First time ladder test (what do you see)

Jayph

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Got out with the .220 AI today. I decided to try mystics 200yard load development ladder test. It was a chilly morning with 8-10mph winds. I have never really done precision load development before. I am a 100yards try a few loads and take the one under an inch with a hunting bullet kind of guy.

Two things to consider. The wind, and Iam not the greatest shot to begin with. I loaded 40.5gr-44gr of reloader-22 in .5gr loads. 10 thou off the lands with CCI BR primers. Shot at 200yd and the squares are 1 inch in size. Used a front rest and rear bag off a bench.

Where do I go from here? Load 43.5 and see if I can repeat without any vertical. Or load in .1gr either side a ways and try again?

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Thanks
 
Are you going to use the rifle as a Varmint rig or bench gun? If you are using it as a varmint gun (220 AI is a good varmint caliber) make sure you let the barrel cool to ambient between each load. As varminters we want the cold bore shot to be the one that counts. All development should be done this way. What groups good warm may not do so well cold bore. I have also noticed that I can load 1.5-2 gr hotter shooting out of a warm barrel before pressure signs. If I shoot the same load cold I have a nice ejector mark and flat primers from 47.5 gr of H-1000 using Lapua brass and Fedral Mag primers on my 22-243 Middlestead.

Take your own advice and work on the 43.5 gr load. Or if you are not seeing any pressure signs try some hotter loads. RL-22 is a fairly slow powder and should work well in the 220AI. Or you could try some H-1000, 4831 and similar powders.

P.S.
I think you have yourself a shooter. Just over 2" at 200 YDS and down to half an inch is very good. Look at it this way. Your worst load is just over 1 MOA.
 
Barrel was cooled between each 2 shot group. It will by my coyote rifle but will also see use as a long range gong rifle (hence the load work up) The fireform loads put the cold bore shot right in the same hole as the warm barrel shots so hopefully it stays that way with these ones. There was zero pressure sighns at 44gr but with the 75gr a-max I am very quickly running out of case space. I have tried everywhere for some 4831SC but came up empty handed. there is a gun show coming up so maybe I'll get lucky. I thought H1000 would be a good powder but when I talked to guys that shot the cartridge none of them had good luck with it.

Thanks for your post.


Are you going to use the rifle as a Varmint rig or bench gun? If you are using it as a varmint gun (220 AI is a good varmint caliber) make sure you let the barrel cool to ambient between each load. As varminters we want the cold bore shot to be the one that counts. All development should be done this way. What groups good warm may not do so well cold bore. I have also noticed that I can load 1.5-2 gr hotter shooting out of a warm barrel before pressure signs. If I shoot the same load cold I have a nice ejector mark and flat primers from 47.5 gr of H-1000 using Lapua brass and Fedral Mag primers on my 22-243 Middlestead.

Take your own advice and work on the 43.5 gr load. Or if you are not seeing any pressure signs try some hotter loads. RL-22 is a fairly slow powder and should work well in the 220AI. Or you could try some H-1000, 4831 and similar powders.

P.S.
I think you have yourself a shooter. Just over 2" at 200 YDS and down to half an inch is very good. Look at it this way. Your worst load is just over 1 MOA.
 
Two shots is not enough for a group, oyu said yourself you are not tha great a shot so are either of the shots a flier? Groups should be a minimum of three shots as this gives better idea of true size or pattern. Depending on which rifle I have with me I will shoot between 3-10 shots as a group to determine that loads capability.
 
Try Federal Magnum primers, The CCi's are the least hot available and you are trying to light a fair amount of slow powder.

NormB
 
I would retest now with 2 3rds groups at 43.5, 43.7 or 43.8, 44, 44.2, 44.5.

Look for the tightest flattest group that repeats. You are most definitely shooting at one accuracy node. As you go too high in powder, the orientation will turn vertical and you will get one shot way outside the main cluster. Then all the shots will spread out and you will either run out of case volume or see pressure signs.

Real obvious when you have gone too far.

For a hunting rig with this much case, going to the nth degree of pressure is not in your best interest. consistency and function is far more important - you will be going pretty darn fast already.

Neither is testing and testing and testing - your barrel isn't going to last that long.

So next time out, lets say 43.5 and 43.7gr shoot essentially the same (nice flat or triangular groups around 1/2") with 2 3 rds clusters each load going into 1/2" at 200yds (total of 12rds fired). I would then make up say 10 rds each load and try them at LR.

