Will after market rigger avoid Rem 700 problems?

[JasonS]

The 1911 is more expensive to manufacture than any of the modern poly pistols, folded sheet metal sigs, etc. And it isn't brazed and soldered together from multiple pieces like the Remington 700, so I'm afraid I don't catch your analogy. You're entitled to your opinion, but if I agreed with you, we'd both be wrong.

You point out that the 700 is easy to replace parts and accurize etc. Show me someone shooting a stock, original 1911 faithful to JMB's blueprints that is in competition. To me the 1911 has been the LEGO gun of guns. There's got to be a million companies out there by now with something to do with "fixing" the design to make it more reliable or accurate.

I'd put my folded sheetmetal old Sig P226 (Germany) up against any faithful 1911 of original specs in a torture test to destruction. The Sig would win. But given that, I'm not gonna slam the 1911 every chance I get because I hate feeding the anti's. Choose your weapon and respect the choices of others. And respect other's opinions because we all have ours too.

The video proves to me that all this CNBC crap is a hoax and that some shooters just fell off the turnip truck.

 

[sir_springer]

Bottom Line?

Their design is no safer than Remington's.

If any aftermarket trigger is the equal of "the dreaded Walker design" I would be surprised.
50 years is a long time to iron out the bugs.
No aftermarket manufacturer can match this performance record.

Have a couple Rem. 700s myself.

Had one of 'em, about 20 years back, discharge when flipping the safety off. I don't know if it was the fault of the guy whom I let "tune" it, or if it was design...and at the time I didn't much give a damn one way or the other!!!

It was repeatable, too. Throw the bolt home, engage safety, pull trigger, release safety, CLICK!

Replaced with a Timney.

For a long time I never heard or read of any similar experiences, and I attributed it to improper adjustment.

Then a couple years back, and in several different articles in magazines, I saw mention of this happening, again generally attributed to improper adjustment, with a caution that ONLY a qualified professional should mess with them...or, as the instructions state, Remington themselves.

Then I started reading about this kind of failure on forums...???

Then I hear a story about a lawsuit over this, with a fatality involved.

Now this documentary comes out, and everyone starts talking about it, and reports of this happening start to crop up on forums like weeds in a garden.

Got chatting with a guy I met while hunting last week. Noticed his Remington, and asked if he'd heard about this controversy. Yep. But not with his own, but a good friend had it happen to his.

Point being, I'm getting the distinct impression it's a lot more common than anyone might have suspected...or, as the case may be, cares to admit.

Can any trigger fail, if set up wrong? Certainly. Which is why, IMHO, only gunsmiths should be installing and/or tuning 'em...unless, of course, triggers like the new versions are specifically designed to be "user adjustable" regarding weight.

However, many of these complaints/stories specifically...if not emphatically...state no adjustments were ever made, triggers are as shipped from the factory.

This is a nasty situation for Remington, no doubt about that.

That it's apparently been allowed to brew for so many years is perhaps the point of contention that's going to come home to haunt them.

 

[JasonS]

And I'll add that humans are pretty much all the same. 2 examples. When a gun "accidentally" goes off or someone "rear ends" another vehicle in one case it's "I never touched the trigger" and in the other "I hit the brakes and nothing happened". It's human nature to lie when we screw up and hurt or kill someone. It's the rare highly evolved human being that admits they did wrong. Even if it means they have to face the fact that they killed their own child due to their own negligence. Life can be cruel at times.

 

[MTM]

My two cents, many years ago I hunted with only Remingtons. This was back before i saw the light. I had two discharges when the safety was released. Cost my a nice White tale and a bull Moose. At the time I put it down to my home trigger adjustment but now.....

 

[sir_springer]

Different perspective, somewhat random numbers...

5,000,000 rifles x 1% failure rate = 50,000 events.

If 75% of those "events" were human error...improper adjustment, finger on the trigger, whatever...that still leaves 12,500 failures.

How many is too many?

From what I'm seeing on forums, I'm not sure 1% is a stretch.

And sometimes percentages and technical terms obscure the important numbers.

FWIW.

 

[SuperCub]

Your mileage may vary.

Mine does.


.

 

[guntech]

The sky is falling, the sky is falling!

All I can say is watch the Remington response video...

And if you guys are really worried there are millions of us who will take your 700's off your hands.

Personally preferred with the original trigger...

 

[blargon]

If Remington's trigger was not adjustable, there would be no accidental discharges.

 

[X-fan]

My two cents, many years ago I hunted with only Remingtons. This was back before i saw the light. I had two discharges when the safety was released. Cost my a nice White tale and a bull Moose. At the time I put it down to my home trigger adjustment but now.....

I lost the Blacktail of a lifetime because of a BLR.
I adjusted the trigger and ever once in a long time the hammer would only fall to the half #### position.
Sure as sh1t it happened when that monster was directly in front of me.

Is it Browning's fault that I lost the buck?

I doubt it.

 

[X-fan]

If Remington's trigger was not adjustable, there would be no accidental discharges.

Then the trigger pull would suck like every other rifle....Your choice.

