RCMP letter

This is a scan of mine for a layout idea. All info is from the CFC/RCMP website and David Tomlinson's antique info on the NFA site.

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Until the Angels Fall said:
Not at all...

IMO...think of it as a non restricted gun that you can't hunt with...all the other non-restricted rules apply. And when you transport it you still should lock it up the same as a restricted.
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Right on the certificate it says it's deemed to be not a firearm, and below it someone without a license is aloud to possess it anywhere including a motor vehicle while it's loaded or easily accessible to ammunition? Thats the way I read it. Anyone anywhere can have it on them loaded and it's not a firearm so non-restricted or any firearm rules don't apply?
 
Dacton said:
So does that mean you can legally open carry a loaded antique?
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Until the Angels Fall said:
Not at all...

IMO...think of it as a non restricted gun that you can't hunt with...all the other non-restricted rules apply. And when you transport it you still should lock it up the same as a restricted.
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This. They've made it very clear that if you push the antique issue you will be at fault. This is because some of the laws they would hit you with is intent, which applies to anything you could be seen as considering to use as a weapon (ie - 2 am downtown in an alley with a baseball bat isn't illegal, but will get you charged with something.... same as poking someone in the back with a pen and telling them it's a gun will get you charged with assault with a weapon or something similar).

The antique community is polite an doesn't cause problems for anyone, so we're free to self police (IE keep things reasonable). Pushing it will result in us having to fight for what we have right now, which is almost equal freedom to the most gun friendly states... and our limitations are societal, not legal at that point.

Dacton said:
Right on the certificate it says it's deemed to be not a firearm, and below it someone without a license is aloud to possess it anywhere including a motor vehicle while it's loaded or easily accessible to ammunition? Thats the way I read it. Anyone anywhere can have it on them loaded and it's not a firearm so non-restricted or any firearm rules don't apply?
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Anywhere you can legally discharge it. No discharge laws, as one factor, apply to projectiles, including bows, and sub 500 fps bb and air guns in many cases. Keep in mind that once again there's the expectation of reasonability and common sense.
 
Dacton said:
Right on the certificate it says it's deemed to be not a firearm, and below it someone without a license is aloud to possess it anywhere including a motor vehicle while it's loaded or easily accessible to ammunition? Thats the way I read it. Anyone anywhere can have it on them loaded and it's not a firearm so non-restricted or any firearm rules don't apply?
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If your caught carrying it loaded in the city...I don't wanna be you. Being extra carful with the rules doesn't hurt anyone and will save your ass.
 
I see, well thanks for clearing that up. I didn't plan on stirring up trouble :stirthepot2: just curious!

H Wally said:
This. They've made it very clear that if you push the antique issue you will be at fault. This is because some of the laws they would hit you with is intent, which applies to anything you could be seen as considering to use as a weapon (ie - 2 am downtown in an alley with a baseball bat isn't illegal, but will get you charged with something.... same as poking someone in the back with a pen and telling them it's a gun will get you charged with assault with a weapon or something similar).

The antique community is polite an doesn't cause problems for anyone, so we're free to self police (IE keep things reasonable). Pushing it will result in us having to fight for what we have right now, which is almost equal freedom to the most gun friendly states... and our limitations are societal, not legal at that point.



Anywhere you can legally discharge it. No discharge laws, as one factor, apply to projectiles, including bows, and sub 500 fps bb and air guns in many cases. Keep in mind that once again there's the expectation of reasonability and common sense.
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It is not a "firearm" in the CFC rules and regs BUT....it is a firearm for the Criminal Code of Canada!!! Firearm...any barreled weapon which discharges a projectile capable of causing bodliy harm." The wording may not be exact but this is close. So, criminal code sections and safe storage all apply. What purpose does an antique letter serve except to register it to you with RCMP records. I thought we didn't like registry?? Dave
 
Dantforth said:
What purpose does an antique letter serve except to register it to you with RCMP records. I thought we didn't like registry?? Dave
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I'll add that I personally have a few antiques that were wrongfully regsitered in the first place. The "letter" also proves that the firearms was de-registered and taken out of the system (theoretically) when it was classified as antique.
 
