.44-40 loads

Kilo Charlie

Kilo Charlie

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Hi everyone,

Not new to handloading, but new to the .44 WCF, aka .44-40 Winchester. What bullets and powders do people like best? As I understand it, correct bullet diameter is .427", but many rifles will shoot .429" bullets well, giving one a lot more choices.
The firearm is a Model 92 Winchester, so it's a good robust action for this cartridge. I intend to plink with it a bit, and may take it out for deer at some point. I do know the limitations of this cartridge for hunting.
 
Your .44 wcf may not have the choices you speak of, alot of these rifles will only feed with bullets that have a very short nose(O.A.L.).
 
ben hunchak said:
Your .44 wcf may not have the choices you speak of, alot of these rifles will only feed with bullets that have a very short nose(O.A.L.).
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Ahhh...I see!
I was thinking about trying Hornady's swaged lead .427" 205-grainer. I wonder if the hardness is correct for hunting. I'd love to take a deer or caribou up close with this rifle someday.
It's really powder choices I was more curious about.
 
A swaged lead bullet will be dead soft(pure lead) and meant for 800fps target type loads, however too hard a bullet will not expand on game. Most production cast bullets are BHN 25 and much too hard for expansion. Your .44 can be loaded to fairly good velocities and a medium hard cast bullet should give good killing power with expansion at moderate ranges.
 
44-40 loaded ammo for a great many years, has been loaded down, to be safe in old revolvers. I presume the loading charts are the same way. So, to get a reasonable load in your rifle, you will have to find a loading chart that is meant for rifles only, and not very light loads that are designed for the old six-shooters.
If you can't find loads for rifles, let us know.
 
I have an old 1894 Marlin in 44-40 that I load for and in the Marlin the C.O.A.L. is critical to be able to eject unfired rounds. I get my cast bullets from a friend locally and the one I use is 210.gr that looks very much like the Lyman #42798. I've been using Unique and in the Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook, the suggested starting load listed is 8grs to a maximum of 10.5grs.

Marlin189444-40.jpg
 
I was a bit bothered by the lack of .427" jacketed bullets. Then I realized I hadn't checked Remington and Winchester, both of whom sell as components the same 200-grain .426" jacketed bullets they load in their factory ammo. My rifle is still in transit; once it arrives I'll check to see whether it's a good choice for jacketed bullets.
Looking on other sites on the net, it seems that lots of people load up with 200-grain .429" bullets as well. I guess I'll slug my bore and see how she measures up.
 
Johnn, the loads you quote for the 44-40, are they for revolver or rifle?
My Lyman Cast book shows Unique for 44-40 revolver loads. They show, with a 205 grain bullet, 8 grains of Unique, 880 velocity, to a maximum of 10.7 of Unique for 1050.

For 44-40 rifle loads, my Lyman Cast book doesn't show Unique. They show, for 205 bullet, 22 grains of 2400, velocity 1550 to 26 grains of of 2400 for a velocity of 1,900!
The same amount of 4227 is nearly identical.
These are loadings are very similar to the 44 mag.
 
The model of 1892 can handle that kind of load if the rifle is in good condition, very few other guns should see those loads.
 
Those loads were designed for the 1892/92, and the newer Marlins and 92 clones should be fine too.
I'm hoping my 92 is a later production; I may just see if I can get the serial number and research it.
 
H4831 said:
Johnn, the loads you quote for the 44-40, are they for revolver or rifle?
My Lyman Cast book shows Unique for 44-40 revolver loads. They show, with a 205 grain bullet, 8 grains of Unique, 880 velocity, to a maximum of 10.7 of Unique for 1050.

For 44-40 rifle loads, my Lyman Cast book doesn't show Unique. They show, for 205 bullet, 22 grains of 2400, velocity 1550 to 26 grains of of 2400 for a velocity of 1,900!
The same amount of 4227 is nearly identical.
These are loadings are very similar to the 44 mag.
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To start off with, a couple of pages from ;)our old friend, Lyman 1st edition Cast Bullet Handbook. This first page shows the 44-40 revolver loads you spoke of, showing the charges using Unique.

Lyman1steditionrevolver.jpg


This second page, and again from our 'old friend', shows 44-40 rifle loads with no listings for Unique.

Lyman1stedition.jpg


The third page is from my copy of the latest 3rd Edition of the Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook and taken from the rifle section and showing the Unique loads I mentioned earlier.

Lyman3rdedition.jpg


And this last page, from the revolver section of the 3rd edition and also showing loads using Unique.

Lyman3rdeditionrevolver.jpg
 
H4831 said:
In other words Johnn, you show proof of what I stated in my post.
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True enough. Most of what I've put through my old Marlin using the 205gr is a moderate load of 9 grs of Unique. I have tried some a little on the stiffer side with 21.5 grs of IMR 4227. Both loads are what I've picked up from some Ken Waters posted in his book/manual Pet Loads. Do you have his book? A lot of great testing and good info.