 

[blargon]

Then the trigger pull would suck like every other rifle....Your choice.

I've adjusted every Remington trigger I've had, but would not blame Remington if it failed to work properly. The only problem with the 700 trigger is improper adjustments made by careless people.

 

[crazy_davey]

Anyone wanna start taking bets on how long it will be before we have another thread covering this exact same subject ?

 

[JasonS]

I've adjusted every Remington trigger I've had, but would not blame Remington if it failed to work properly. The only problem with the 700 trigger is improper adjustments made by careless people.

Same here. And I use a very powerful magnifier to watch the inspection hole that shows sear engagement. Three things, one I accept responsibilty of my actions by adjusting the trigger and two, I always know where my muzzle is pointed and three I never trust a safety. Even with the safety on I always open the bolt if I get a pal to hold my rifle while I cross a fence.

 

[Canuck Bob]

I am sorry I went down this path. I do not have the required credentials to discuss this problem.

Sorry if I offended anyone.

 

[guntech]

I asked nicely in my original post to avoid this trail. There are many reports on this site of rifles that discharged wrongly. I've searched many US forums and this problem has been reported on for years, not just recently. The inventor of the rifle and trigger is on record as wanting it changed. I don't think those people are liars, do you. Take your snotty attitude somewhere else. I asked a question about after market triggers.

Your original post:
Will after market rigger avoid Rem 700 problems?
I'm researching a left hand rifle. I'm not interested in rehashing the safety debate just wondering if the problem involves just the trigger? Will a timney or other after market trigger avoid the possibility of the problem as reported?

In your original post you make an assumption there is a problem that has not been addressed by Remington. That is a point of view not shared by that many people.

If you feel you need an aftermarket trigger buy one. The simple fact is if it is not adjusted correctly or maintained it can 'misfire' as easily as any Remington trigger that is incorrectly adjusted or maintained... just the same as any trigger on any rifle that is incorrectly adjusted or maintained.

This 'safety' issue was addressed 30 years or more ago... the persistence of the story is due to the fact the 700 is the most popular bolt action produced in modern times... and big companies are always a target for the sue happy lawyers in the US. Did you actually watch Remington's response? Did you see where neither Remington nor the complainant could make the filthy, rusty, poorly maintained "death" rifle misfire in any way...??? It functioned perfectly 100%.

 

[pharaoh2]

There are many reports on this site of rifles that discharged wrongly.

Only after it became a tv show. I wonder what would happen if the media discovers the drip? Would gunnutz all of a sudden come down with a burning stinky pecker too?

 

[Canuck Bob]

I have decided it best to not get involved in this discussion. I do not wish to be labelled a troll or worse. Many experienced members have educated me on the error of my thinking.

I did not wish to offend but have in regret.

 

[X-fan]

I asked nicely in my original post to avoid this trail. There are many reports on this site of rifles that discharged wrongly. I've searched many US forums and this problem has been reported on for years, not just recently. The inventor of the rifle and trigger is on record as wanting it changed. I don't think those people are liars, do you. Take your snotty attitude somewhere else. I asked a question about after market triggers.

My attitude is in response to your (and other) ignorant and obviously uneducated questions....If you think my reply was snotty you should have seen the other renditions I edited.

Bottom line?
Reports and internet BS are just that.
Of all the supposed cases of malfunctioning triggers nobody has been able to reproduce a single malfunction...Not even the legal experts hired to do so.

What is really at issue here is the golden rule...Keep your finger off the trigger until you are ready to destroy what is in front of the rifle.


Flip the safety off while your finger is on the trigger and well....Expect it to go bang!

 

[Canuck Bob]

My attitude is in response to your (and other) ignorant and obviously uneducated questions....If you think my reply was snotty you should have seen the other renditions I edited.

Bottom line?
Reports and internet BS are just that.
Of all the supposed cases of malfunctioning triggers nobody has been able to reproduce a single malfunction...Not even the legal experts hired to do so.

What is really at issue here is the golden rule...Keep your finger off the trigger until you are ready to destroy what is in front of the rifle.


Flip the safety off while your finger is on the trigger and well....Expect it to go bang!

My apologies, I really wish this had not gone so far. I have edited out my comments.

 

[MK2750]

My attitude is in response to your (and other) ignorant and obviously uneducated questions....If you think my reply was snotty you should have seen the other renditions I edited.

Bottom line?
Reports and internet BS are just that.
Of all the supposed cases of malfunctioning triggers nobody has been able to reproduce a single malfunction...Not even the legal experts hired to do so.

What is really at issue here is the golden rule...Keep your finger off the trigger until you are ready to destroy what is in front of the rifle.


Flip the safety off while your finger is on the trigger and well....Expect it to go bang!

I wonder if internet bullying will solve the problem......

No mine is still a POS and the rest of the gun isn't all that ^%$^ hot either.

Barrel channel looks like it was done by beavers, steel wool with stock finish stuck to the action, and POS trigger that fails to fire and then fires at random.

After bedding, floating and a new trigger it finally shoots nearly an inch group. If I buy a decent stock for it it should shoot as good as a Stevens.