Powder question for 30-06

KDX

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I might end up loading some 150s for my 30-06 and only have Benchmark and H335 powder on hand. There are loads listed for these powders on Hodgdon's website, but I'm wondering if they are good or if I should look at getting something else. Thanks in advance.;)
 
"...if they are good..." Good in what way? They'll certainly be safe. You'll have to work up a load and see if your rifle likes the load.
H335 is faster than any of the powders I've ever used. Developed for use in .223/5.56.
Benchmark was developed for use in small cartridges too.
You may want to look into IMR4064, IMR4895, H4895 or Varget.
 
"...if they are good..." Good in what way? They'll certainly be safe. You'll have to work up a load and see if your rifle likes the load.
H335 is faster than any of the powders I've ever used. Developed for use in .223/5.56.
Benchmark was developed for use in small cartridges too.
You may want to look into IMR4064, IMR4895, H4895 or Varget.

Good as in one of the better choices. I realize every rifle has it's own likes and dislikes as far as propellants and bullets go and loads have to be worked up.
 
If you have load data, and you don't want to buy another powder, use what you have.....

I have 15 differnt types of powder available for use in my 'hobby hole'...... Most I only use in one firearm.

Don't do what Johnny Don't does....... :D

I highly reccomend using the same powder in multiple calibers to reduce the amount of powder you have to keep on hand......
 
I don't use it, but according to the Hodgdon website they suggest that H-335 with a 150 breaks 2900 with reasonable pressure. If your rifle shoots the load with sufficient accuracy for the purposes intended, go for it. There is no reason not to use it, and a slower burning powder will not provide you with an increase in velocity that you can make use of in the field. I have used both IMR 3031 and Win 748 in the .30/06 with acceptable results, although I too prefer slower burning propellants in the 4895-4831 range.
 
If you have load data, and you don't want to buy another powder, use what you have.....

I have 15 differnt types of powder available for use in my 'hobby hole'...... Most I only use in one firearm.

Don't do what Johnny Don't does....... :D

I highly reccomend using the same powder in multiple calibers to reduce the amount of powder you have to keep on hand......

I have two powders on my bench, and have had for the last 10yrs.
H-335 and 700X. One loads ALL of my rifles (7.62x39mm, .243, .380, .303, 7.62x54R, and .30-06). I have more than one rifle of each calibre.
The other loads ALL my shotgun stuff. .410, 20 and 12ga.
I realize that this is not an ideal powder for each and every cartridge/rifle/load combo, but it shoots at least 2MOA from milsurps and sub MOA with "store-boughts".
Current load for .30-06 is:
Federal Brass
Win LR primer
47.5gn H-335
150gn Rem PSP
MV=3040 chronied.
No signs of pressure and shoots to 7/8" at 100yds.
Good luck.
 
I use H-335 all the time in 30.06 as well as others. 165gr SP. Clean firing, flat and accurate. If you want I can check my notes for powder wieght when I get home.
 
Both the Sierra and Lyman manuals show IMR4064 as the accuracy load with 150/165gr bullets. This is borne out by my own experience in many .30-06s, with IMR4895 behind by a nose. One nice thing about 4064/4895 vs IMR4350 with these bullet weights is that you burn less powder with similar velocity. I do like 4350 with 180gr bullets.
 
46 grains of H335, will give you about 2750 fps, with a standard primer and 150 grain bullet. It is also a max listed load, developing about 50,000 psi. I've used it and it is quite accurate. It works extremely well, in a Garand M1, as the powder residue is light.
There are better choices though. The next powder you might want to try, is BL-C2. It is also a "ball" powder and therefore measures easily and consistently from a powder measure. 51 grains, will give you 2950 fps and around 48,000 psi. That is in the same performance range as the above listed alternates. Personally, I like to use "ball" powders. I will admit though, I do use magnum primers, for better ignition.

If your shots are going to be in the 250m range or less, it won't make any difference which way you choose to go. The deer certainly won't notice the difference, unless you tell him beforehand.

These are relatively mild loads, for modern actions. They are about maximum for older actions. Those made pre 1950 may be suspect, concerning strength. It's just a rule of thumb I like to follow.

Hot rodding a cartridge, is usually counter productive. As the pressure curve, reaches the maximum of the rifle's capabilities, things start to go awry. Usually, accuracy suffers. Load your rifle for accuracy first. The fact that you can hit where you aim, is far more important than how fast the bullet gets there.

That H335 powder, should do the job just fine and is a very consistent powder, not overly sensetive to temperature changes. If your money is a bit tight, wait and buy a slower powder when you can afford it.

By the way, the 150 grain bullet is very effective, although a bit of a lightweight in the 30-06. Be careful that the bullets you are using, match the toughness of the game you are hunting. They make some very nice premium bullets in the 150-165 grain range. I would be more concerned with bullet performance in this case, than powder performance.

Go to a gunshow and buy a used reloading manual. It will give you more real information in a few minutes of perusal, than we can give you in a few days. Not only that, it won't be clouded with emotion.
 
46 grains of H335, will give you about 2750 fps, with a standard primer and 150 grain bullet. It is also a max listed load, developing about 50,000 psi.

While I agree with most of your comments, I need to point out that you may have your data a bit skewed.
From the Hodgdon Website Load Data:

46gn of H-335 behind a 150gn bullet develops 42,500 CUP and the max load for the 150gn bullet is 51 gn and develops 49,200 CUP. Not sure what you are using.
 
i might end up loading some 150s for my 30-06 and only have benchmark and h335 powder on hand. There are loads listed for these powders on hodgdon's website, but i'm wondering if they are good or if i should look at getting something else. Thanks in advance.;)

h4350
 
rookie wildcat, I get my data from the "Lyman Reloading Handbook". I like the Lyman book. Fairly conservative numbers. I don't post pressures, without a source to back it up. I do appreciate your information though. That brings up another problem, with suppliers and their testing procedures.
Something to consider. Every batch of powder is different from previous batches or batches to come. Not a lot of difference but enough. That's why you check your load for accuracy and excess pressure signs, when you buy from another lot. Not all powders are created equal, even with the same designation.

