Winchester 70

HKMark23

HKMark23

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As I understand it, the 70 has seen, for lack of a better description, 3 manufacturing phases.

1) Pre 64

2) New Haven Conn. (Early 90's)

3) Columbia SC (Latest version)

Is there any way of identifying between the latter 2 (New Haven vs Columbia) ? Perhaps a code or series in the serial numbers ?

Thanx
 
HKMark23 said:
As I understand it, the 70 has seen, for lack of a better description, 3 manufacturing phases.

1) Pre 64

2) New Haven Conn. (Early 90's)

3) Columbia SC (Latest version)

Is there any way of identifying between the latter 2 (New Haven vs Columbia) ? Perhaps a code or series in the serial numbers ?

Thanx
Click to expand...

The serial numbers in your #2 category are all G######, But the most obvious distinction is the difference in the triggers.
 
HKMark23 said:
As I understand it, the 70 has seen, for lack of a better description, 3 manufacturing phases.

1) Pre 64

2) New Haven Conn. (Early 90's)

3) Columbia SC (Latest version)

Is there any way of identifying between the latter 2 (New Haven vs Columbia) ? Perhaps a code or series in the serial numbers ?

Thanx
Click to expand...

4 actually...

1) Pre 64
2) Post 64 (no CRF)
3) Classic (New Haven)
4) Carolina

Pre64 has no Alphabetical prefix to the serial#. Post is easy to spot. Classic has a G###### serial# and says "Classic" on the barrel. Carolina has the new BS-in-a-box trigger. Not sure if there are any outside markings on the SC M70 to differentiate. Likely says something about Columbia, SC on the barrel roll mark, no?
 
BigUglyMan said:
4 actually...

1) Pre 64
2) Post 64 (no CRF)
3) Classic (New Haven)
4) Carolina

Pre64 has no Alphabetical prefix to the serial#. Post is easy to spot. Classic has a G###### serial# and says "Classic" on the barrel. Carolina has the new BS-in-a-box trigger. Not sure if there are any outside markings on the SC M70 to differentiate. Likely says something about Columbia, SC on the barrel roll mark, no?
Click to expand...

Some would also add pre-war to the list but that might be splitting hairs. I'm starting to wonder if the last incarnation might not be the best of the bunch, and I've had them all at one time or another.
 
BigUglyMan said:
4 actually...

1) Pre 64
2) Post 64 (no CRF)
3) Classic (New Haven)
4) Carolina

Pre64 has no Alphabetical prefix to the serial#. Post is easy to spot. Classic has a G###### serial# and says "Classic" on the barrel. Carolina has the new BS-in-a-box trigger. Not sure if there are any outside markings on the SC M70 to differentiate. Likely says something about Columbia, SC on the barrel roll mark, no?
Click to expand...

I just bought a new 70, is the trigger no good? I havent picked mine up yet.
 
I'd like to hear about the trigger too. I've fondled them in the store, but the trigger is the only thing that I couldn't get at because of those darned trigger locks that they insist on keeping on :(
 
Out of the box, the new trigger is probably better, as far as feel and pull weight is concerned, than any previous. The machining and finish on the receiver is better than all but the best of the pre-64's. The machining and finish on the bolt is better than all but the best of the pre-64's. Only the bottom metal is crap and this does not apply to the stainless models which posess nicely shaped and fitted bottom metal.
Among the post-64 rifles, there were a number of variations with changes made to the bolt and stock in 1968, to the stock in 1974, and to the receiver in 1980 (or around there). Regards, Bill
 
I have a new super grade in 30-06. I have shot several five shot group under an inche already with factory ammo. I looking forward to playing with some reloads. The gun is fabulous and I think the trigger is too although I have never shot a pre 64. I would recomend one to any shooter!
 
The old trigger was a marvel of simplicity, you could see at a glance how it all worked, and was still easily capable of being set for weight and overtravel. It's hard to imagine how it could be messed up in the field so bad that you couldn't get it running again without tools or parts. The trouble is, execution wasn't always up to the design and there are a quite a few sloppily fitted triggers out there that weren't ever going to be good enough for the pickier shooters.

The new ones are better out of the box than half of the aftermarket triggers out there. They are the opposite of simple, hence are never going to the last word in reliability.

The old bottom metal was a separate triggerguard and floorplate, with 3 screws. The center was supposed to patch it all together and you leave it fairly loose so it doesn't bend the action out of shape. You ave to make sure everything is lined up just so are the floorplate can bind and not close properly. Not a great design.

The new one finally got rid of the center screw, but even though they must have finally realized it was time to get rid of the ole monstrousity, they didn't commit to the extent of spending the money to do it right. Seeing as they've been sleeping with Williams for years, its not like they didn't know what "done right" looks like. They had to cheap out at the end, but not any worse than so many other manufacturers did. Better than most.
 
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HKMark23 said:
Is there any way of identifying between the latter 2 (New Haven vs Columbia) ? Perhaps a code or series in the serial numbers ?

