How to kick a** with M14 irons sights (and grade 4 math)
- Thread starter J996
- Start date
Very informative sticky. Slightly different mechanics, but very similar procedure to zeroing an M16A2 (some things never get forgotten I guess). Does everyone use a 6 o'clock hold all the time with irons, or just when shooting bullseye competition? I never have and it has worked for me, but sometimes I've been accused of being "special".
Six o'clock hold is also preferred when shooting at figure 12 (half man) and figure 11 (charging man) targets for service rifle. A rifle zeroed for six o'clock hold on a figure 12, will hit centre on a figure 11 when using the big white patch of the knee as an elevation reference.
At 500m, use the edges and top of the 4' target frame as aiming references, because few people can actually see well enough to aim at the figure.
Its possible that some of the new guys who have only shot scopes may not know this, so perhap I should mention the importance of sight black.
Blackening the sight will help increase the definition of the sights against the white/sand background of the target and improve your aim. This is especially true with some of the Norinco rifles that have very light grey parkerizing, or older rifles where the finish is worn shiny. Front and rear sights and sight guards can be blackened with a carbide lamp (the best method in my opinion), spray sight blackener, or with a burning oily cleaning patch.
Sight blackener (particularly the spray kind) can build up over time and distort your sight picture, so clean it off once in a while before re-applying.
At 500m, use the edges and top of the 4' target frame as aiming references, because few people can actually see well enough to aim at the figure.
Its possible that some of the new guys who have only shot scopes may not know this, so perhap I should mention the importance of sight black.
Blackening the sight will help increase the definition of the sights against the white/sand background of the target and improve your aim. This is especially true with some of the Norinco rifles that have very light grey parkerizing, or older rifles where the finish is worn shiny. Front and rear sights and sight guards can be blackened with a carbide lamp (the best method in my opinion), spray sight blackener, or with a burning oily cleaning patch.
Sight blackener (particularly the spray kind) can build up over time and distort your sight picture, so clean it off once in a while before re-applying.
Excellent info, thanks. M-14 is next on the list for me as i do not have one, if i new where to get some acessories in Canada for it i would buy one.Troy chasis would be the ticket or something similar..I would not put optics on it eihter.
Kayser Sose
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Southern Van Isle
I too have noticed a lot of scoped M14-type rifles. Whatever happened to iron-sight based marksmanship?
Glad to find this article; thanks for posting!!
Glad to find this article; thanks for posting!!
Kayser Sose
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Southern Van Isle
I too have noticed a lot of scoped M14-type rifles. Whatever happened to iron-sight based marksmanship?
Glad to find this article; thanks for posting!!
Glad to find this article; thanks for posting!!
- Location
- Steel Town
A very handy iron sight refresher. Thanks for posting. I keep all my vintage and traditional style rifles scope free!
Mauser GDog
CGN frequent flyer
I'll be taking the M14 Kurgan sold me out this weekend and zeroing it in from scratch using this method.
It shot true with the zero he had on it like he said it would, I just want to go through the process myself.
Chiming in a little late I realize but I've recently acquired an old SA Nat'l match and was wondering how the hooded aperture works. I realize you can adjust 1/2 min by rotating the hood 180 deg with notch up or notch down. My question is whether notch up will give you 1/2 min up or down?
Also this may be a silly question to you experience M14 guys but are the 1/2 min adjustments that are achievable with Nat'l match sights accomplished in conjunction with the hood or are the elevation clicks 1/2 min as well.
Thanks.
Also this may be a silly question to you experience M14 guys but are the 1/2 min adjustments that are achievable with Nat'l match sights accomplished in conjunction with the hood or are the elevation clicks 1/2 min as well.
Thanks.
I tried to use the info in the sticky the first time I took the 2009 Norc to the range.
The original rear sights were so bad that I could get no windage at all.
Lessons learned...got the contact info for an Italian source (from Chalkriver...thanks) and got a USGI rear sight assembly.
A mechanical klutz like me had no problem changing out the sights in about 1/2 hour.
Now anticipating my second trip back to the range.
The original rear sights were so bad that I could get no windage at all.
Lessons learned...got the contact info for an Italian source (from Chalkriver...thanks) and got a USGI rear sight assembly.
A mechanical klutz like me had no problem changing out the sights in about 1/2 hour.
Now anticipating my second trip back to the range.
- Location
- In lalaland, that is Ottawa.
QUOTE=powmia56;4052286]45 years old might not seem too old, but I can't see the damn target at 500m. So this helps me not at all. Solution? Scope.