The cast bullet he used, Lyman #42798, is the same of very similar to the ones I get from my buddy. As I recall, Waters had cast and jacketed bullets loads, in two groups and in his tests he used a 92 Winchester and a Colt New Service. I believe group I were for some of the older 'goodies' and many of his loads seem to reflect that, being lower than those published by Lyman.

I haven't tried any 2400 as I've more or less been saving it for 44 Mag and 357 Mag reloads. If I do try any in the old Marlin, I'll likely start at the lower end loads. I think the later production powder is a little hotter than it once was. Why I say that is in my 44 Mag handgun loads I used to go with Keiths 22 grs of 2400 behind his 250 gr SW, no problem. Back a few years ago I noticed case extraction started getting 'sticky' so I dropped down to 20 grs. I think when my ;)'supply' of Hercules 2400 runs out I'll change over to what I use in the 500 S&W. H110. ;)Sorry Elmer, forgive the blasphemy:p.
 
Johnn Peterson said:
True enough. Most of what I've put through my old Marlin using the 205gr is a moderate load of 9 grs of Unique. I have tried some a little on the stiffer side with 21.5 grs of IMR 4227. Both loads are what I've picked up from some Ken Waters posted in his book/manual Pet Loads. Do you have his book? A lot of great testing and good info.

The cast bullet he used, Lyman #42798, is the same of very similar to the ones I get from my buddy. As I recall, Waters had cast and jacketed bullets loads, in two groups and in his tests he used a 92 Winchester and a Colt New Service. I believe group I were for some of the older 'goodies' and many of his loads seem to reflect that, being lower than those published by Lyman.

I haven't tried any 2400 as I've more or less been saving it for 44 Mag and 357 Mag reloads. If I do try any in the old Marlin, I'll likely start at the lower end loads. I think the later production powder is a little hotter than it once was. Why I say that is in my 44 Mag handgun loads I used to go with Keiths 22 grs of 2400 behind his 250 gr SW, no problem. Back a few years ago I noticed case extraction started getting 'sticky' so I dropped down to 20 grs. I think when my ;)'supply' of Hercules 2400 runs out I'll change over to what I use in the 500 S&W. H110. ;)Sorry Elmer, forgive the blasphemy:p.
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Johnn, if you manage to get out this way, I can give you, as free, gratis, no charge, some genuine, old Hercules 2400.
I'm still working on one of those green metal kegs and I will never finish it.
All I might use it in now is the 44 mag Marlin rifle.
I've had the Marlin for a dozen or so years, shot it a fair bit with a good aperature sight, but that is not good enough to prove ammunition accuracy. Put a K3 scope on it now and am in the proccess of loading up for testing, flat base versus gc, and how they compare with jacketed. With this rifle I only load one way--full power.
After that I may see which is best, 2400/H110. Even if 2400 proves to be the powder, I have more than I can use.
 
H4831 said:
Johnn, if you manage to get out this way, I can give you, as free, gratis, no charge, some genuine, old Hercules 2400.
I'm still working on one of those green metal kegs and I will never finish it.
All I might use it in now is the 44 mag Marlin rifle.
I've had the Marlin for a dozen or so years, shot it a fair bit with a good aperature sight, but that is not good enough to prove ammunition accuracy. Put a K3 scope on it now and am in the proccess of loading up for testing, flat base versus gc, and how they compare with jacketed. With this rifle I only load one way--full power.
After that I may see which is best, 2400/H110. Even if 2400 proves to be the powder, I have more than I can use.
Click to expand...

That's very kind Bruce!! I'll have to make you a trade for something. I got my old Marlin from my cousin when he was 'thinning' things out a little and the main reason I picked it up when he offered it to me was for its sentimental value. It was the first centerfire rifle I had ever shot so basically all I put through it is on the lighter scale. Something to do a little off hand practice with. I may even go to Trail Boss loads for it. Picked up a couple boxes of Dominion/CIL factory ammo for it at gun shows in Duncan as/the picture below.

Marlin189444-402-1.jpg


Oh, by the way, I doubt you knew my cousin but you probably remember being involved in searching for his sawmill partner, Al Patchet.
 
Johnn, I'm amazed that your cousin was a partner of Al Patchet.
I'm going to go to the Off Topics and post about this.
 
These are from my old Lyman Handbook of cast bullets:

205 gr. .427 dia. plain base - 26 grs 2400 for 1900 fps
22 grs 2400 for 1550 fps
27 grs 4227 for 1850 fps
24 grs 4227 for 1600 fps
15.5 grs 4759 for 1600 fps
13.7 grs 4759 for 1300 fps

215 gr .427 gas check - exact same loads except only 15 grs 4759. Velocities are 50 fps
less across the board.

The Ideal Handbook #38 lists much the same loads except they use Lyman #42498 plain based 210 gr. bullet and the Lyman #429434 221 gr. gas check bullet.

For 200 gr. jacketed bullets - 18 grs. of 4759 for 1625 fps
29 grs of 4227 for 1890 fps
23.5 grs of 2400 for 1700 fps
 
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