You are now tuning for lowest vertical dispersion. The group (left/right) isn't going to change but the up and down way out there most certainly will. Real obvious when you start going 400 to 600yds.

One load will drop them onto a target like a spray can on its side - width due to wind but no vertical. When you hold off, that is where the bullet impacts. You aim up, goes up, etc. Each shot goes where you expect it to land even with some wind. Nothing surprising about where the bullet lands.

The load is easy to drive.

The other will be a few on target, one high, one low, one somewhere else, . The shots will land in an unpredictable pattern. You feel like you are chasing your tail and would be better off just holding dead one with your eyes closed. Something 'has' to be wrong with my gear, my scope, my hold, my everything.

1/4 min average, at 200yds is about all your are going to see with this type of set up. you have speed, accuracy, a high BC bullet and enough bullet weight to make a serious impression on your target. Reaching out to a mile is now simply a matter of dialing up when you find a load with no vertical.

Shoot the load over a chrony. Make up a drop table using JBM and use the Litz bullet option. Confirm with your range finder over various ranges. Adjust your drop table to match your scope and rangefinder - you will be close but highly unlikely bang on. Reconfirm next few times out.

You are done and have only fired around 100rds. - go have fun and smoke some poochies.

Jerry

NormB, I wouldn't change the primer and have used the CCI BR2 primers to get match accuracy with magnum cases burning almost twice as much powder. There is plenty of spark for the case volume.
 
Jerry

NormB, I wouldn't change the primer and have used the CCI BR2 primers to get match accuracy with magnum cases burning almost twice as much powder. There is plenty of spark for the case volume.
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I've seen 7/68 improved shooting CCIBR2 that hang fired, and misfired (powder turned to gel at the base of the case). I've had 7WSM hangfire with CCIBR2.

I'd give the magum primers a try like CCI 450 or Fed... just to see if ES or vertical reduces.

NormB
 
Jerry

NormB, I wouldn't change the primer and have used the CCI BR2 primers to get match accuracy with magnum cases burning almost twice as much powder. There is plenty of spark for the case volume.
__________________

I've seen 7/68 improved shooting CCIBR2 that hang fired, and misfired (powder turned to gel at the base of the case). I've had 7WSM hangfire with CCIBR2.

I'd give the magum primers a try like CCI 450 or Fed... just to see if ES or vertical reduces.

NormB

What type of powder were you using to get hangfires? What type of temps?

So far, CCI BR2 is what I use for my 6.5 mystic and 260improved case. I burn 48ish gr of H4831SC. Works great even in the cool of fall. Another shooter using them in a 300WM and we shoot way out there with zero vertical.

For the OP, his is getting consistent and reliable ignition with very nice groupings. Adding a bigger flash might actually degrade his groups.

But if you are getting hangfires, of course, do what needs to get the positive results you want.

Any chance the primers got dirty or oily?

That would be my first guess...unless you are using some very old ball powder.

Jerry
 
Jerry,

No the primers were not old or oily. The powder was H1000, not sure in the 7/68 but fresh.

74gr in the 7/68, and 64 in the 7/WSM

Temps around 65-75 deg.

NormB
 
The rifle looks like it has potential but you better be reading up on what a ladder test consists of and how to interpret the results.

RC
I used mystics method as per his article. I believe I did it right. Might not be a traditional "ladder test" As I believe in his article he mentions he takes the best from a few different ways. It is very possible I called it the wrong thing.

Two shots is not enough for a group, oyu said yourself you are not tha great a shot so are either of the shots a flier? Groups should be a minimum of three shots as this gives better idea of true size or pattern. Depending on which rifle I have with me I will shoot between 3-10 shots as a group to determine that loads capability.

I agree but I believe the point of this test was to find which powder amount to focus on. I will now go back to the window he posted above and fire 3 or 5 shot groups. Thanks for the post and I will be sure to post my groups good or bad when I get a chance to get out and test again.
 
Jerry,

No the primers were not old or oily. The powder was H1000, not sure in the 7/68 but fresh.

74gr in the 7/68, and 64 in the 7/WSM

Temps around 65-75 deg.

NormB

Thanks for the info. Not something I would have suspected but your results are different and you have found the appropriate solution.

No change the flash hole might have had a bit of grit or walnut shell in it? I have had that happen before after cleaning my brass.

Good stuff.

Jerry
 
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