we had a full photo of the action.
ENGLAND stamp was applied when the rifle was surplussed, after War Two.
.303" is the bore diameter, 2.222" is the maximum case length it was chambered for, 18.5 TONS followed by the little square and the two dots means 18.5 British Imperial Long Tons per square inch = 41,440 pounds per square inch, the WORKING pressure of Service ammunition. Proof loads were, of course, an overload and developed much higher pressure, but the rifles were marked with the SERVICE pressure of what they were SUPPOSED to be used with.
Stamps of E or ED with a crown above and a number below or beside are Enfield INSPECTORS' stamps. Somewhere, once upon a time, there was a list of who the Inspectors were and which Inspector used which stamp during which years. Likely, it was trashed when the old LE series went out of production in the 1950s. So much knowledge lost.
A real historical piece..... one that I would not mind owning at all.
Congratulations on your prize!
The BNP stamps are Birmingham Nitro Proof, put on in 1927, when the new barrel was installed. They worked over a LOT of WW1 rifles in the '20s, then scrapped a whole bunch right through to about '37 or '38 because it was well known that just as long as WE trashed our War Reserve rifles, that nice Mister Hitler would be happy to do likewise. NOT!
The strikeout marks I do NOT understand on this rifle. Wish we had a full photo of the action.
ENGLAND stamp was applied when the rifle was surplussed, after War Two.
.303" is the bore diameter, 2.222" is the maximum case length it was chambered for, 18.5 TONS followed by the little square and the two dots means 18.5 British Imperial Long Tons per square inch = 41,440 pounds per square inch, the WORKING pressure of Service ammunition. Proof loads were, of course, an overload and developed much higher pressure, but the rifles were marked with the SERVICE pressure of what they were SUPPOSED to be used with.
Stamps of E or ED with a crown above and a number below or beside are Enfield INSPECTORS' stamps. Somewhere, once upon a time, there was a list of who the Inspectors were and which Inspector used which stamp during which years. Likely, it was trashed when the old LE series went out of production in the 1950s. So much knowledge lost.
A real historical piece..... one that I would not mind owning at all.
Congratulations on your prize!
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If I had to guess I'd say it's a 1916 rifle, rebarreled at Enfield in 1927. The D31 mark is seen on early 30s Enfield production as I recall.
The * was barred out because it was probably produced when the changeover from MkIII to MkIII* (no magazine cutoff) was coming in as wartime economy and utility measure. The cutoff was a just a nuisance to soldiers in the trenches anyway.
Later after WWI, because the slot and screwhole were there, they converted it back to MkIII with the mag cutoff and barred out the asterisk.
Why? Because after a war it is a British tradition to revert to the way they were doing things before the war.
The * was barred out because it was probably produced when the changeover from MkIII to MkIII* (no magazine cutoff) was coming in as wartime economy and utility measure. The cutoff was a just a nuisance to soldiers in the trenches anyway.
Later after WWI, because the slot and screwhole were there, they converted it back to MkIII with the mag cutoff and barred out the asterisk.
Why? Because after a war it is a British tradition to revert to the way they were doing things before the war.
"...looks like DP on the barrel..." Indicates 'Drill Purpose'. Rifles were DP'd for many reasons. Not always as unsafe to shoot though. Definitely have it checked out.
The Birmingham Nitro Proof marks are about the Brit laws for exported milsurp rifles. Had to be proofed before they could be sold.
Other markings and such are here. http://www.enfieldrifles.ca/main.htm
The Birmingham Nitro Proof marks are about the Brit laws for exported milsurp rifles. Had to be proofed before they could be sold.
Other markings and such are here. http://www.enfieldrifles.ca/main.htm
Under British Proof Laws, EVERY firearm must be Proved and MARKED as such, and that includes the ones for the British Army.
MOST countries provide for Proofing of all firearms, but they exclude firearms for their own military use from being marked. Britain has ALWAYS stamped ALL their firearms. Any Snider or Bess can confirm this, so don't take my word for it.