This pretty much covers all the pertinent info required.
This is my cheat sheet, carried whenever I'm afield with an antique iron.
I carry it instead of an RCMP letter.
I stopped getting letters when they asked for my PAL #.
I don't care WHY they asked for it,but that they did.


Regulations Prescribing Antique Firearms

SOR/98-464

CRIMINAL CODE

His Excellency the Governor General in Council, on the recommendation of the Minister of Justice, pursuant to the definitions “prescribed”a and “antique firearm”a in subsection 84(1) and to subsection 117.15(1)a of the Criminal Code, hereby makes the annexed Regulations Prescribing Antique Firearms.

a S.C. 1995, c. 39, s. 139

Registration September 16, 1998

REGULATIONS PRESCRIBING ANTIQUE FIREARMS

PRESCRIPTION

1. The firearms listed in the schedule are antique firearms for the purposes of paragraph (b) of the definition “antique firearm” in subsection 84(1) of the Criminal Code.

COMING INTO FORCE

2. These Regulations come into force on December 1, 1998.

SOR/98-472, s. 3.

SCHEDULE

(Section 1)

BLACK POWDER REPRODUCTIONS

1. A reproduction of a flintlock, wheel-lock or matchlock firearm, other than a handgun, manufactured after 1897.

RIFLES

2. A rifle manufactured before 1898 that is capable of discharging only rim-fire cartridges, other than 22 Calibre Short, 22 Calibre Long or 22 Calibre Long Rifle cartridges.

3. A rifle manufactured before 1898 that is capable of discharging centre-fire cartridges, whether with a smooth or rifled bore, having a bore diameter of 8.3 mm or greater, measured from land to land in the case of a rifled bore, with the exception of a repeating firearm fed by any type of cartridge magazine.

SHOTGUNS

4. A shotgun manufactured before 1898 that is capable of discharging only rim-fire cartridges, other than 22 Calibre Short, 22 Calibre Long or 22 Calibre Long Rifle cartridges.

5. A shotgun manufactured before 1898 that is capable of discharging centre-fire cartridges, other than 10, 12, 16, 20, 28 or 410 gauge cartridges.

HANDGUNS

6. A handgun manufactured before 1898 that is capable of discharging only rim-fire cartridges, other than 22 Calibre Short, 22 Calibre Long or 22 Calibre Long Rifle cartridges.

7. A handgun manufactured before 1898 that is capable of discharging centre-fire cartridges, other than a handgun designed or adapted to discharge 32 Short Colt, 32 Long Colt, 32 Smith and Wesson, 32 Smith and Wesson Long, 32-20 Winchester, 38 Smith and Wesson, 38 Short Colt, 38 Long Colt, 38-40 Winchester, 44-40 Winchester, or 45 Colt cartridges.

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Under the current legislation, "any antique firearm" is not a "firearm" for the following purposes:

1. Firearms Act: None of the provisions of the Firearms Act, including those requiring registration, licences, ATTs and/or ATCs, apply to any "antique firearm."

2. CC s. 91 and 92: Possession of any "antique firearm" without a licence or registration certificate is legal.

3. CC s. 93: Possession of any "antique firearm" at any location is legal.


4. CC s. 94: Being in a motor vehicle with any "antique firearm" is legal.


5. CC s. 95: Being in possession of a loaded "antique firearm" (which is also a "restricted firearm" or a "prohibited firearm"), or one with readily accessible ammunition is legal even if the person is not the holder of any licence, registration certificate, ATT, or ATC.

