IDPA Ont Provincial - Aug 14th @ Windsor

[masterjack792]

Still, the magazine is empty. No need to retain it unless dictated by the course of fire and directed by the RO.

Magazine retention had nothing to do with whether the gun is loaded, empty, or at slide lock.

The empty mag must be retained if there is still a round in the chamber. page 41

 

[easy]

The empty mag must be retained if there is still a round in the chamber. page 41

If there are rounds left in the magazine, it's obviously not empty.

Weren't you talking about an empty gun when you said the following?

I think the point Steve was getting at was if you do a reload when the gun is not completely empty, the mag must be retained.

Again, I said an empty magazines need NOT be retained unless dictated by the CofF. It doesn't matter if there's a round left in the chamber.

Communication is everything and grammar does count.

 

[Steve David]

If there are rounds left in the magazine, it's obviously not empty.

Weren't you talking about an empty gun when you said the following?



Again, I said an empty magazines need NOT be retained unless dictated by the CofF.

Communication is everything and grammar does count.

Whether the mag is empty or not, the slide must be locked back to employ an administrative reload, so yes the magazine must me retained in this case. If the slide was not locked back, how would you as the shooter know to drop the magazine unless you were counting rounds.

 

[Steve David]

The empty mag must be retained if there is still a round in the chamber. page 41

Exactly..........!

 

[easy]

Whether the mag is empty or not, the slide must be locked back to employ an administrative reload, so yes the magazine must me retained in this case. If the slide was not locked back, how would you as the shooter know to drop the magazine unless you were counting rounds.

Well, on a double action, when it goes click instead of boom.

There's no guarantee a slide will lock back on an empty mag every time either.

 

[Steve David]

Well, on a double action, when it goes click instead of boom.

There's no guarantee a slide will lock back on an empty mag every time either.

... and I can't find anything in the book which states that a slide must be locked back for a tactical reload without retention.

Page 42

If the slide does not lock back, then the shooter must rack the slide to show that the firearm is empty before they can continue on in the COF and administer and emergency re-load.

As far as a tactical re-load goes, that has nothing to do with what we are talking about here and it does not require the slide being locked back and with that re-load or the re-load with retention, again the magazine must be retained.

Bottom line, if the firearm is not completely empty, the magazine must be retained.

 

[easy]

The empty mag must be retained if there is still a round in the chamber. page 41

Actually no ... according to page 41, it states that an empty magazine should be retained if the CofF calls for a Reload with Retention while a round remains in the chamber.

NOTE: Should the CoF call for a Reload with Retention and the magazine is empty while a round remains in the chamber, the empty magazine must be retained.

If there's no call for a Reload with Retention, then you can drop an empty magazine with a round still left in the chamber without incurring a three second procedural penalty, or a FTDR.

Please support your argument with the proper text for me. Maybe I'm not seeing something I should in the rule book.

 

[Steve David]

Actually no ... according to page 41, it states that an empty magazine should be retained if the CofF calls for a Reload with Retention while a round remains in the chamber.



If there's no call for a Reload with Retention, then you can drop an empty magazine with a round still left in the chamber without incurring a three second procedural penalty, or a FTDR.

Please support your argument with the proper text for me. Maybe I'm not seeing something I should in the rule book.

In the video in question, the shooter preformed an emergency re-load with the the slide forward, that is a not permitted. The shooter did not attempt to clear the gun or show the gun clear before he re-loaded nor was there an attempt to do a Tac Reload or RWR.

 

[easy]

OK, I see now what I missed.

There are three approved reloads in IDPA. 1) Tactical Reload, 2) Reload with Retention and 3) Emergency Reload. The first two are interchangeable, the third one needs not have the mag retained, but you do have to rack the slide after inserting a new magazine.

I missed the fact that an Emergency Reload has to have either the slide locked back before a new mag is inserted, or in the case of a pistol not going to slide lock, the slide must be racked after inserting a fresh mag. In that case the previously left chambered round would be ejected and the Emergency Reload would be as fair as the first two permitted reloads.

My apologies. Thank you for the clarity.

 

[Steve David]

All good, also unless specified, the Tac Re-Load and RWR are considered one re-laod and can be done either way during a COF.

 

[Canuck44]

In the video in question, the shooter preformed an emergency re-load with the the slide forward, that is a not permitted. The shooter did not attempt to clear the gun or show the gun clear before he re-loaded nor was there an attempt to do a Tac Reload or RWR.

Not quite true Steve. Some guns don't always lock back after the last round is fired. You may do an emergnecy reload and not retain the mag if the gun and mag are empty. In cases like this the SO must watch to see when the shooter racks the slide that a round doesn't come out.

Take Care

Bob

 

[Steve David]

Not quite true Steve. Some guns don't always lock back after the last round is fired. You may do an emergnecy reload and not retain the mag if the gun and mag are empty. In cases like this the SO must watch to see when the shooter racks the slide that a round doesn't come out.

Take Care

Bob

Pointed out in Post #46.