If you look at different sites or manuals, it is common to find loads with different pressure levels, for the same load. It isn't nearly as accurate a science as we would like. Burn rates, are controlled by the graphite and other coatings. Otherwise, most powders are similar in content. It is next to impossible to keep everything absolutely consistent. They keep things pretty close though. That's another reason for some of the dramatic changes in later manuals.
 
These are relatively mild loads, for modern actions. They are about maximum for older actions. Those made pre 1950 may be suspect, concerning strength. It's just a rule of thumb I like to follow.

I have to smile when I hear folks say that pre-1950 actions might be suspect, as I have observed one situation where a modern action might not have stood up as well. It was my most serious handloading gaff, a double charge (50 grs) of SR 4759 in a .30/06 with a 210 gr cast bullet. The ancient M-17 Enfield suffered no injury despite the need to beat the action open with a 2X4. Instead of pushing the 210 gr bullet at a sedate 1800 fps with mild recoil and report, the round boomed like a .300 magnum and produced significant recoil. The Chrony stated well over 2800. The primer was laying in the bottom of the magazine and the primer pocket had expanded out to the lettering and the flash-hole was as large as the primer pocket. While I have no idea of what sort of pressure was involved, the case head lettering was permanently appeared in mirror relief in the bolt face, look up "The Munroe Effect," yet no gas escaped into the magazine well or back through the bolt race. Fortunately I was shooting that day with a retired teacher/gunsmith who after remarking on my incredible good fortune, carefully inspected the rifle and declared it safe to use, although the next round, a full powered jacketed 168 gr load, was fired with the rifle held well away from my body and face. That ugly old Remington manufactured M-17 served me faithfully for many more years until it was lost in a house fire in December of 2000.

There have certainly been documented cases of improper heat treating in military contract bolt action rifles, but the runs were well known at the time and I doubt if many, or if any, of these rifles have survived to the present day. I am confident that any quality brand bolt action rifle that was originally designed to fire the .30/06 or some similar cartridge, and whose barrel and action has not been compromised by bubba, be it a 1903 Sringfield, a 98 Mauser, a 1917 Enfield, a Remington M-30, or a Winchester M-54 will be more than safe with modern ammunition; factory or handloads.

As to using old loading manuals, while they are interesting for comparison purposes, I don't recommend their use with newly manufactured powder. Powder coatings change over the years, as do propellant recipes; so the powder that is listed in an earlier manual, does not necessarily have the same burning rate as todays product, even though the general characteristics are similar. Powders are designed to fall within certain tolerances, yet I believe your load data should be contemporary to the propellant you use, and that your own data needs to be tweaked for use in your particular firearm from that. If you have access to 1940s .30/06 data for 4895, when there was only one 4895 available, how does it compare with the contemporary data found on the Hodgdon site? More than one handloader has detected a difference between lots of powder of the same number, manufactured within a year of his previous lot, never mind powder whose manufacture is separated by decades. In any case simply loading the maximum load from any manual without working up to it, particularly if it is a powder you are unfamiliar with, is a bad idea.
 
Very interesting posting, Boomer.
It was good you were shooting over a chronograph. You have probably set a record for the all time heaviest loading in a 30-06, about 3650 plus, foot pounds of energy!
 
rookie wildcat, I get my data from the "Lyman Reloading Handbook". I like the Lyman book. Fairly conservative numbers. I don't post pressures, without a source to back it up. I do appreciate your information though. That brings up another problem, with suppliers and their testing procedures.
Something to consider. Every batch of powder is different from previous batches or batches to come. Not a lot of difference but enough. That's why you check your load for accuracy and excess pressure signs, when you buy from another lot. Not all powders are created equal, even with the same designation.

If you look at different sites or manuals, it is common to find loads with different pressure levels, for the same load. It isn't nearly as accurate a science as we would like. Burn rates, are controlled by the graphite and other coatings. Otherwise, most powders are similar in content. It is next to impossible to keep everything absolutely consistent. They keep things pretty close though. That's another reason for some of the dramatic changes in later manuals.

You admittedly posted what you term "conservative numbers" from a Lyman catalogue to a reloader asking for info. What you posted was what YOU like to load. When a reloader asks for info, he or she is entitled to statements of fact. I don't post pressures or any info I can't back up either. That being the case, your Lyman manual lists 46gn as a max load and the max pressure is 50,000PSI, that is what the Lyman lawyers have decided to post. However the SAMMI specification for that particular commercial round is 60,000PSI (that is fairly current, BTW). I usually cross reference data in as many books and sources as I can, granted most of the data on H-335 is 4-10 years old because it has been over-shadowed by newer, better powders.
OP, as I stated, my load falls within all the parameters of my ability to shoot effectively and is satisfactory to me. I always start load development a FULL 10% below suggested min level. I load 5 rounds each in 1gn intervals up to the max load data. Firing 3-rd groups, I usually never get to fire those high end ones because I find the groups I am looking for well below that. I then go back, pull bullets, re-load with charges in .2gn increments. That is, if a load of 47gns was tighter than 46 or 48gn, then I would start with a 46.2gn charge and work up to 47.8gn. Somewhere in between is another sweet spot and when I find that, I stop shooting. Go home, pull bullets, start again with the now tuned charge, load a hundred, go to the range, sight in the rifle, shoot 40 or 50 rounds to set them in my memory and then go hunting.
 
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