you need to take the SOME bookS with a MAJOR grain of SALT- a LOT of those loads have been 'LAWYERIZED" in the top end so that it doesn't unlock the bolt in some guns, and only pushes the bolt back a bit in others- not enough to engage the sear; case in point, the 9mm luger , using a 115, starts off at 4.2 or so and ends up at 4.8 or 9- the OLD 11 says 5 of 231- or 5.2- that's alright for pistols,but you do that with a c/a and you end up with a " burp" gun or doubling- thing is, the bolt isn't being pushed back far enough to engage the sear-but enough to extract and strip a round from the magazine