Shooting .303 British

The .270 is a great hunting cartridge, you'll get no argument from me, but rifle cartridges from 6.5 mm on up that spit out copper cup, lead core bullets at a modest 2300 have effectively killed game across the planet since the days of the British Empire. If the 150 gr slug out of a milsurp Lee Enfield clocks only 2500 fps, it is still more than enough for deer sized game. If the factory ammo proves to be a limitation though, 45 grs of 4895 will bring you to within spitting distance of 2700 without producing seam bursting pressure. Either way, the velocity is sufficient for a 200 yard zero to make sense, allowing a drop of less than a foot at 300.

As for what kills game, Dogleg got it right a while back when the subject came up. He maintains daylight kills game! When daylight enters the chest cavity, the animals dies.
 
Boomer said:
The .270 is a great hunting cartridge, you'll get no argument from me, but rifle cartridges from 6.5 mm on up that spit out copper cup, lead core bullets at a modest 2300 have effectively killed game across the planet since the days of the British Empire. If the 150 gr slug out of a milsurp Lee Enfield clocks only 2500 fps, it is still more than enough for deer sized game. If the factory ammo proves to be a limitation though, 45 grs of 4895 will bring you to within spitting distance of 2700 without producing seam bursting pressure. Either way, the velocity is sufficient for a 200 yard zero to make sense, allowing a drop of less than a foot at 300.

As for what kills game, Dogleg got it right a while back when the subject came up. He maintains daylight kills game! When daylight enters the chest cavity, the animals dies.
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LOL... this is absolutely correct on kills.

I always like to have them piled up as near to the spot they were standing when the daylight entered however, 'cause tracking wounded game that may cover considerable distance with little or no sign, is not something I am much skilled in.

Boomer have you found factory ballistics and actual real rifle velocities to be as different has what I have fired, and if so, do the argument I put forward hold any water has to why this is so?
 
I know that many of the older military cartridges were soft loaded by North American arms companies, which is unfortunate as rounds like the 7X57 are closer to the .280 Remington than some would care to admit and the .303 really has the same velocity potential as the .308. I do recall there was some 150 gr .303 Brit stuff I used when I was a kid that came in a plain white box had the velocity of 2700 printed on the box and that it was a bit cheaper than the glossy box CIL stuff, but I don't recall now if it was a CIL product or if it was Gevelot which was available at the time. I believe Gevelot was loaded a bit hotter than our stuff, as was the South African Musgrave ammo which started to show up some years later.

I haven't seen anything but 180 gr .303 factory loads over the last few years, mostly the stuff the Ranger's are issued, they only stopped being issued FMJ ammo in the early '90s. To tell you the truth I've never put any across the screens, but now I'm interested. As a matter of fact I've got a few rounds of 180 gr Winchester kicking around as well as a box of the old FMJ stuff and a customer's beat up Jungle Carbine waiting to get picked up, although I'd sooner get the velocity from a full length barrel.

With respect to rifle ammo I usually just shoot handloads, but I did some testing with some factory Federal blue box .30/06 after shooting my mouth off on here that it wasn't much good. The velocity from 180 grs loads averaged 2660 and the extreme spread was so tight I didn't believe it and shot it again, it was about 10 fps. Just to embarrass me a bit more I shot several MOA 300 yard groups with it. That stuff is uniform as hell, too bad the brass is so soft and the primer pockets expand so fast.
 
Thats a respectable velocity from those Federal, as I recall alot of 308WIN and .30-06 factory loads chronying near identical(+20 maybe) on same bullet, and I too will gather up what .303 factory is kicking around here and chrony it to see if those low velocities versus advertised, is the same for Factory ammo today.
I'll have a 3.25" lenght advantage over that PH sporter, but my No4 and it had new or like new barrels, but we will take that into consideration for velocity correction.

PS... you know I forgot how fast those Federal brass primer pockets would lossen up. IIRC old Imperial brass seemed the hardest/brittlest, in .308WIN anyway.
 
mackles said:
How effective?
The 303 is enough gun for Deer, Moose, Elk, Black Bear, as well as basically any North American big game animal (although I'd most likely not use one for a Grizzly), and nazi's.
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A 303 British is OK for grizzly.
This is a quote from an old time trapper who had spent a lifetime in the mountains and bush of northern BC and the first of the old bushmen I talked to about grizzlies. This era of trappers and prospectors had lived for a hundred years in the wilderness, trading with the trading posts, until their era came to an end in the 1950s. I considered them the real experts on rifles and calibres for game. Another one told me that 215 grain bullets were best.
 
If I were going to go hunting grizzly, I would use my Enfield and some of my precious supply of 215gr. KKSP.

I understand that if a grizzly is hunting you, or attacking, a bigger, more powerful cartridge is much to be desired to stop him, but when you choose to go hunting them, you should be good enough to take him with a .303, .308, .30-06, and understand and accept that things can go wrong. I mean, it's the wilderness, that could include falling off a cliff. If it was all about safe and certain outcomes, you'd raise them in captivity and kill them with a captive bolt when they stuck their head in a feeder.
 
Prvi Partizan also known as PPU in 180 gr is the bomb! Hits like the hammer of Thor! I think the European loaded ammo is loaded a little hotter. My Father-in-law swears by it. His freezer is full ;)
 
H4831 said:
A 303 British is OK for grizzly.
This is a quote from an old time trapper who had spent a lifetime in the mountains and bush of northern BC and the first of the old bushmen I talked to about grizzlies. This era of trappers and prospectors had lived for a hundred years in the wilderness, trading with the trading posts, until their era came to an end in the 1950s. I considered them the real experts on rifles and calibres for game. Another one told me that 215 grain bullets were best.
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Yep, 215gn bullets are the best for that application. Just try to get some in a commercial load that didn't come from Australia and you didn't pay so much for them that you don't want to shoot them. Even the bullts are too expensive that way. I am trying to convince Steve Redgewell to move up to a 215gn, now that he has pretty much perfected his 200gn (I really like how that one shoots).
 
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