I am somewhat familiar with 44 Magnum handguns and their performance, but not 44 Mag. long guns. I hear 44 Mag. out of a rifle, performs differently. Would a 44 Mag. out of a rifle be adequate for moose and black bear under 100 meter?
Is 44 Magnum (rifle) adequate for moose?
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Johnn Peterson
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Chemainus B.C.
Within the range limitations you've stated and of course with proper shot placement, yes
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BigUglyMan
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- New Scotland
Perfectly adequate so long as you use good bullets. My preference would be cast bullets.
There is some confusion over loads for the 44 mag, between revolver and rifle. Even the Hodgdon loading charts on the web show the 44 mag divided between rifle and pistol.
However, the charge of powder is the same for both, only the rifle charts show from 200 to 300 fps faster with the rifle. The maximum pressure allowed for each, rifle or pistol, is in the 38,000 to 40,ooo range. But the rifle, with all that extra muzzle velocity, would certainly be more effective on a moose than would the pistol. And has been pointed out, the 44 mag revolver has killed plenty of moose.
However, the charge of powder is the same for both, only the rifle charts show from 200 to 300 fps faster with the rifle. The maximum pressure allowed for each, rifle or pistol, is in the 38,000 to 40,ooo range. But the rifle, with all that extra muzzle velocity, would certainly be more effective on a moose than would the pistol. And has been pointed out, the 44 mag revolver has killed plenty of moose.
You actually get into the realm of diminishing returns past (around) 16" of barrel. I've got 16" 20" and 24" .44 rifles and have been playing with a lot of powder/bullet combos because, like you've probably found out, there's not a whole lot of non speculative talk on this issue to be found online. I've gotten excellent accuracy out of 24" barrel, but that said, I've seen almost as good out of my 16". As for power, something, and I don't know the chemistry/physics of what exactly, changes around the 10" mark and you have to begin using different powders and different bullets perform better also. Whatever the pressure effect is it will drive a .44 out to 2000fps with no problem at all. Most data published will say between 1600-1700 but I'm telling you from my own experience that a 240-255grn bullet will exceed 2000fps with NO pressure signs and no wear on the gun with 1K+ rounds down range.
If you go down this road, don't trust any data thats not your own. Check every case for pressure signs every time. I haven't seen anything odd yet ( and I'm getting 8+ reloads per Rem Mag case ) but that doesn't mean it won't/can't happen.
Remember that the Lab boys that the big companies hire are good at their jobs, but part of their job is to cover the companies A$$ in case someone does something dumb with said companies product. I for one would rather have them erring on the side of caution, I likely would've blown myself up in my early reloading days without the "idiot" proofing.
Mike
If you go down this road, don't trust any data thats not your own. Check every case for pressure signs every time. I haven't seen anything odd yet ( and I'm getting 8+ reloads per Rem Mag case ) but that doesn't mean it won't/can't happen.
Remember that the Lab boys that the big companies hire are good at their jobs, but part of their job is to cover the companies A$$ in case someone does something dumb with said companies product. I for one would rather have them erring on the side of caution, I likely would've blown myself up in my early reloading days without the "idiot" proofing.
Mike
Johnn Peterson
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Chemainus B.C.
A number of years ago an uncle was parting with some of his firearms and he asked me, being the only other gun nut in the family, if there was anything I was interested in. My choice was an old and a little rough Marlin 94 in 44-40. My choice puzzled him until I explained his son & I used to sneek it out when he and my Dad were Moose hunting further up from the cabin on the Bowron Lake chain. The first centerfire I ever shot.
I've ended up with the rifle and two old boxes of Dominion/C.I.L. ammo plus a handful of old black powder cartridges. He told me that during the years he had and used it he had put down two Moose and a number of Black Bear without difficulty.
If the 44-40 could do that, the 44 Mag with its increased power should also be able to. I haven't shot a Moose with the 44 Mag and although it wouldn't be my 1st choice, under the right set of circumstances I wouldn't hesitate to do so. Black Bear, two down, the last of which had just finished ripping the windows out of a borrowed canopy. He only moved about five feet after trying to swallow a pair of hard cast 250gr Keith SW's,
with his ass. On those less than perfect shots, both rounds penetrated end for end. 
stickhunter
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- Victoria, B.C.
Johnn you own many bad a$$ rifles!