Appreciate the thought, though.[/QUOTE]
Well it is Nov.17,2011 and we are at the cottage. The island to the east is 500 yards +- 10 yards measured with an accurate GPS. We spot deer there when the lake has ice, feeding on the cedar, have for years. I had my cararacts fixed this summer and now have 20/25 vision, the best in my life. I always used an aperture sight when ever possible before I could afford a scope. with my customized .30-06 P17 Wincester, I could put a moose 180 gr. handload into 2"at 200 yards. So What?
Well, this Silly Old Fart with the cararacts fixed, has 20/25 vision, the best of my life! Thus, I think that with a spotter and shooting a Garand, I could using the OPs great guide, acquit myself well.
But I will never have the opportunity to try it.
For you younger guys though, forget the scope, even with the vision you have. Buy a Garand or M14 and go for it!
A great thread! Thanks to the OP.
Appreciate the thought, though.[/QUOTE]
Well it is Nov.17,2011 and we are at the cottage. The island to the east is 500 yards +- 10 yards measured with an accurate GPS. We spot deer there when the lake has ice, feeding on the cedar, have for years. I had my cararacts fixed this summer and now have 20/25 vision, the best in my life. I always used an aperture sight when ever possible before I could afford a scope. with my customized .30-06 P17 Wincester, I could put a moose 180 gr. handload into 2"at 200 yards. So What?
Well, this Silly Old Fart with the cararacts fixed, has 20/25 vision, the best of my life! Thus, I think that with a spotter and shooting a Garand, I could using the OPs great guide, acquit myself well.
But I will never have the opportunity to try it.
For you younger guys though, forget the scope, even with the vision you have. Buy a Garand or M14 and go for it!
A great thread! Thanks to the OP.
Sevensixtwo
Regular
- Location
- West coast is the best coast
I imagine this is all done with surplus ammo and a 22" barrel right??
At Hungrys last clinic we all set our sets as described above and once mine was zerod at 100 I was one click from the bottom on my new Canam Shorty I was using surplus IVI FMJ ammo .
@200 I added 2 clicks for a total of 3 from the bottom
@300 I added 3 clicks for a total of 6 from the bottom
@400 I added 4 clicks for a total of 10 from the bottom
@500 I added 5 clicks for a total of 15 from the bottom
This worked perfectly for my rifle...you would almost think Hungry knows what he is talking about at times
@200 I added 2 clicks for a total of 3 from the bottom
@300 I added 3 clicks for a total of 6 from the bottom
@400 I added 4 clicks for a total of 10 from the bottom
@500 I added 5 clicks for a total of 15 from the bottom
This worked perfectly for my rifle...you would almost think Hungry knows what he is talking about at times
Mauser GDog
CGN frequent flyer
At Hungrys last clinic we all set our sets as described above and once mine was zerod at 100 I was one click from the bottom on my new Canam Shorty I was using surplus IVI FMJ ammo .
@200 I added 2 clicks for a total of 3 from the bottom
@300 I added 3 clicks for a total of 6 from the bottom
@400 I added 4 clicks for a total of 10 from the bottom
@500 I added 5 clicks for a total of 15 from the bottom
This worked perfectly for my rifle...you would almost think Hungry knows what he is talking about at times
Are those with a factory rear sight? My Garand rear sight is:
zeroed for 100m
@200 +2 more
@300 +2 more
@400 +2 more
@500 +8 more (big jump here)
Using the same PRIVI FMJ ammo you were, same results with S&B FMJ
This would mean the teeth on the elevation & aperature arm are different sizes I guess?
Sorry forgot to mention that part...It has Garand rear sights on it as well
Hungry called it before I even did the shooting as to what the # of clicks should be at the dif ranges...even the numbers on the dial lined at correctly the diffferent ranges and the clicks between were as stated earlier .
You ended up 14 from the bottom and I was 15 from the bottom at 500 meters...I feel apart at the 300M when I was shooting maybe thats why..lol
Not sure about the graduated teeth question you asked and you would have to ask Hungry how he came up with the # of clicks added idea ..I think it was by just counting them as he turned the dial IIRC
Hungry called it before I even did the shooting
as to what the # of clicks should be at the dif ranges...even the numbers on the dial lined at correctly the diffferent ranges and the clicks between were as stated earlier .You ended up 14 from the bottom and I was 15 from the bottom at 500 meters...I feel apart at the 300M when I was shooting maybe thats why..lol
Not sure about the graduated teeth question you asked and you would have to ask Hungry how he came up with the # of clicks added idea ..I think it was by just counting them as he turned the dial IIRC
