sound suppressors on non-firearm airguns legal ?

A

AManWithAGun

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Hi,

I thought this issue would have been discussed here, but I couldn't find any post on it.

So, are silencers/sound suppressors (especially home-built ones :) ) on non-firearm airguns legal in Canada ? By "non-firearm airguns" I mean low-powered airguns that are not classified as firearms under Firearms Act.

Thanks.
 
sound supressor for non-firearm pellet guns?

I'm wondering just how much sound there is to supress on a pellet gun that propells pellets at less than 500 fps. I'm very familiar with the Feinwerkbau 65, 80 and 90, as well as the 300s, and while these guns are rated as firearms, there is no appreciable sound to supress (ie the are very quiet in firing). To get noise to supress you need supersonic air leaving the barrel. I've fired BB caps in my .22 rifle, and all I hear is the click of the trigger releasing the firing pin. A long enough barrel would allow the gas to expand to a point where its exit from the barrel is sub-sonic.
 
A suppressor, of any kind, is illegal all by itself. Especially home-built ones. Why you'd think an air rifle would need one is another thing.
 
sunray said:
A suppressor, of any kind, is illegal all by itself. Especially home-built ones. Why you'd think an air rifle would need one is another thing.
Click to expand...

my 177 was loud back in the day, which i admit before knowing the laws or of age to own a gun, a bic pen tube, a few holes drilled in it and a toilet paper tube with cotten inbetween make it sound more like a sssst almost as loud as flicking your computer mouse pad was perfect for shootin pigions in the barn without scareing the others. so we got them all without them scattering. they didnt #### on the lime or cattle feed after that for a few months.

when i learned about firearms and the laws I found out that was illegal and i tossed it in the firepit. besides a 12 gauge with 6 in the tube did a better job on clearing the pests out.
 
sunray said:
Why you'd think an air rifle would need one is another thing.
Click to expand...

I'd have one if they were allowed here. I shoot indoors almost every day and sometimes have to stop because I'm disturbing my gf reading in the next room. Even a sub 500 fps .177 caliber rifle will make a fairly loud snap! Airguns in the UK are commonly made and sold with integral silencers and considering how cheap they are, why not?

Consideration of others, and a reducing environmental noise pollution are great reasons for legalizing silencers IMHO.
 
At some point, this question is going to create some "interesting times".

I saw a seller at the Calgary gun show selling Gamo (IIRC) pellet rifles with integral moderators built into them. They seemed to be selling well.

Eventually, we may get to a point where the use of a moderator or silencer is not considered akin to being a baby killer, but we ain't there yet.

Cheers
Trev
 
They can really help lower the noise level of a pellet gun shot indoors. Very helpful if you don't want to disturb neighbours in an apartment. Why they should be illegal for use on a sub 500fps pellet gun is beyond me. Esp if it is made so as not be withstand use with a firearm. It should be considered a non-functioning replica if its made entirely of light plastic and flammable bafflings.
 
Making supressors illegal makes about as much sense as doing the same with mufflers on cars...........................................Harold PS silencers arn't silent only on TV
 
mbogo3 said:
Making supressors illegal makes about as much sense as doing the same with mufflers on cars...........................................Harold PS silencers arn't silent only on TV
Click to expand...

You have a very good point.
An airgun under "500 fps" is not considered a firearm in the eyes of the law. So to me, that means an exhaust pipe (which acts a lot like a barrel of a gun without the projectile, example: blank firing gun) is classified the same as that airgun. Does this mean that all of us driving a vehicle with a muffler on the exhaust pipe, are breaking the law? Or is it because the airgun is still considered a firearm, even though the law says it isn't? Maybe the word GUN has something to do with it? I wish it was a lot more black and white, but we know it never will be.
 
Crosman Marauder has a shrouded barrel and can not be brought into canada, sigh... under a grand, PCP, multi shot and quiet
 
my

sunray said:
A suppressor, of any kind, is illegal all by itself. Especially home-built ones. Why you'd think an air rifle would need one is another thing.
Click to expand...

My Airforce Condor is very loud. Probably louder than a .22lr.

Most high power PCPs are quite loud.

Gas Can
 
A little of a segue re: suppressors. I wrote to the Minister of Public Safety to ask why firearm sound suppressors were illegal in Canada, while being legal in other jurisdictions including the UK & USA to name but two. In many countries, reducing the sonic signature of a firearm is considered to be beneficial to both shooters and the general public, particularly those resident near ranges.
The Minister forwarded my query to the RCMP, which assigned a firearms expert to reply:
"Let me identify myself and my job function to you. I hold the job
position of Senior Firearms Technologist, technical authority in the
subject area of assigning the applicable legal class to all firearms
found on the Firearms Reference Table. I work in the Specialized
Firearms Support Services Section which is a component of the Firearms
Investigative and Enforcement Services Directorate, RCMP Canadian
Firearms Program.

Question Your specific question would appear to be: - Could you
please reply explaining why firearm sound suppressors are prohibited
devices in Canada?

Answer Canadian Legislation as contained in the Criminal Code of
Canada and the Regulations appended thereto is the law of the land. The
Criminal Code of Canada PART III, Section 84 (definition) “prohibited
device” means,
a) not relevant to discussion
b) not relevant to discussion
c) any device or contrivance designed or intended to muffle or stop
the sound or report of a firearm.

The simple reply is that the silencer or sound moderator has been
legislated to be a “prohibited device”.

1. Canadian law makers (Parliament) in a democratic process, passed
law on this subject which is recorded in the Criminal Code of Canada -
Any device or contrivance designed or intended to muffle or stop the
sound or report of a firearm is a “prohibited device” - and
controlled for reasons of “Public Safety”.

2. Every Canadian Citizen has a democratic method of identifying
concerns with Legislation. You may appeal to your local Member of
Parliament or any Member of Parliament, identify your concerns and ask
this Hon Member to assist you by passing your concerns to the applicable
Minister of the Crown. I strongly recommend that you present a reasoned,
rational discussion when you identify your concerns to the Minister, as
the statement “I don’t like or disagree with the law” will have
little traction in a rational discussion involving a “prohibited
device” such as a silencer and public safety.

RCMP Members or employees of the Canadian Firearms Program are unable
to affect changes to Canadian Legislation on your behalf."

I replied indicating that I already knew they were prohibited, the question is why are they so?

His response:
"I have no idea what the rationale was behind the legislation as this
has been on the "books" since (I believe ) 1934. It could have been
anything. I know only that silencers are prohibited and it is far
beyond my purview to explain why or how it got to be that way."

I wonder sometimes...
Apparently a well-informed member of the RCMP, who has considerable impact on what is and is not legal, is unable to provide justification other than to resort to tautological argument- It's illegal therefore it's illegal.
 
sunray said:
A suppressor, of any kind, is illegal all by itself. Especially home-built ones. Why you'd think an air rifle would need one is another thing.
Click to expand...

airsoft suppressors aren't, I know people who have ordered them from over seas and the CBSA opened the package and still let it through. Some are only for show and others actually due reduce the sound (these are generally foam filled).
 
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