The FIRST set of Proof marks were applied the day the rifle was made. If it needed to be re-proofed, as for installation of a new barrel, then it was proofed.... and marked... again.
MOST countries provide for Proofing of all firearms, but they exclude firearms for their own military use from being marked. Britain has ALWAYS stamped ALL their firearms. Any Snider or Bess can confirm this, so don't take my word for it.
The FIRST set of Proof marks were applied the day the rifle was made. If it needed to be re-proofed, as for installation of a new barrel, then it was proofed.... and marked... again.
Hi Hackmaster,
Try looking up this book:
THE BROAD ARROW
BRITISH and EMPIRE
It includes: factory, production, proof, inspection, armourers, unit and issue markings. It's everything you will ever need to know about markings for your Enfield.
It sells for $29.99 USD plus P & P.
You can also try this website: www.skennerton.com
I just got this info from another CGNer in a different thread. It might be worth the look.
I'll be checking it out.
You could also try one other book from Ian Skennerton, "The Lee-Enfield Story". I've got one out on loan from the Canadian War Museum in Ottawa via my local library. It was very much worth the read. It includes some of the info (stampings) that you are searching for.
I even went to the extent of photocoping most of the book for a reference source.
I hope this helps you out. Best of luck.
Welcome to the Enfield club.
Rgs...kajn65
Try looking up this book:
THE BROAD ARROW
BRITISH and EMPIRE
It includes: factory, production, proof, inspection, armourers, unit and issue markings. It's everything you will ever need to know about markings for your Enfield.
It sells for $29.99 USD plus P & P.
You can also try this website: www.skennerton.com
I just got this info from another CGNer in a different thread. It might be worth the look.
I'll be checking it out.
You could also try one other book from Ian Skennerton, "The Lee-Enfield Story". I've got one out on loan from the Canadian War Museum in Ottawa via my local library. It was very much worth the read. It includes some of the info (stampings) that you are searching for.
I even went to the extent of photocoping most of the book for a reference source.
I hope this helps you out. Best of luck.
Welcome to the Enfield club.
Rgs...kajn65
Correct me if I'm wrong, but the "DP" looks to be stamped on the nose cap?
Barrels that I have seen DP-maked had the mark on the knox. Now, there is something on the knox, but from the angle, I can't see what it is. Doesn't look like DP though.
Lou
Barrels that I have seen DP-maked had the mark on the knox. Now, there is something on the knox, but from the angle, I can't see what it is. Doesn't look like DP though.
Lou
- Location
- Tucson, Arizona
I am assuming it has a magazine cutoff. Normaly the rifles without cutoffs would have a * after the III. After WW1 some rifles had the cut off installed and the * barred out.
If the cut off was removed later in its service life, of course the barred markings would still be there.
Just another add. it the rifle spent time in India and was refurbed there, the Indians NEVER threw any serviceable parts away, so the nosecap could have come from the parts bin. DP is usualy stamped on the reciever.
If the cut off was removed later in its service life, of course the barred markings would still be there.
Just another add. it the rifle spent time in India and was refurbed there, the Indians NEVER threw any serviceable parts away, so the nosecap could have come from the parts bin. DP is usualy stamped on the reciever.
- Location
- WMU248 near Edmonton
I'll have to agree. Originaly manufacutred in 191? as a MkIII* and was converted to MkIII spec at some time and the * struck out. Rebarreled in 1927 so that would be my guess for when it was converted one way or the other, but I don't remember if they were making the MkIII or had abandoned that spec by 1927. I think that 1927 would have been too late for the conversion to MkIII and really suspect that it was done post war 1919 or 1920 and was converted back again to MkIII* in 1927
i have a mk111 with dp on the underside of the bayo lug would like to know what this meanes as well, the wood is really dark on this rifle dosent appear to have any kind off wood grain not a wood that i am familiar with almost looks like ceader it also as a huge no 14 stamped over the serial number anyone know what this could mean