6. CC s. 99: Transferring or offering to transfer any "antique firearm" is legal.

7. CC s. 100: Dealing in any type of any "antique firearm" is legal.

8. CC s. 101: Transferring any "antique firearm" is legal if the transfer apparently violates the Firearms Act.

9. CC s. 103 and 104: Importing or exporting any "antique firearm" is legal.

10. CC s. 105: Not reporting the loss or finding of any "antique firearm" is legal.

11. CC s. 106 and 107: Not reporting the destruction of any "antique firearm" is legal, and knowingly making a false report of that type to a firearms official or the police is legal.

12. CC s. 117.03: A peace officer who finds a person in possession of any "antique firearm" is not authorized to demand that the person present a licence, registration certificate, ATT, and/or ATC.

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ANTIQUE FIREARMS-storage,transport,display




14. (1) An individual may store, display or transport an antique firearm only if it is unloaded.


(2) An individual may transport an antique firearm in an unattended vehicle only if


(a) when the vehicle is equipped with a trunk or similar compartment that can be securely locked, the antique firearm is in that trunk or compartment and the trunk or compartment is securely locked; and



(b) when the vehicle is not equipped with a trunk or similar compartment that can be securely locked, the antique firearm is not visible from outside the vehicle and the vehicle, or the part that contains the antique firearm, is securely locked.



(3) An individual may transport an antique firearm that is a handgun only if it is in a locked container that is made of an opaque material and is of such strength, construction and nature that it cannot readily be broken open or into or accidentally opened during transportation.
 
I dont see the harm in applying for and getting a RCMP letter.
The Orignal poster wants it just in case he is pulled over or at a stop check or whatever just so he can say see even the RCMP gave me a letter showing the gun is antique.
will it do any good? i dont know but it sure wont hurt.
I have hunderds of applications on record but i dont have the guns anymore there all gone cept a few i collect. well maby more than a few.LOL
Go ahead get your letter if you want.
Your name is not on the letter and you can sell the gun to anyone without a transfer so how can applying for a letter tie the gun to you?
I get rid of all my buyers info soon after sale on the guns im moveing from my collection thats why even repeat buyers i have to ask them for there info again unless it was very recent.

The other way to go is find out if the gun has and antique frt # and keep that on file.
some guns do some dont depending when there made.
 
dingus said:
I dont see the harm in applying for and getting a RCMP letter.
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I didn't either...in fact I got one for every iron...til they asked for my PAL#

dingus said:
Your name is not on the letter and you can sell the gun to anyone without a transfer so how can applying for a letter tie the gun to you?
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Why then would they ask for your PAL# ?


I know,I've heard the "so they'll know where to send it" garbage.
They can send it to the hotmail address provided :p :stirthepot2: :D

to each his own,and if you live in an area that you are likely to be stopped and raked over the coals then by all means,acquire as much hard proof as you can that you are in compliance with all laws and regulations...it's why I posted my carry paper for y'all ;)
 
I've never tried it, but since they ask for a PAL, what would happen if you said your name was Steve Wiggins of no fixed address and you'd like the PDF copy sent to your email?

My knee jerk reaction would be they'd say no, or just never follow through. I don't know the legality of giving a false name either... though I don't believe they need to know your name anyways...
 
well i dont have a PAL and i get letters all the time.
i have a POL # tho.
I dont think they can process you a letter in this system without a PAL or POL #
theses are firearms Licences i guess that if you want a letter from the rcmp they want to see if you have a licence of some kind before they give out the letters even tho you dont need a licence to own one.
i dont know anyone without some form of fireams licence tho im sure theres lots out there.

The way its set up is suspicious i admit that, but im in it to deep to worry myself as ive goten lotsa letters for guns i dont even have,, favors for people or guns ive sold ect.
i can see why some guys prefer to not have the letters tho.
haveing a copy of the regs and some proof your gun is a perscribed antique should sufice.
i just find most guys buying a antique for the frist time want a rcmp letter so they know its been oked by the rcmp as a perscribed antique at least.
then they know they dont have to worry about atts and permits and transfers ect ect.
 
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