I concur! I get envious everytime I see pictures of his rifles. Johnn, that's a great story about a great rifle. I don't have the family history to back up my rifles, but I've been fortunate to find a couple of old Marlins that I'll be passing down one day... here's my favourite, a Marlin 1889 in 44-40 that was shipped in 1891 --- bore is like new and it shoulders better than any other rifle I own.
And this is its not-so-nice sister, with a half-octagon barrel and 2x4 buttstock (it's cleaned up much nicer than the picture would suggest and I have a new replacement buttstock to install):
Johnn Peterson
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Chemainus B.C.
Johnn you own many bad a$$ rifles!
So what bullet works best for Moose in said 44 mag?
I would think heavier would be better?
X-fan, stickhunter, thanks guys
, I love toys however as I've mentioned previously, I'm not a collector other than acquiring firearms I want to shoot. No 'safe Queens', if it no longer gets used it's history.As to what bullet would be my choice, that would depend on the firearm used. At one time I just about purchased a 44 Mag in a copy of a 92 Winchester from a shooting buddy until he reminded me it couldn't cycle a loaded unfired round using a longer heavier bullet. I believe the same also holds true for a Marlin in 44 Mag, the governing factor being the size of the ejection port. A Winchester 94 or possibly a Trapper model, shouldn't be a problem.
So, bullet wise, I'd likely go with what I used on the Black Bear, 'Uncle Elmers' #429421. I guess in firearms where the ejection port is a restricting factor to the C.O.A.L. using this bullet, you could seat it deeper and crimp over the forward driving band but that doesn't really turn my crank.
Johnn Peterson
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Chemainus B.C.
That is one of the the most beautiful firearms I have ever seen. It may sound sappy, but I'll bet it could tell some stories...
Cheers, Will
Yes, it probably could but regrettably that's where I dropped the ball
. As he & I were the only gun nuts in the family, I did ask why he was selling his treasures off. His reply, "well, the time has come" and I never put two & two together. Shortly thereafter he seccumbed to the big 'C'.
- Location
- The Conservative part of Ontario
I figure anything you can take with the 30-30 can also be taken with the 44 Mag.
As I've taken moose with the 30-30, the 44 mag fits.
Shot placement is key to it's effectiveness, as is range. Get lots of practice. Of course 'buck fever' changes everything, you need to be a cool shot.
As I've taken moose with the 30-30, the 44 mag fits.
Shot placement is key to it's effectiveness, as is range. Get lots of practice. Of course 'buck fever' changes everything, you need to be a cool shot.
Yes, but what if the moose breaks cover 200 yards away. Why handicap yourself when it's not necessary? Thr .22lr hes upended a few moose as well but it's not a moose gun either.
then you just calm down, follow, and STALK CLOSER- i used to do horseback in some pretty dense cover as well as wide open meadows- chances are he hasn't gone all that far- it's not unusual to see the SAME animal 3-4 times in the same day- even with whitetail bucks and those vanishing elk- if he presents at daybreak, you may very well get another chance at nightfall or the next day at the same time- at least it isn't where i live- this applies esp if you're after a trophy amd "marginal" or smaller animals are in the area- if you reject that animal, chances are you'll see him at least once again that day
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The 44 Mag is plenty adequate. I would recommend either a cast bullet, or a JSP like the Hornady 265 grain. I was surprised when my 30-06 would not penetrate a poplar tree but my Marlin 1894 rifle in 44 mag did it every time with the 265 JSP. The 44 Mag bullet travels a bit slower than the 30-06 or other modern Moose cartridges, but its diameter and bullet weight are a force to be reckoned with. A 265 grain bullet properly handloaded will be fine at 200 yards. You just need to familiarize yourself with the trajectory at all points in between. I'd recommend sighting in for 100 to 150 yards, and adjusting accordingly for shorter range or longer range shots.
I think the penetration of trees has more to do with the .30/06's high velocity than a .44 magnum's penetrating power. The higher velocity bullet more or less disintegrates when it strikes a tree squarely. Penetration on game is a function of moderate velocity, high sectional density(bullets that are long for calibre) and bullet construction. The .30/06 with a well desgned 180-200 grain bullet will wade more meat than any .44 magnum load.t-star, the conditions are much different here. We get three days to get a moose and if you miss an opportunity with all the hunting pressure and the moose usually in full rut you may never see that moose again or any other ones either. Just my opinion from my experiences.