Thanx
Click to expand...

Different stamps...

New Haven rifles have ""Made In New Haven, CT. USA" stamped on the left side of the barrel. The newer FN rifle says "Made in USA BACO Inc. Morgan Utah" on the right side of the barrel.
Click to expand...
 
blargon said:
Different stamps...
Click to expand...

Thanx everyone.

If buying a new 70 there is probably little chance of being supplied an "new" rifle from "old" (New Haven) stock, which to me at least would be undesirable. The MOA trigger and "Morgan" stamp are what I'll look for.

Again, Thanx.
 
The new receivers I have looked at do not utilize the center screw but the hole was still there. In addition, the more compact design of the new trigger means there is enough bedding surface that the center screw can be of real value. As far as reliability of a trigger goes, I believe that any trigger which is not like a military Mauser trigger, gives up something in reliability. Most seem willing to accept the trade for what they consider to be a better feeling trigger.
I have always liked the center screw and, quite honestly, liked the two piece bottom metal as used on the pre-64 rifles. On later models, the floorplate and trigger guard were way too thick and heavy but the early metal was relatively light (for a steel part) and good looking.
There remains some room for improvement on the Model 70 design and it will be interesting to see what changes occur in the future and how loud the fans of the old Model 70 will howl. Regards, Bill.
 
Leeper said:
The new receivers I have looked at do not utilize the center screw but the hole was still there. In addition, the more compact design of the new trigger means there is enough bedding surface that the center screw can be of real value. As far as reliability of a trigger goes, I believe that any trigger which is not like a military Mauser trigger, gives up something in reliability. Most seem willing to accept the trade for what they consider to be a better feeling trigger.
I have always liked the center screw and, quite honestly, liked the two piece bottom metal as used on the pre-64 rifles. On later models, the floorplate and trigger guard were way too thick and heavy but the early metal was relatively light (for a steel part) and good looking.
There remains some room for improvement on the Model 70 design and it will be interesting to see what changes occur in the future and how loud the fans of the old Model 70 will howl. Regards, Bill.
Click to expand...

They probably won't scream as loud as when they quit making them all together.:)
 
HKMark23 said:
As I understand it, the 70 has seen, for lack of a better description, 3 manufacturing phases.

1) Pre 64

2) New Haven Conn. (Early 90's)

3) Columbia SC (Latest version)

Is there any way of identifying between the latter 2 (New Haven vs Columbia) ? Perhaps a code or series in the serial numbers ?

Thanx
Click to expand...

I think BUM summed it up well:
- pre64crf
- post 64 pushfeed
- post 92 crf
- then the SC FN's.

I like the Post 92's and the SC FN's. Some will comment on the lacking quality of the post 92's, I have not come across a bad one yet although I'm sure they are out there.

FME I like the post 92 crf's the best, it is a well made CRF action capable of stupid accuracy. And as some have mentioned the trigger is extremely simple and works very well. The only downside I can see on the SC FN Model 70's is the MOA trigger. It breaks cleanly but is far too heavy out of the box and appears to be needlessly complicated. They can be adjusted to about 3lbs with some work and then they are fine - but why mess with what worked so well for so long?

Anyway, they are both fine rifles and you would not go wrong with either. Look for the new ones to be stamped with BACO, Utah on the barrel and the New Haven's stamped with ...New Haven.
 
The new FN Model 70's in my unprofessional opinion are very good,...every time I go into WSS in South Edmonton I have to handle the EW 30-06 and the SG 270 WSM they have on the rack.....I could see a SG in a standard length being very nice and classy, although a bit heavy for an '06...maybe a 300 Win would fit better with the weight of the rifle....
 
M70

True the SG's are not lightweights, but my new .338WM is much more pleasant to shoot than other .338's I've had. Not crazy about the 26" tube, but all helps to tame the recoil. Really impressed with fit/finish of the latest ones.
Geoff
 
Just picked up my M70 Supergrade in .270 Win this morning. As others have stated, to me this is a great rifle in every respect, bar the trigger. I am not saying it is bad, but I have not played with it enough to form a somewhat knowledgeable opinion. Fwiw, others that I personally know that have this rifle in various other chamberings report that the trigger has been flawless and dependable so far. I purchased my rifle based primarily on recommendations by friends and by forum members here, and I am looking forward to really testing the various parts of the rifle. Being in Winnipeg in February, the weather must accommodate me in getting to the range, but I will report my findings soon........
 
I should have added to my original post that I don't thinkn that the new trigger is bad - far from it. I'm sure it will work well and be a great trigger. But the old M70 trigger was a real thing of beauty. Few parts, simple, rugged (though not M98 rugged) and reliable. There's a certain amount of wisdom to having as few parts as possible in a firearm to do the job. Making things over complicated is, IMO, asking for one of the tiny widgets to start acting up. And recalcitraant widgets always show up when you are in the field, far from your gun bench and tools. Make mine an original trigger, please.
 
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